45 replies to this topic

[Mycrus]

AUSwarrior24, on 17 August 2014 - 05:43 PM, said:

I disagree. Much of the balancing and changes placed into the game are because they need to make it 'fair' all round in order to avoid people whining over their purchases not being what they thought they'd be. Ironically they still do anyway.

With a subscription model, the developers could focus on making a fun, high quality MechWarrior game, rather than a F2P platform designed to make consistent money with MechWarrior wrapped about it.

If you were paid by the day would you do better or worse than your performance today.

If you were paid a fixed salary would you.... You get the picture.

[Corbenik]

I have not heard of any Online shooters that are subscription Based and if there are they aren't widely known, I don't see This type of genre having enough content to justify a monthly subscription even Buy 2 play AAA titles only have certain modes and few maps and still are on going. I just think everyone has too many expectations or unreal expectations nowadays.

[MonkeyCheese]

Because subscription games always work out...

Some like SWTOR walk a very very fine line of subscription and free to play but we the way we have it all the various mech packs it seems to work fine just like free to play games like PS2 and WT but we dont have the massive player populations like they do. That is the main problem.

[BLOOD WOLF]

I think you would need to weigh the potential of F2p games and Subscription. I don't think F2p games have less development potential than Subscription game. I remember playing SWOTR, that was my last sub game After Galaxies.

MonkeyCheese, on 17 August 2014 - 05:54 PM, said:

Because subscription games always work out...

Some like SWTOR walk a very very fine line of subscription and free to play

I like that game but my bro payed for my account for a while, after he stopped I just didn't want to spend money on a monthly sub. I was a bounty hunter.

[CN9 ACE PILOT]

Mycrus, on 17 August 2014 - 05:48 PM, said:

If you were paid by the day would you do better or worse than your performance today.

If you were paid a fixed salary would you.... You get the picture.

I'm sure the dev's are paid by the hour either way. Even if they only bring them in once a month to do some patchwork and a new camo to sell.

PGI then pays the bills and pockets the rest.

Edited by CN9 ACE PILOT, 17 August 2014 - 06:01 PM.

[MonkeyCheese]

BLOOD WOLF, on 17 August 2014 - 05:56 PM, said:

I like that game but my bro payed for my account for a while, after he stopped I just didn't want to spend money on a monthly sub. I was a bounty hunter.

I play but honestly you HAVE to put in some money to have fun with all the money,inventory,itemusage,pvpinstance caps/restrictions on everything, the GREAT thing about MWO is that the only real limiting factor is mechbays and they seem to be on a rise as prizes as of late.

Considering this 12IS v 10Clan event on the NGNG ts was giving out a free mechbay for participating I assume/hope they will offer a free mechbay for helping to test and provide feedback on things in the test server next time it is used. Last time the numbers were way to low to do any good.

[Kassatsu]

If this game were subscription-based, what would us "P2W" clan pilots have to shoot at? Each other? Where's the fun in fighting an even match against other people that spent money on the game when you can shoot at inferior mechs that cost no money?

Then again, I see 4+ heroes, several non-stock champions and a LOT of clan mechs every match. I'd say nearly every player has paid something, and a lot of them have gone well over the standard $14.99 a month mark. I don't know about you guys but I'd be subscribed to this game for well over five years if I spent the same amount on a subscription based game. And where would my gold mech be then? In the hands of some moron that tagged every single enemy with a medium laser and only went for as high of a damage number as they could in every single match over the course of a weekend?

I have no idea which side I'm supporting here. I myself prefer subscription games as the communities tend to be slightly less toxic. They also tend to be much, much smaller, though ultimately less profitable for various reasons.

Speaking of profit, why hasn't MWO introduced a "mech reinforcement crate" that contains one guaranteed medium laser (see, you're paying for the laser, GAMBLING LAW DODGING WOO) and one random item of... Another medium laser, random camo specs/colors (some could be exclusive to that crate) and even hero mechs (again, add some exclusives that are blatantly OP compared to direct-buy heroes, and WAY better than the filthy peasant c-bill variants... Throw in some +1 medium lasers or things like omni conversion kits for your mechs so you can mount clan tech in an IS mech or swap out the engine in your Adder).

