950 replies to this topic

[Sauce Tomate]

They should rename this game "Whine on the Forum-Warrior". Stuff gets nerfed with the influx of new players whining about seasoned players snapping them with PPCs. And what happens to LRMs? Nothing. Why? Because new players are using them, and to increase new players onto the game to spend money, the best thing to do is to make it harder on their longterm fans and making the game a "DERPLRM" fest.

[Fatal25]

Horrible idea. If it ain't broke don't fix it. Don't say it is broke just to fix it. I don't use PPC, but some people find them very appealing for some reason. 15 heat for 10 pinpoint damage, no thanks. How can that be overpowered?? Why would you nerf the clan large lasers? No one has ever complained about them, ever. I read the boards several times a day and I have never seen a complaint. I use them on my Warhawk and they are perfect the way they are, perfect. You toss a heat multiplier on those and you are going to ruin a lot of viable, fair builds people use.

As for the guass/ppc nerf you also propose, leave those alone too. Yes they do a good amount of damage together, but they have a 4 second recharge and you have to time the guass shots every time with the charge up mechanic. There is a huge learning curve to use the guass properly, reward players for taking the time to master them, not nerf them.

[dragnier1]

Personally i would prefer ppc & er projectile speed to be around 1000. 850 makes it hard for high ping players like myself to hit targets.

ERLL cap at 2 is bad, but i think the idea is to force ppl to chain-fire it...sad, i was hoping i could go dual erll on the kitfox...

[JudgeDeathCZ]

You just killed ERLLas to oblivion...PPC nerf meh.I think it was needed but I did not saw as much ERLLasers as (ER)PPCs/AC5/Gauss combos....EVER

[Lukoi Banacek]

In a game where front loaded damage balliatics remain king a two second beam duration is too much. I will not be using ERL any more. Additionally your heat math....cmon guys. This was not "internally tested" by anyone competent was it? Your NGNG buddies do not constitiute "high competition players" (no offense gang) and I cannot believe you have put a ton of thought into these numbers.

P.s. now you need to redo all of your Clan vs IS testing from scratch if you want to decide if 10 v 12 continues to make sense.

Two ******* second beam duration. ******* hilarious man. Who the hell wants to stare at a target that long? Horrible knee jerk reaction and horrible game design.

[Ky Vina]

The Direwolf with 2 ppc/ 2 gauss will still have its 50 dmg alpha in midrange! the first solution would have been much better than slow down the ppc!
Restricting the possibility fire of more then 2 heavy weapons at once is the solution in my opinion.
Now you also bring back the IS Meta of 2ppc/AC20.. BIG APPLAUS PGI!!!
at least i can undust my Victors..

Nerfing the Clantech is like a**f****** the people who supports you by buying those Clanpacks.. Laserboating seems to be the meta for the Clans, but this ERLL nerf ist way too much! 12v10 is the point!

[Vezm]

I'd like to point out, it is far more efficient to adjust things in large increments at first to gauge if the adjustment is moving in the right direction and decide if it is enough or too much. After adjusting you can then decide to move back half way or jump up another increment. The other way is to take baby steps each time and never have a full understanding of how much effect the change ha really had.

Lets guess what number I'm thinking of between 1 and 40. We have 6 guesses. Each time we get an indication of direction.

Lets take things slow because otherwise someone might get upset.
1, higher. 2, higher. 3, higher. 4, higher. 5, higher. 6, higher. Dang it.

How about we thinnk about it a little and use a strategy.
20, higher. Wow we already eliminated half the options, clever us.
30, lower. 25, lower. 23, lower. Getting close, but only 2 more guesses, oh wait that's ok we only have 2 more options.
21, higher. 22, bingo!

In saying all that, and I doubt anyone will read it, I will say there is, at least, one bad balancing practice being performed. Primarily changing multiple factors at once, meaning testing weapon nerfs and 10 v 12, rather than one then the other.

This may be because I am slightly biased. I do very much enjoy my 4xLL Timby, and I already have to lead PPCs, gauss, freakin' lasers, everything, due to my ping. But I don't expect game balance to be based on me. But my main bias is that I'd like to see clans and IS in CW with cannon unit sizes (10 v 12) and nerfing clans and then testing them short stacked is out of order to me. I just fear they will deem 10 v 12 unbalanced and throw the idea out and keep the nerfs instead. Naturally balance of 10 v 12 makes mixed pug games more difficult to match and could create a tendency towards clans that lasts.

TL; DR - Calm down and lets see what happens.

[edit] In before someone says I cheated at guessing numbers because I knew which one I was thinking of.

Edited by Vezm, 08 August 2014 - 01:34 AM.

[RowanE83]

This unnecessary sauce lacks potency.

Perhaps, PGI, your time & effort would be more appreciated if your focus was on adding/expanding weapon systems content, rather that rooting around with adjustments to the existing?

Edited by RowanE83, 08 August 2014 - 01:30 AM.

[Fire and Salt]

Almeras, on 08 August 2014 - 01:08 AM, said:

PPC (according to my stats its something like PPC/5.8dmg for every shot fire and CERLL/5.6dmg. Total damage/#times fired).

