524 replies to this topic

[BLOOD WOLF]

So I just came off of a thread and I cant get my head around it. I need objection here to be able to look at this clearly.

So There has been bitterness about MWO because the key element of CW which was supposed to be within 90 days of launch was not here. Yea, that is something to have a complaint about. the core of the game one can say that is supposed to bring complexity to the game and immerse us in the battletech universe. Well okay 90 days within launch, the game launched October and, well we did not get CW. Instead we got a road map. A road map leading to CW which was looking like the end of the year, not 90 days.

Was it a lie, well you have to look at the context, and I doubt they can see into the future. A lie is meaning to deceive and I don't really think that was their goal. What would the have to gain from lying. you got to be stupid to intentionally lie to people who are gonna pay for your game. Players who put time and energy into this game and we are the reason it grows. Yea they make it but a game is nothing without people to play it.

Cont. After they set the State of the IS, which was the roadmap for the year. Which did not include CW in 90 days. That is when Some of the player base blew up. I can not say for sure that everyone blew up but some did and some didn't. At the time though, being made that they pushed it back was well within reason. I mean before they launched all the hype was about CW, every interview mentioned CW+90 or soon. That was supposed to be the pillar of MWO. the main attraction to the game. At the start of the roadmap skepticism was commonplace as people did not know what to expect. I would like to mention during the time, it had not been too long since the game game out, barely a year and most of that was CB and then OB.

So point is I can see how people could maintain their air of dismay, throughout 2013. For many the setback as a heinous acts only reserved for the lowest of criminals.........maybe not that harsh but some of the things I read that comes close. Some people are putting PGI to the level of well, I think you know.

The problem I have Is I can only relate to the feeling up until Feb 4 2014. I have told myself If they can hit this date then I will begin to look at how I assess and judge the game. mind you I never had strong feelings of distrust to begin with but I was also hurt a little. I love the MWO franchise the same as anyone else and It was disappointing. Like I said after they hit that date I eased up. I keep my word even when I tell myself, and since they hit the date I have had strong confidence in their ability to roll things out to say. Then they hit march dates, then they hit April dates,then they hit may(I don't think anything important was in may), then the BIG JUNE CLAN RELEASED. I love the Clans so I gave them cool points for that. Point is In 2014 they hit every date they set, they have not missed any dates up to date and they have been putting out patches that really helped the game. So what makes you think they wont hit the rest of the year? are you going to go off 1 missed date of 2013 or are you going to judge them off this year. How can you keep bringing up the missed dates but neglect the dates they hit? where is the logic in that. I understand these are the interwebz and not everybody is just but come on.

At least, , give them another chance from 2014. If you are still here there is no excuse why you can not reset your clocks and treat this year as the year for CW. What is there to gain from living in the past. what is their to gain from being bitter and cynical. Once again why are you still here if not believing the game is moving forward. Stop Letting your Ego get in the way of what the game is really heading towards.

Oh yea, no personally attacks, I take i upon myself to be righteous about it and defend my character.

[Training Instructor]

Paul still works there. That's a great reason to be bitter cynical.

[Vassago Rain]

I don't know, bro.

Lying at the launch event to generate more sales could qualify, but when you're dealing with gold reasoning, obviously lies are meaningless.

[El Bandito]

Training Instructor, on 02 August 2014 - 11:10 PM, said:

Paul still works there. That's a great reason to be bitter cynical.

This sums it up nicely.

[BLOOD WOLF]

El Bandito, on 02 August 2014 - 11:22 PM, said:

This sums it up nicely.

Its not easy balancing a game. I have a good number of friends who are modders. I still am sour that My CIS battleship was nerfed. It was a beast and still is but it doesn't have the firepower it needs or should have(starwars empire at war)

As a matter of fact game balance is one of the hardest things to do. Not only that nerfing something is never easy and that is why Paul catches a lot of flak. Nobody loves their uber strong builds/mechs being nerfed.

Edited by BLOOD WOLF, 02 August 2014 - 11:27 PM.

[Kilo 40]

I think it's pretty obvious that the whole UI1.5 thing was the major road block, and it's why they've been able to hit their dates much more reliably since the 2.0 patch.

I don't really blame them for their early screw up and bad communications. They were a company that was used to designing games like every other company designs games. behind closed doors. The could design X, scrap it, reimplement it, and scrap it again. all with out hearing a whisper about it.

along comes MWO, and suddenly they have an audience hanging on their every word, and PGI has zero experience communicating with it's fans/community. plans become set in stone in the eyes of the community. ideas not implemented become lies. technical issues become incompetence. add to that the need to have a revenue stream that doesn't rely on steam sales or brick and mortar stores.

communications have been much better since that "state of the inner sphere" post back in December. dates have been made. promises kept. screw ups? sure, but name a game that hasn't had any.

PGI appears to have grown up.

[mike29tw]

Consider they didn't even begin coding CW even after launch is enough for me to call deception on PGI.

That, and ECM, 3PV, C-bill nerf, modules, hover jets......

*edit - and ghost heat!! Can't believe I left that out.