Such profit. So gambling. Wow.

Edited by Kassatsu, 17 August 2014 - 06:29 PM.

[Undercover Brother]

Coming back from an XBox LIVE subscription (with CoD), Star Wars: KOTR subscription, and a few others, if PGI had the resources to keep something like that up and running, I'd be more than willing to pay up to $30/mo if it kept me swimming in new mechs, customizations, tech, and maps. They don't have what they need to put that kind of game together. I hope to God that one day, this will change. If that day arrives, those of us who paved the way by dumping money down the proverbial drain will be royally screwed, but hopefully enough will stay, knowing that we helped get to that point.

[Novakaine]

Well they should have done both.
I've been playing a certain game Dungeon & Dragons Online for more than the past 5 years.
That's 14.95 a month.
Of course they give you a nice goodie box to everyone for subscribing, however I would not consider that even being close to p2w.
My point is if you like something despite it's flaws you're gonna up the cash.
And the goodie box does'nt hurt either.

[FDJustin]

I don't think the game is big enough for a subscription model. Besides that, PGI has done a pretty good job of making sure the free experience doesn't feel entirely crappled, which keeps the number of opponents higher than it would otherwise be, which keeps the whales happy enough to keep spending money on their hobby.
You'll get a lot of free players converting to minor payers to boot, spending $10 here or there for mech bays or the odd hero variant, maybe even camo or premium time.
4 bays is the right number, by the way. It gives us just enough room to master a mech, then sacrifice the grind variants and master a second mech, then feel pressure to get more after we've already committed a good amount of time and energy into the game... And since they're fairly cheap, they do one very valuable job. Get people to make that gateway purchase.
Once you buy from a company, it's easier to buy from them again.

[WVAnonymous]

I would not have spent as much as I have if it were subscription based. All these limited time offers I can't resist after 11 PM.

Plus in a sense, I subscribed anyway by buying the 360 day premium time package last year... It feels wrong if I miss a day.

[Black Ivan]

If MWO would have had a subscription model there would not be much players left and the game would be long dead

[Kmieciu]

If MWO was subscription based game everybody would be running Timber and Dire Wolves...

[Kabum]

Now with the panorama of F2P games a subscription model is the death of the game. It willhave a niche number of player and a mass that will move away.

[FDJustin]

Kabum, on 18 August 2014 - 01:37 AM, said:

Now with the panorama of F2P games a subscription model is the death of the game. It willhave a niche number of player and a mass that will move away.

Subscription models are still possible, but harder than ever to pull off. F2P model is also very hard to pull off. Most games do it very wrong, making it feel like P2W and all but completely stonewalling free players out. Or harassing the **** out of them. SWTOR is full of harassing goodness that makes it feel like you're constantly being hard-sold, and constantly being punished for not buying.
The closest thing to that here is the missed out on premium rewards notice... Which isn't too bad. The colours are subdued, it doesn't make me click anything, it doesn't flash. I also noticed the reward is half over again the normal reward. Which would be nice, but it's small enough to look like it's a perk for those who buy, rather than a punishment for those who don't, unlike a 100% bonus.
... But I digress. Although rare, some franchises do pull it off. Final fantasy, WoW. They've already got critical mass and probably cost over ten times the amount to produce than this.

[Anjian]

My last sub game was Final Fantasy 14 A Realm Reborn. I have since left that game. Previous to that I was on EVE Online and Phantasy Star Universe.

FF14 ARR did show that in an age of F2P, subscription is still viable. But then again, anything about this "new" ganme, is really old school. There is nothing truly innovative about FF14 ARR, it takes an old school MMO, refined the concept and put Final Fantasy themes on it. In the end it still feels like a theme park. For what its worth their team have added much content on the game on a much faster pace than say EVE Online. However some of the content is recycling old dungeons to give them a Hard Mode, then an Extreme Hard mode.

