213 replies to this topic

[Tom Sawyer]

I agree with Roland on this one. LRM's should be fire and forget weapons. All the jokes about lostech aside we are taking about GUIDED missiles in the era of fusion powered mechs.

Even if the concept of a computer guided rocket had been forgotten SOMEONE would have reinvented it.

You get your lock, fire and then you move and jink and dodge so that you can survive to do it some more. IF a fellow mech down range has your target locked also then it just a bonus.

[Ph30nix]

gonna have to take a stroll in an LRM90 A1 later i guess

[Zolaz]

Well, you see some maps are good for LRMs and you will put up good numbers. Some maps are bad for LRMs and you will put up horrible numbers. Maps that favor LRMs like Alpine or Caustic will give you some good numbers. Maps like River City, Frozen City and Forest Colony if the fights take place in the buildings makes it harder for good damage with LRMs.

If your LRM boat sits behind an Assault or Heavy and shooting at their targets you will get good numbers. If you have line of sight on your targets you will get good numbers if you arent being targeted. Just hope that the opposing team doesnt have ECM superiority or everyone isnt packing a Radar Deprivation module. Though those can be countered with an AUV and to a limited degree NARC.

Believe it or not, that is harder than it sounds. If the random factors align and the PUG gods are smiling on you, you do well. If the MM gives you a bunch of subpar and (C) mechs you know you are going to have a rough game. To well consistently with any mech and loadout requires you to know what you are doing.

[WarHippy]

Alexandrix, on 16 July 2014 - 08:57 AM, said:

Wanna make LRM's not such a load of crap? (for both sides)

-Assuming the above two are done,remove the need to maintain lock after the missiles are fired.I think that'd be a fair trade.Also,a slight speed increase might be in order.

In no universe real or imagined that is populated by rational beings does this make up for them being turned to crap after your first two ridiculous changes.

Edited by WarHippy, 16 July 2014 - 10:25 AM.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

The tears are amazing. So if a Clan mech has LRMs....you take damage under 180m...and it scales from 0 to 100%...and that is a big deal?

I mean come on, it's not even worth the heat to fire for the most part.

And if you are toe to toe with an LRM mech...and you still can't win?...well that's just another tip that you are a bad.

[Biaxialrain]

No Nicholas, it's not a big deal, can I do the same with an IS mech?

Well, there you go.

[Belorion]

If you treat LRM's as a no skill weapon you are doing it wrong, you also aren't as competitive as you think you are.

[Bobzilla]

They should move way faster and do way less damage or way faster and less damage and no cockpit effects.


LRMs are either OP or useless. Taking every LRM bonus you can in a LRM boat and it will probably do very little if the opposing team has appropriate counters, if the opposing team has no counters they become OP (i'm leaving tactics out because each has their own counter).

Need to make them more reliable but less effective or they are always going to be debated as both OP and useless. Both are true depending on the situation.

[Mcgral18]

Demoncard, on 16 July 2014 - 09:07 AM, said:

For clarity, this is what I disagree with. AMS is too easily overwhelmed to be considered an LRM deterrent. I can't remember exactly how many AMS it takes to completely counter an LRM boat, but it's disproportionately more than it should be.

Of course, nothing beats getting to cover, AMS is only a supplement, kill the catapult, etc etc. That wasn't supposed to read as sarcasm.

Biaxialrain, on 16 July 2014 - 10:26 AM, said:

No Nicholas, it's not a big deal, can I do the same with an IS mech?

Well, there you go.

A cLRM30 barrage will be completely destroyed by a single Dual AMS mech, no matter the range.

I don't believe a single missile broke through, even at 150M.


So, IS Missiles have a BIG advantage there, but AMS still destroys some of them.



I don't suppose you bring AMS?

Edited by Mcgral18, 16 July 2014 - 10:49 AM.

[Demoncard]

Mcgral18, on 16 July 2014 - 10:47 AM, said:

A cLRM30 barrage will be completely destroyed by a single Dual AMS mech, no matter the range.

Surely 'gently softening stream' would be more appropriate than barrage when talking about Clan LRMs? But yeah.

A single AMS will take out a handful of IS missiles, but as I said before, it quickly gets overwhelmed to the point of redundancy. Someone (Bishop Steiner, maybe?) posted numbers regarding AMS being easy to overwhelm somewhere, but I really don't want to have to sift through the refuse of general discussion to find those figures.

I rarely run dual AMS mechs. As in, the variants themselves. I haven't touched my Jester don't make that joke in a while.

Edited by Demoncard, 16 July 2014 - 11:11 AM.

[Lyoto Machida]

Fine...delete my posts, mods but at least move this masterpiece to K-town.

