24 replies to this topic

[DeathjesterUK]

As the title suggests, you still haven't given details about how community warfare will function and a lot of us need to know. With the latest debacle that is the golden mechs, you have got to start giving more details or you, PGI, are going to start losing players rapidly. So, here are some thoughts on what I feel Community Warfare is going to be and questions that need clarifying.

The first point that I want to address is how community warfare will function. From what I have seen so far, all community warfare is going to be is more dropping into matches with the points a faction earns as a whole, determining how much territory is controlled. This is NOT what we want, I can tell you that from the start. What we want is this:

• We want a full, dynamic, innersphere map that changes as territory is lost and gained. We want individual planets that can be attacked and conquered by other houses. We want these planets to have things like HPGs and mech factories and bases that serve a function in the house they belong too. For example, if a planet with an AS7 factory is captured, the faction it used to belong too should see that the price of buying a AS7 goes up, or become unavailable as there are no more factories.
  
• Each company/corp/guild/whatever, has its own mech garage, c-bill account, parts garage, jumpships, dropships. In other words, stuff for random drops has no effect on what happens in community warfare and you are limited to the mechs and resources that are available to your company and only your company. If you lose a mech, its gone for good. if your mech is damaged in a fight, in needs repair. Logistics like these are what we want.
  
• Logistics and planning. We want to be able to plan out our own military campaigns, deciding what planets to attack, what to attack with, when to attack, how long it will take get there, how many dropships to use, who to send, etc, etc.

So far, what you have shown us is nothing like what we want to see. If you do not get Community warfare right, This game will fail. But, if you get it right, you could, COULD have a game that rivals EVE Online for sheer scope and depth.

So the question really is this:

Are the above features going to be a part of Community Warfare? If not, why are simple Java games able to have these features like MekWars...and you are not able to do it? And why was a game like 3025 able to have something close, but you cant?

Id like to know what you all think about the direction that PGI and MWO is taking so feel free to post.

Edited by DeathjesterUK, 15 December 2013 - 12:08 PM.

[Timbar]

This is something I'd like to hear the answer off.

[Iqfish]

Never. Never ever, sorry but this kind of persitence wont be here in MWO. Maybe Star Citizen, but that game is long away from being alpha, so...

PGI has proven many times that they are not even capable of balancing single weapon systems, without needing months of time, so do you really think that they will pull of this giant project?

They have fancy plans and visions, but just take a look at UI 2. Yes it looks good and so on but its terrible organized and about 1 year late.


I just realized how much i turned into a pessimist. Well, thank you Piranha games...

Edited by IqfishLP, 15 December 2013 - 12:00 PM.

[DeathjesterUK]

IqfishLP, on 15 December 2013 - 11:59 AM, said:

Never. Never ever, sorry but this kind of persitence wont be here in MWO. Maybe Star Citizen, but that game is long away from being alpha, so...

PGI has proven many times that they are not even capable of balancing single weapon systems, without needing months of time, so do you really think that they will pull of this giant project?

They have fancy plans and visions, but just take a look at UI 2. Yes it looks good and so on but its terrible organized and about 1 year late.


I just realized how much i turned into a pessimist. Well, thank you Piranha games...

I know. I know that peoples opinions of PGI are in the toilet at the moment, but, Im still curious as to what they wanted it to be. And if they cant deliver what we want, which I believe I got close to in my post, then they really are incompetent. Java games have this, open source Java games like this!!

[Iqfish]

You can see what they are planning here

KLICK

But i guess, this will be in a far future...

[DeathjesterUK]

IqfishLP, on 15 December 2013 - 12:09 PM, said:

You can see what they are planning here

KLICK

But i guess, this will be in a far future...

Doesnt answer many questions outside of unit organization. It doesnt address the capturing of planets, contracts are barely touched upon. Its basically a lot of talking while answering very few questions.

[Iqfish]

Thats everything we know. If you want to see more, watch the presentation on the launchevent here:

[Bront]

DeathjesterUK, on 15 December 2013 - 11:53 AM, said:

• Each company/corp/guild/whatever, has its own mech garage, c-bill account, parts garage, jumpships, dropships. In other words, stuff for random drops has no effect on what happens in community warfare and you are limited to the mechs and resources that are available to your company and only your company. If you lose a mech, its gone for good. if your mech is damaged in a fight, in needs repair. Logistics like these are what we want.

Ugh, I want no part of that. Some level of persistance maybe, but if my mech gets blown up it's gone? No. That's the day I leave MWO.

I like the idea of fluctuating mech prices, production centers, and stuff like that, but there's still a problem of how difficult it will be to change sides, how are house units going to be handled differently than merc units, and beyond that, we now have the clans to deal with. They need to find a way to make it fun and offer objectives while not punishing casual players too much (like mech destruction or making a mech unattainable).

[DeathjesterUK]

Bront, on 15 December 2013 - 12:22 PM, said:

Ugh, I want no part of that. Some level of persistance maybe, but if my mech gets blown up it's gone? No. That's the day I leave MWO.

I like the idea of fluctuating mech prices, production centers, and stuff like that, but there's still a problem of how difficult it will be to change sides, how are house units going to be handled differently than merc units, and beyond that, we now have the clans to deal with. They need to find a way to make it fun and offer objectives while not punishing casual players too much (like mech destruction or making a mech unattainable).

You are misunderstanding. The mechs you have now, would not be used in community warfare. The mechs you have in community warfare would be bought using the units c-bill account and assigned per mission by whoever organizes missions. Along with parts, weapons, ammo, etc.