Edited by mike29tw, 02 August 2014 - 11:42 PM.

[NextGame]

On what planet does making community warfare an extra year late somehow make it better?

[El Bandito]

BLOOD WOLF, on 02 August 2014 - 11:24 PM, said:

Its not easy balancing a game. I have a good number of friends who are modders. I still am sour that My CIS battleship was nerfed. It was a beast and still is but it doesn't have the firepower it needs or should have(starwars empire at war) As a matter of fact game balance is one of the hardest things to do. Not only that nerfing something is never easy and that is why Paul catches a lot of flak. Nobody loves their uber strong builds/mechs being nerfed.

It has virtually nothing to do with mech nerfs. Some of the biggest sins Paul committed includes current GECM, 3PV, and Ghost Heat, for example. Then there is mech scaling, pulse family, flamers, certain Clan techs...

As for being a modder, I was a modder for Medieval 2: Total War. I know first hand how difficult it is to balance 500 different units. Yet it was possible. You can consider this an empty brag, but I can balance pulse family, flamers, and GECM/LRM fiasco in a day--admittedly the latter will need extensive testing.

Edited by El Bandito, 02 August 2014 - 11:41 PM.

[BLOOD WOLF]

NextGame, on 02 August 2014 - 11:29 PM, said:

On what planet does making community warfare an extra year late somehow make it better?

so, they should not make it? 1 year is not that bad. and technically at this point is is going to be 4 months, but better late than never right? Or should they just stop on CW and spend a whole year doing maps and who knows what else. That sounds like a fine idea, a map rush.

[Mcgral18]

El Bandito, on 02 August 2014 - 11:33 PM, said:

It has virtually nothing to do with mech nerfs. Some of the biggest sins Paul committed includes current GECM, 3PV, and Ghost Heat, for example. Then there is mech scaling, pulse family, flamers, certain Clan techs...

As for being a modder, I was a modder for Medieval 2: Total War. I know first hand how difficult it is to balance 500 different units. Yet it was possible.

*Magic Jesus Box

[meteorol]

Being bitter for the sake of being bitter is always a reason for some guys.
I'm rather relaxed right now. Has PGI screwed quite a few things? Sure. Will i run around screaming they lied about everything and stole my money? Nope. I'm a passionate videogamer, and i have seen way larger companies with a way better reputation failing way harder than pgi did.

This is a videogame in development. I don't take everything devs say for granted in any videogame because if you do so, you are bound to get dissapointed. Talking about lying to the customer, i have seen features being announced on the backside of a videogame case that actually weren't in the game. And that was a finished product.

[Vassago Rain]

El Bandito, on 02 August 2014 - 11:33 PM, said:

It has virtually nothing to do with mech nerfs. Some of the biggest sins Paul committed includes current GECM, 3PV, and Ghost Heat, for example. Then there is mech scaling, pulse family, flamers, certain Clan techs...

As for being a modder, I was a modder for Medieval 2: Total War. I know first hand how difficult it is to balance 500 different units. Yet it was possible. You can consider this an empty brag, but I can balance pulse family, flamers, and GECM/LRM fiasco in a day

I believe ECM is another dev's pet project. You can blame Paul for a lot of things, but ECM isn't something he got to dictate.

[BLOOD WOLF]

El Bandito, on 02 August 2014 - 11:33 PM, said:

It has virtually nothing to do with mech nerfs. Some of the biggest sins Paul committed includes current GECM, 3PV, and Ghost Heat, for example. Then there is mech scaling, pulse family, flamers, certain Clan techs...

As for being a modder, I was a modder for Medieval 2: Total War. I know first hand how difficult it is to balance 500 different units. Yet it was possible.

those are the only three I ever hear, to name a few is right, there are only a few. 3pv was going in the game whether Paul liked it or not, he could only makes sure i did not break the game. Which it didnt, Its hardly used, and a good scout gets your team that ifno.

As for ghost heat stop right there, that was in direct response to the players, so if your going to be mad at anyone blame the whiners that kept cryin over 4 ppc stalkers and high energy builds.

come to think of it, without ghost heat can you imagine what the game would be like? we would all use PPCS and nothing else.

Edited by BLOOD WOLF, 02 August 2014 - 11:40 PM.

[Davers]

BLOOD WOLF, on 02 August 2014 - 11:06 PM, said:

So I just came off of a thread and I cant get my head around it. I need objection here to be able to look at this clearly.

So There has been bitterness about MWO because the key element of CW which was supposed to be within 90 days of launch was not here. Yea, that is something to have a complaint about. the core of the game one can say that is supposed to bring complexity to the game and immerse us in the battletech universe. Well okay 90 days within launch, the game launched October and, well we did not get CW. Instead we got a road map. A road map leading to CW which was looking like the end of the year, not 90 days.

Was it a lie, well you have to look at the context, and I doubt they can see into the future. A lie is meaning to deceive and I don't really think that was their goal. What would the have to gain from lying. you got to be stupid to intentionally lie to people who are gonna pay for your game. Players who put time and energy into this game and we are the reason it grows. Yea they make it but a game is nothing without people to play it.