Currently, all my games are F2P. I like the fact that I can "quit" a game and return to it later like nothing happened. I don't have to deactivate and reactivate my account with the bureaucratic hassles that go along with it.

F2P also acknowledges a real world fact --- that your real world time may actually be worth much more than the in game virtual currency. They let you pay, use real money to advance faster, skip things much more quickly, than to grind and grind and grind which is one of the main reasons I left EVE Online and FF14 ARR. New content in subscription games are usually about more grind. That is actually why they are dying.

In F2P, you have to main choices --- you can play free and grind, or use money and skip. Most people do somewhere in between. In a sub game, there is only one choice --- you grind endlessly, and still pay for it.

But of course, grind can actually give meaning to the goal and to the item, if applied with careful consideration. Sometimes I think MWO needs this, because its far too easy to buy any mech. What if there is a mech tech tree, and you need to research through all the branches to get the mechs you want? I think there are some who would appreciate the meaning it gives to owning the attained mech, but then I think many would have left the game as well.

Grind --- with no option around it --- is to my opinion, is the biggest reason why people leave an MMO.

[FDJustin]

Anjian, on 18 August 2014 - 02:01 AM, said:

...than to grind and grind and grind which is one of the main reasons I left EVE Online and FF14 ARR. New content in subscription games are usually about more grind. That is actually why they are dying.

But of course, grind can actually give meaning to the goal and to the item, if applied with careful consideration. Sometimes I think MWO needs this, because its far too easy to buy any mech. What if there is a mech tech tree, and you need to research through all the branches to get the mechs you want? I think there are some who would appreciate the meaning it gives to owning the attained mech, but then I think many would have left the game as well.

Grind --- with no option around it --- is to my opinion, is the biggest reason why people leave an MMO.

Catch 22. The grind is the content. It's... Kind of the easier content to make I imagine, and grinding is a way to force people to slow down and pay for it for months or years. Too much grind and those of us who see past it resent it (Mostly older folks that have long since become bored with most game mechanics.)
Too little grind and all the content is nommed right away, leaving people full and ready to unsubscribe.

As for mech trees, no thanks. Then you have tiers, and while tiers make sense, I think they're an atrocious mechanic. They promote power creep, segregate players, P2W variants, griiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiind, often hide the more fun aspects of play until much later tiers, and take development away from creating more varied and interesting gameplay.
Mostly... It just artificially increases life expectancy. Kind of like grinding 3 versions of the same mech to fully power one up.

[NextGame]

If you were guaranteed a mech of which you were given 1 variant as part of your sub (and mechbays for c-bills instead of mc), a map, and a notable game feature per month then sure, subscription no problem.

MWO in its current development context of "lets not make any effort whatsoever, and spend the money on one giant never ending office party instead". No, it would be rightfully dead.

PGI don't have the mental wherewithal required to run a game under a subscription model.

Edited by NextGame, 18 August 2014 - 02:27 AM.

[Spencley]

Would not be a subscriber and would not be playing if it was. Between the servers & the terrible support I have received I am considering just getting a refund. If that fails a charge back since it is the only purchase.

They have some sucking up to do to get me to stay and keep the $180

[Jonny Taco]

SUb based games are almost always higher quality than ftp games... The core of the issue is the manner in which the games are designed from inception. p2p games generally have far more content, and game play designed around mechanics and progression. On the other hand f2p games draw more people in but the actual game play experience is always directed around pay walls/monetization rather than a core experience.

In an ideal world, mwo would be a sub game produced by a quality dev with about 10 times more content than is currently available. Sadly this is not an ideal world and the trend in gaming has long ago shifted from sub model mmos to vast numbers of significantly lower quality f2p games...

P.S. Those claiming that 12-15$ a month is expensive should take a look at their cellphone bills that are generally more than 3x the price... Also, f2p games tend to be significantly more expensive in the long run than a typical p2p sub game.

Edited by lartfor, 18 August 2014 - 03:35 AM.