[Roger That]

Your daughter must have been in a good sibko ; )

[ATM87]

wait... we LRM now? because I've seen no increase in the number of people using them.

Honestly, i'm more annoyed by the shared C3 network that all mechs seem to have that allows you to target enemy mechs out of your line of sight. maybe if they removed that people wouldn't have such a problem with lrms.

[topgun505]

This. That one change would likely silence nearly all criticism of LRMs.

ATM87, on 16 July 2014 - 11:28 AM, said:

wait... we LRM now? because I've seen no increase in the number of people using them.

Honestly, i'm more annoyed by the shared C3 network that all mechs seem to have that allows you to target enemy mechs out of your line of sight. maybe if they removed that people wouldn't have such a problem with lrms.

[Karamarka]

Turist0AT, on 16 July 2014 - 02:16 AM, said:

so what? LRMs serve their purpose they dont need to be SKILLZ weapon.


+ It requires teamwork to make them effective.

Just a quick question from a neutral, how do they require teamwork? Serious question. You are guaranteed locks in a 12v12....... the game makes you auto lock most of the time (Teammates)...... dont get your bs defence

[Lyoto Machida]

Scrotacus 42, on 16 July 2014 - 03:18 AM, said:

People can scoff all they want, but the OP is right. I'm trying my best to learn to accept the lrms as they certainly aren't going anywhere but I tell ya nothing ruins a match faster than 3 missile boats hitting you. And yes, its stupidly easy to do it yourself. I'm a terrible pilot (K/D ratio of 1.02), I'm on a team that on a good day, can take out 1-2 Steel Jaguars in a 12 man match. I can't even drive a car in real life because my vision is ****. But I can get in a mobile missile platform and easily do over 500 damage with fairly limited ammo supplies (say 5 tons). Competitive players don't get it because they don't see them where they're at and they are on teams that communicate extremely well. But in pugs with no voice chat, or even in a small group where you have to blob with the pugs its a different story.

So stop playing in PUGs so you don't have to deal with LRMs...group up and get killed by FLD weapons instead.

Problem solved.

[Bilbo]

Karamarka, on 16 July 2014 - 11:36 AM, said:

Just a quick question from a neutral, how do they require teamwork? Serious question. You are guaranteed locks in a 12v12....... the game makes you auto lock most of the time (Teammates)...... dont get your bs defence

Target acquisition is almost never a problem. Having someone actually hold that target long enough for the missiles to arrive is another thing entirely and usually requires a dedicated spotter, UAV, narc, or a combination of all those things. Proper positioning can mitigate this because you will be able to obtain your own locks, though you will be exposing yourself.

[Lootee]

Lyoto Machida, on 16 July 2014 - 11:37 AM, said:

So stop playing in PUGs so you don't have to deal with LRMs...group up and get killed by FLD weapons instead.

Problem solved.

You forgot the 12 airstrikes and 12 artillery barrages, one after another as soon as the cooldown is up.

[Karamarka]

Bilbo, on 16 July 2014 - 11:41 AM, said:

Target acquisition is almost never a problem. Having someone actually hold that target long enough for the missiles to arrive is another thing entirely and usually requires a dedicated spotter, UAV, narc, or a combination of all those things. Proper positioning can mitigate this because you will be able to obtain your own locks, though you will be exposing yourself.

Sounds like a joke to me.

As long as someone is shooting the lock is stable, and you don't need a full lock for the missiles to track. Lock, shoot and even if they lose lock they will still hit most of the time, even better with decay module.

SRS i play lurm warhawk and stormcrow, easiest games i've ever played. When i play NARC quickdraw it's even easier for my team (12-1) stomp fests.

Most maps the ENEMY has to come out in the open, it's not like everyone is in a trench 99% of the game.
UAV and TAG is just a bonus, combined with the fact TAG and Artemis are both line of sight anyway (You don't get either of their bonus without LoS).

Edited by Karamarka, 16 July 2014 - 11:48 AM.

[Bilbo]

Karamarka, on 16 July 2014 - 11:47 AM, said:

Sounds like a joke to me.

As long as someone is shooting the lock is stable, and you don't need a full lock for the missiles to track. Lock, shoot and even if they lose lock they will still hit most of the time, even better with decay module.

SRS i play lurm warhawk and stormcrow, easiest games i've ever played. When i play NARC quickdraw it's even easier for my team (12-1) stomp fests.

Most maps the ENEMY has to come out in the open, it's not like everyone is in a trench 99% of the game.
UAV and TAG is just a bonus, combined with the fact TAG and Artemis are both line of sight anyway (You don't get either of their bonus without LoS).

If they are constantly shooting you are correct. The tendency, however, is for shoot and hide in some form or another.