Cont. After they set the State of the IS, which was the roadmap for the year. Which did not include CW in 90 days. That is when Some of the player base blew up. I can not say for sure that everyone blew up but some did and some didn't. At the time though, being made that they pushed it back was well within reason. I mean before they launched all the hype was about CW, every interview mentioned CW+90 or soon. That was supposed to be the pillar of MWO. the main attraction to the game. At the start of the roadmap skepticism was commonplace as people did not know what to expect. I would like to mention during the time, it had not been too long since the game game out, barely a year and most of that was CB and then OB.

So point is I can see how people could maintain their air of dismay, throughout 2013. For many the setback as a heinous acts only reserved for the lowest of criminals.........maybe not that harsh but some of the things I read that comes close. Some people are putting PGI to the level of well, I think you know.

The problem I have Is I can only relate to the feeling up until Feb 4 2014. I have told myself If they can hit this date then I will begin to look at how I assess and judge the game. mind you I never had strong feelings of distrust to begin with but I was also hurt a little. I love the MWO franchise the same as anyone else and It was disappointing. Like I said after they hit that date I eased up. I keep my word even when I tell myself, and since they hit the date I have had strong confidence in their ability to roll things out to say. Then they hit march dates, then they hit April dates,then they hit may(I don't think anything important was in may), then the BIG JUNE CLAN RELEASED. I love the Clans so I gave them cool points for that. Point is In 2014 they hit every date they set, they have not missed any dates up to date and they have been putting out patches that really helped the game. So what makes you think they wont hit the rest of the year? are you going to go off 1 missed date of 2013 or are you going to judge them off this year. How can you keep bringing up the missed dates but neglect the dates they hit? where is the logic in that. I understand these are the interwebz and not everybody is just but come on.

At least, , give them another chance from 2014. If you are still here there is no excuse why you can not reset your clocks and treat this year as the year for CW. What is there to gain from living in the past. what is their to gain from being bitter and cynical. Once again why are you still here if not believing the game is moving forward. Stop Letting your Ego get in the way of what the game is really heading towards.

Oh yea, no personally attacks, I take i upon myself to be righteous about it and defend my character.

Why do you feel the need to tell these people they are wrong? Why must everyone 'forgive and forget'? You want to be the starry-eyed optimist, feel free. But don't tell others what to think. PGI brought this all on themselves. Terrible communication, missed deadlines, outright straight up lies. Maybe this doesn't bother you. Again, fine. But some of us dropped with the Devs in CB and heard these lies told right to us.

You want to talk about hit dates and missed dates? Who cares. There is only ONE date. The day CW goes live. Until then none of the other stuff matters.

We are all here because we ARE giving them a chance.

[BLOOD WOLF]

Seriously Davers I am not telling anyone what to think or do

sounds to me like your telling me what to do,and you didn't not need to quote that whole post. you can erase most of that and just leave the post without the quote

Edited by BLOOD WOLF, 02 August 2014 - 11:43 PM.

[El Bandito]

BLOOD WOLF, on 02 August 2014 - 11:39 PM, said:

those are the only three I ever hear, to name a few is right, there are only a few. 3pv was going in the game whether Paul liked it or not, he could only makes sure i did not break the game. Which it didnt, Its hardly used, and a good scout gets your team that ifno. As for ghost heat stop right there, that was in direct response to the players, so if your going to be mad at anyone blame the whiners that kept cryin over 4 ppc stalkers and high energy builds. come to think of it, without ghost heat can you imagine what the game would be like? we would all use PPCS and nothing else.

1. If Ghost Heat is the only way to stop 4 PPC Stalkers then that shows how limited Paul's thinking is, as a balance director.

2. Even if Paul had nothing to do with ECM (source please), he had let it go unchanged for 2+ years. Incompetence is what it is.

Edited by El Bandito, 02 August 2014 - 11:44 PM.

[BLOOD WOLF]

How would you have solved it? your making it sound easy and I doubt it is.

[mike29tw]

BLOOD WOLF, on 02 August 2014 - 11:34 PM, said:

so, they should not make it? 1 year is not that bad. and technically at this point is is going to be 4 months, but better late than never right? Or should they just stop on CW and spend a whole year doing maps and who knows what else. That sounds like a fine idea, a map rush.

We're way past that already. None of PGI's "Hey folks we're working on X and it's gonna be cool when we release it Y months from now." matters to me anymore. I'll believe it when I see it in-game.

[STEF_]

"Stefka Kerensky" is my first nick on which I spent real money buying my beloved summoner (couldn't resist...)
A few days ago I was thinking that if I'm playing EVERY day since 2 years ago, then MWO is a great great game, and PGI has made a great piece of work.
I've read a lot of "egoistic" criticism threads every patches out through theese years.
It's true, there are several features still waiting (bap working as a bap, new mechs, new maps, c3C, and so on).
But : if I'm still playing at this, every day, 2 years passed..... I must admit that mwo is great.

Edited by Stefka Kerensky, 02 August 2014 - 11:48 PM.