27 replies to this topic

[DasSibby]

So I've been thinking. How will everyone be happy with LRMs? Well? It's not going to happen.

Here's why.

The current set up appeases no-body. Currently LRM's aren't suited for face-to-face fights, and they aren't quite good enough for long range support kills. So... they should be one or the other (maybe with a range toggle?)

If the short range selection were changed to being a... sort of MRM, that could work. Up the damage but nix most of their guidance and range and create a mostly line-of-fire flight path.


For long range selection? Change them truly into a fire support weapon that moves a bit faster, is weaker, but also has more rounds per ton and launches into, and descends from a higher angle. (Think mortar fire.)

Overall I think that could work. Especially with a selector toggle that... say has a 8 second switch between ranges (say it's the missile racks re-aligning...). It could make them viable again as a front line, or support weapon as good players could be fire support, then storm into battle when needed.

It's just my idea, but I think this would add some much needed weapon diversity into the game. I can only imagine what battles would look like with this mechanic!

P.S. If a dev sees this, I love this game, and this critique is said in hopes of improving a game I already enjoy!

Edited by DasSibby, 04 August 2014 - 08:22 PM.

[Noth]

LRMs are not supposed to be for short ranged fights, that is what SRMs are for. LRMs do need a complete rework as they are op against people who either don't know or don't have the counters and then useless against those that have and know the counters. Such a swing in power is not good game design.

[Graugger]

Then why can't I switch my AC/20 into a long range howitzer?

[Col Jaime Wolf]

lrms need to be unguided and fast. really only clan lrms are supposed to home

i know it would leave the IS at a disadvantage kinda but really LRMS are either really good or really bad with all the counter/counter counters

[Graugger]

If the LRMs themselves had hitpoints, like .5 HP per missile I think you'd see a lot more of them being shot down but then it wouldn't necessarily be so bad if they had a range of 2.5 KM then.

[Sug]

At least the OP has plenty of company on Terrible Idea Island.

Mellifluer, on 04 August 2014 - 08:30 PM, said:

really only clan lrms are supposed to home

????

Edited by Sug, 04 August 2014 - 08:36 PM.

[Noth]

Mellifluer, on 04 August 2014 - 08:30 PM, said:

lrms need to be unguided and fast. really only clan lrms are supposed to home

i know it would leave the IS at a disadvantage kinda but really LRMS are either really good or really bad with all the counter/counter counters

Really? Because I'm pretty sure the difference in lore between IS and clan LRMs (outside of the weight and slot differences) was that IS fired ballistically (fired up in an arc) and clan didn't (fired straight) with clan having no minimum range. Now in mechwarrior, LRMs have always been tracking.

[Davers]

Mellifluer, on 04 August 2014 - 08:30 PM, said:

lrms need to be unguided and fast. really only clan lrms are supposed to home

i know it would leave the IS at a disadvantage kinda but really LRMS are either really good or really bad with all the counter/counter counters

Really? Where do you get this from? Since losing line of sight to your opponent is a dishonorable tactic, one could argue that only IS LRMs should home.

[Felbombling]

• Give LRMs bone targeting like the Streak SRMs in clusters of five missiles.
  
• Match their speed to something similar to Autocannons.
  
• Two flight envelopes... direct LoS to target or a high arc if a spotter is involved due to NARC or TAG.

Indirect flights can hit targets behind terrain, but direct LoS shots are just that... flat trajectory shots that may hit terrain if target moves behind it while being tracked. This gives scouts something to do by spotting for LRM boats while at the same time bringing LRM play more in line with the vision the TT rules had in place. I think LRM play in general would feel better if they could be directed at immediate threats as well as using them in conjunction with another teammate using cooperation.

[Haxburch]

LRM destroy gameplay and fun for the most people ... this is the reason for all the counters. We have LRMagedon , most clans fit  LRMs .Its a no brain wapon and also with all the counters its to easy sucess mostly. This is the reason for all the LRMs in evry match.

Edited by Haxburch, 04 August 2014 - 11:54 PM.

[Mcgral18]

Haxburch, on 04 August 2014 - 11:52 PM, said:

LRM destroy gameplay and fun for the most people ... this is the reason for all the counters. We have LRMagedon , most clans fit LRMs .Its a no brain wapon and also with all the counters its to easy sucess mostly. This is the reason for all the LRMs in evry match.

We haven't had Lurmageddon for many months.

1.8 damage, multiplied by Splash damage, travelling at around 200 M/s. No Magic Jesus Box.


What we have are marginally viable weapons.

[Lily from animove]

LRM's are fine, the only time they are annoying is when you made the bad step of running into the open when every random bob can lock on you.