Mine was:
CERPPC: 9.2 per shot fired
CERLL: 6.4 per shot fired

That's actually reasonably proportional to the heat they generate.

Of course, the CERPPC damage is mostly to one component, and the CERLL damage is all spread out...




Thing is, they nerfed the CERLL way worse than they nerfed the CERPPC.
Just the burn time increase and the heat increase would have been sufficient to maintain the balance between the 2.
*If not excessive. Whats wrong with trying 1.7 seconds first?

The ERLL "free" fire reduction from 2 -> 1 is really what was over the top.
The penalty of 3.0 may have been a bit low, in proportion to the PPCs penalty of 10... if they would have raised the penalty a bit without limiting you to a single laser... well.... that would at least be inline with the PPC.

But there is absolutely no reason that they needed to hit it twice from the penalty side.
Calling 2 ERLLs an alphastrike boat configuration is beyond absurd.










And perhaps the most absurd bit:
I have several stormcrows, an adder, a summoner, and 2 warhawks that will be getting modified after this "fix".

My 2x gauss + 2 ppc dire wolf, however, is going to remain completely untouched.

Pretty sure that build will still work fine.

Edited by Fire and Salt, 08 August 2014 - 01:40 AM.

[Docta Pain]

I learned my lesson the hard way by buying a phoenix package... which is "Don't buy it before you try it (from PGI)." so I've waited to see what clan mechs are worth it (in c-bills) and how their weapons are "balanced" (ah-hem).

PGI will perform continuous nerfs to the clans until they are all available by C-bills, so those who paid will get a bonus for a time. Once clans are no longer exclusive to the paying crowed, they must be nerfed.

Edited by Docta Pain, 08 August 2014 - 01:34 AM.

[Celthora]

To sum up, people were killing, dying so enjoying the game somehow, so that there wasn't need to change things that dramatically.

Most of people, even lights are staying and looking on Daishi when they see it, like a cow watching a train. Then complaint they are so powerful and need to be nerfed. But noone tries to sneak up and shoot them from behind...

Also PGI should release some city maps with narrow streets, instead of nerfing clans. Maybe IS has more advantage there because of better AC20s and people have more chance against clan ppc+gauss metas

Edited by Celthora, 08 August 2014 - 01:37 AM.

[RJF Gnom]

John1352, on 07 August 2014 - 07:13 PM, said:

I support the C ERLL nerf! (unlike everyone else it seems) If I'm standing 1500m away in my Jenner reporting enemy positions I shouldn't be risking a 40 point hit from a Daishi with a big targeting computer.

PPCs might be hit too hard by this though.

if this game too hard for you, play tetris, and do not write here of stupid, but better not to play at all and go do your homework

[Dirk Le Daring]

I gave it a like, but will have to see how it works......

Edit: Thanks for the update

Edited by Dirk Le Daring, 08 August 2014 - 01:43 AM.

[Noth]

John1352, on 07 August 2014 - 07:13 PM, said:

I support the C ERLL nerf! (unlike everyone else it seems) If I'm standing 1500m away in my Jenner reporting enemy positions I shouldn't be risking a 40 point hit from a Daishi with a big targeting computer.

Don't stand still. At that range even a little movement is enough to throw off someones aim really easily. The number of lights I see standing still in the game and expecting to not get smack by a heavy alpha is just rediculous.

[Manei Domini Krigg]

IN TIME WHEN YOU CRYING AT FORUMS, YOUR Enemy already expects the new IMBA configurations for FARM YOU!

[Storyteller]

Wow ... 3 changes on one weapon system at a time, C-ER Large Laser. This doesn't seem to be good balancing at all.

And PPCs nerfed by 40% ...

That's ACs and LRMs in favorite in the future and no PPCs and C-ER Large anymore. You will see.

[Primetimex]

Noth, on 08 August 2014 - 01:43 AM, said:

The number of lights I see standing still in the game and expecting to not get smack by a heavy alpha is just rediculous.

This ... L2P and don't think your light lagshield will protect you - even when you are standing still on top of a hill and then CRY when you get one-two shotted.

Anyone that sits still deserves to get one-shotted in this game, but unfortunately, they have friends in high places that also equally needs to L2P - play the game himself even - namely PAUL.

I seen many light mechs just standing still - not moving much even - then cry when I dented them with my AC20 - L2P much?

Edited by GetterRobo, 08 August 2014 - 01:50 AM.

[Jonny Taco]

This has got to be a joke, right?... Right?!

Seriously though... Paul... WTF are you doing...

[The Great Unwashed]

All this complaining is turning me into an apaulogist...

[Texas Merc]

I honestly think this is just and hilarious. Long ago PGI set this precedent, and if any of you guys who shelled out cash for these mechs didnt see it coming then shame on you.

YOU ARE THE FOOLS

Minimum viable product also means ease of use and play for those that have just downloaded the game, not the spergs who have not once, not twice, but thrice now have supported this sort of behavior in a developer.

Honestly, what did you guys expect?