[Sandpit]

This is my biggest complaint. PGI has this "hush hush I know something you don't know" mentality. Why the hell would I invest another 200+ dollars into a game when I have no idea what's going to happen? You want my money, start implementing features and start telling me just what I'm buying instead of "we planned to do this but that was our position at the time, we're now going to do something else but thanks for your money"

[Fabe]

DeathjesterUK, on 15 December 2013 - 12:30 PM, said:

You are misunderstanding. The mechs you have now, would not be used in community warfare. The mechs you have in community warfare would be bought using the units c-bill account and assigned per mission by whoever organizes missions. Along with parts, weapons, ammo, etc.

So in CW we don't own our mechs? No, in the battletech/mechwarior universe most mechwarriors owned their mechs that should not change in CW. Also I say no to 'prema-death" ,repair/rearm maybe but we should not lose our stuff after a bad game. It'll be too easy to fall behind permanently after a sting of loses.

[Icould]

OP, those recommendations sound like an awesome game. However, you need to realize PGI/IGP are not the ones that will be able to give that to us. If you still don't believe this, just review the history of promises and failures of PGI/IGP about MWO.If you must, play this game for the arcade style shooter that it is. Don't give them another penny because the only way we will get the MechWarrior game we want is when Microsoft licenses the IP to a better developer team. This cannot happen as long as PGI/IGP still has idiots giving them money--they will release the IP as soon as the money stops.

[Bront]

DeathjesterUK, on 15 December 2013 - 12:30 PM, said:

You are misunderstanding. The mechs you have now, would not be used in community warfare. The mechs you have in community warfare would be bought using the units c-bill account and assigned per mission by whoever organizes missions. Along with parts, weapons, ammo, etc.

Ok, that's even worse. I don't want 2 different accounts effectively, and I don't want to effectively have to start again in CW. By doing that, you're taking away stuff I paid money for and saying I can't use it in game (some of which it was specfificly designed to augment), and that's a great way to drive away customers.

[Boozlebean]

I honestly think that when CW is implemented that everyone should get a full MC refunds for all hero 'mechs, camo specs, and whatever else they paid for, and everything takes place within the CW universe. There's nothing CW about a skeleton paintjob unless you're in Stone's Lament of the Republic of the Sphere! Seriously! Hero 'mechs are bull, too. This game is about roleplaying as a soldier, not as a specific famous soldier.

[Nick Makiaveli]

Boozlebean, on 15 December 2013 - 01:33 PM, said:

I honestly think that when CW is implemented that everyone should get a full MC refunds for all hero 'mechs, camo specs, and whatever else they paid for, and everything takes place within the CW universe. There's nothing CW about a skeleton paintjob unless you're in Stone's Lament of the Republic of the Sphere! Seriously! Hero 'mechs are bull, too. This game is about roleplaying as a soldier, not as a specific famous soldier.

You mean it used to be. Remember, we are "on a island" and thus "not the target demographic". They are going for the larger "lol wutz rp" crowd, figuring they will spend more than us old fogies.

I think the CW bit is going to be nothing more than bragging rights and maybe a discount if you happen to see the mech you want "on sale" because you have good rep with House X and they captured Planet Y.

[Boozlebean]

Dude, I'm not an old fogey, I'm 20 years old and Mechwarrior 3 was my first Mechwarrior game. I've never played the tabletop and I probably never will, and I play Borderlands 2 way more than I play MWO. Now, with all that in mind, consider how off-putting I find a game that doesn't stay true to the universe it's set in. I am, in your eyes, in the "lol wutz rp" crowd, and I feel like CW is going to be awful. BT deserves far more respect than this game is giving, and I don't know anyone who plays this game or likes Battletech who doesn't feel the same way. I'm just so mad about the direction this is taking.

[luxebo]

I think what should be done is have one separate instant action gamemode for us casuals that doesn't affect the universe at all (meaning whatever goes, random scenarios, similar to now). And there should be CW as a main gamemode, with faction vs faction, mercs, lone wolves, etc. Losing mechs permanently is not a thing that I want to take part of at all. What happens if one lost one of those $500 golden mechs?

[Sandpit]

luxebo, on 15 December 2013 - 05:30 PM, said:

I think what should be done is have one separate instant action gamemode for us casuals that doesn't affect the universe at all (meaning whatever goes, random scenarios, similar to now). And there should be CW as a main gamemode, with faction vs faction, mercs, lone wolves, etc. Losing mechs permanently is not a thing that I want to take part of at all. What happens if one lost one of those $500 golden mechs?

Who said anything about losing mechs permanently? And by "who said" I mean who even implied anything like that from the dev team, not forum theory crafters

[Zeusus]

If you want losses to hurt a little without perma-loss of a mech maybe just take a page from Warthunder. Mechs when lost in battle take some time to repair, you can't just drop right away in it again. Bigger mechs take longer. Owning more factories = faster repair due to ease of acquiring parts.

Obviously you can just go straight into random non-CW matches after that (so if you only have 1 mech and you really really want to keep playing you aren't forced to walk away from the game for a few hours).

[luxebo]

Sandpit, on 15 December 2013 - 05:39 PM, said:

Who said anything about losing mechs permanently? And by "who said" I mean who even implied anything like that from the dev team, not forum theory crafters

Nobody on the official dev's team, I'm referring to the OP's post. PGI will soon ™ get to anything like that. Which means never.

Edited by luxebo, 16 December 2013 - 11:10 AM.