And go to the group queue, there aren't evbven that many LRM's in these matches.
Also, well, enough counters exist, but when people complain about LRM's and you figure out, you are the only AMS mech in the match, well find the mistake.
I normally do not run with ams, either on my novas. But I do not complain about LRMS's sinc ei knwo what they can do, can try to avoid it, or have to live with the fact that I willingly not used AMS. But its not the LRM fault when I die by them.

also, Long range missiles? fuel driven warheads that make my ERLL laugh at their range.

Edited by Lily from animove, 05 August 2014 - 12:08 AM.

[Monkey Lover]

60% of them already don't hit anything. What more do you want?

kill lrms,

kill gauss+ppc
kill jumping
kill sniping
kill lights
mediums are dead.

Soon the game will be so balanced you don't even need to setup your mechs anymore. Why even pick one out, they will all be the same.

Edited by Monkey Lover, 05 August 2014 - 12:28 AM.

[Black Ivan]

Sized hardpoints so that LRM boating is denied would be a great leap, too.

[JellyBelly1977]

I think LRMs are a good idea, great for Support, but they are ruined, or rather matches are ruined when your team only has a couple or LRM10s spread out but the other team are pretty much loaded to the hilt with LRMs, yes you can hide away but then what is the fun in that, you hide for 15mins, cant get a shot off at the other team but the rain of LRMs on your team have taken out one or two mechs.

Yes there are tactics and electronics etc to help battle LRMs and yes LRMs should be in the game, but each match should not be an LRM fest, it just takes the joy out of it, especially if you are a scout, most do not have ECM, and get lit up, you are toast before you can think about running nowadays.

[Wolfways]

LRM's are currently a pathetically bad (and hard to use) weapon in my matches.
Only bad players die to them regularly, or think they have to hide for most of a match. These same bad players are the ones who get all the unneeded LRM counters put into the game because they cannot be bothered to learn how to avoid LRM's and/or are stupid enough to think that LRM's are a "no-skill" weapon. They are correct in a way i guess. LRM's do kill no-skill players.

LRM's need more speed, and the warning removed. They cannot currently be used as long range weapons.

[wanderer]

And yet again, another OP who crashes and burns to LRMs posting another thread with horrible, tear-inducing (with laughter) "fixes".

I should keep a list of them. It'd give me easier LRM kills when I knew in advance who hadn't figured out how to avoid launches.

What LRMs destroy is bad players. They make it glaringly obvious as they melt under the rain that "Wow, I look embarrassingly awkward getting pummeled to death out here", and that shame and anger turns into A++ badposts on the forums.

When you post "LRMs are OP", you have just put up the Noob Signal.



Noobs aren't the hero MWO needs, even if it's what it deserves.

[Mechteric]

I am an occasional LRM mech support role myself, and my opinion is that you should only be able to do indirect LRM fire if the target is either Tagged or Narced, or if there is a friendly mech with a Command Console equipped with direct LOS.

Or at the least make indirect fire without the above effects active be only about 50% as effective. As in the missiles don't track as well and spread quite a bit more than they do now.

Edited by CapperDeluxe, 05 August 2014 - 05:05 AM.

[wanderer]

And Capper?

No.

Spotting for LRMs in Battletech is -trivial-. As in, do you have a hillbilly with a walkie-talkie handy to call in fire? +1 to hit, done.

IDF and long-range fire is what LRMs are designed for- they're the first-generation "artillery" weapon for Battlemechs (with the Arrow IV being the second-generation system). At most, you reduce their tracking strength slightly to represent the marginal loss of accuracy. They are specifically there to negate line-of-sight firing issues, though Artemis bonuses should not apply, ever to IDF mode launching.

[Novakaine]

Just another "Why can't I use my quad guass build in the middle of an open field with no cover while standing still getting aim post."
Jeebus learn to play bro.
Can't get more simple than that.
You're the exact target I'm looking for.
Damaged and just standing in the open trying to aquire a target.
Standing on top of a hill surveying your kingdom.
Really noobs get a clue!
When I see lights heading my way I just don't stand there in my Stalker, and wait for them to kill me.
I run right into the middle of the pack for support.
When I get a missle warning, you know what I do?
I started hauling arse.
In others words don't be the target.
Mobility is your safety net, even in my Stalker I get the most speed possible.
Why?
Because when it's time to run, I want to haul arse.
Your noob quad gauss build with the tiny 190 engine for a whopping 32 kph is just not viable.
Despite popular belief, thinking skills are required here.
Oh and "Fear the Stalker."
Seriously do.