12 replies to this topic

[Catra Lanis]

Hello

First one: Are there no alternate strategies on Terra Therma? Is splitting up and attacking the center volcano from three directions not a viable strategy due to game mechanics?

Every single game the entire company stomp away and line up at one of the entrances taking turns. It looks like friday night at an atm machine.

Also, people seem unwilling to rush even when there is a good chance at suceeding prefering to wring their hands. Sometimes I loose patience and tell them to come with me. Then I rush hoping to get the rest or at least a lance with me. It usually ends up with me vanishing in a fireball and when I look back there is a mech peering around the corner, still wringing its hands (or whatever appendage it is equipped with).

Second: How does a shutdown mech look if you have no BAP, does it looked like a destroyed mech? Today in Caustic Valley I got caught in the middle of a brawl with my Catapult which is more useless than an urbanmech up close (2 med lasers). I was shot up badly and thought I was a gooner for sure. As a last resort I shut down and survived as the battle moved away. Was that because they couldn't tell I wasn't destroyed or did they just not care in the general meleé?

Edited by Catra Lanis, 19 August 2014 - 02:23 PM.

[Koniving]

First: It's perfectly viable.
As is finding battles outside of the center.

The issue is getting other people to go along with it.

Second: A shutdown mech looks like a shutdown mech. Hunched over but that's about it. Though if it's smoking and such it'll look kinda dead, even if a bit hunched over instead of fallen. Sometimes mechs "die" standing up.

In closed beta -- back when about half of the dead mechs were still 'standing' when dead -- it was possible to shut off and let time tick by. Wait until he's looking away, power on, attack, and power off and you might get some suspicious looks... but smoking from 3 or 4 spots you do look pretty dead.

Edited by Koniving, 19 August 2014 - 02:30 PM.

[Catra Lanis]

Koniving, on 19 August 2014 - 02:25 PM, said:

First: It's perfectly viable.
As is finding battles outside of the center.

The issue is getting other people to go along with it.

Second: A shutdown mech looks like a shutdown mech. Hunched over but that's about it. Though if it's smoking and such it'll look kinda dead, even if a bit hunched over instead of fallen. Sometimes mechs "die" standing up.

But you disappear from radar and can not be targeted no matter how close they are unless they have BAP, in short they have to rely on visual?

[Koniving]

Catra Lanis, on 19 August 2014 - 02:30 PM, said:

But you disappear from radar and can not be targeted no matter how close they are unless they have BAP, in short they have to rely on visual?

Pretty much.

[Catra Lanis]

Koniving, on 19 August 2014 - 02:30 PM, said:

Pretty much.

That clarifies it, thanks. I guess I looked dead. All I had left was legs and CT, and head, no armor on those parts either.

[DustySkunk]

There are additional strategies to Terra Therma although in my experience the caldera (a.k.a. "PUGzapper") is the default one. As you rise in ELO you will see less and less of the "clog the entrances" strategy. If your team is dead set on moving to the caldera, one of the things you can do is encourage a push into the caldera. By moving in, you can get more mechs' firepower focusing on less of theirs. What I mean is, they may have one or two mechs able to fire from the entrances without blocking eachother's firing lanes. If your team enters the caldera all at once, you get four-five mechs able to fire at their one or two, albeit with little cover. People will take a beating but as long as your team is decisive, it will usually turn out better for you.

With that statement comes the truth of the matter: teamwork is OP. If you can get your team moving cohesively on one strategy (even a flawed one), more often than not it will win out against a team of rambos.

As to a shut-down mech, it won't appear on your radar unless you have a BAP. So, it's entirely possible that people mistook you for a destroyed mech. As Koniving pointed out, mechs can die standing up.

[LauLiao]

Catra Lanis, on 19 August 2014 - 02:34 PM, said:

That clarifies it, thanks. I guess I looked dead. All I had left was legs and CT, and head, no armor on those parts either.

Could also be that they realized with all that damage you weren't a real threat and everyone on the other team just left you for someone else to finish off while they dealt with your team-mates.

Bottom line is awesome that it worked, but definitely don't rely on it.

[The Flying Gecko]

The problem with the aforementioned Terra Therma strategy is that if they have 12 mechs in middle, and you assault middle from 3 sides, then can just push on any of those 3 groups and it becomes 12 Vs. 4

[Void Angel]

Catra Lanis, on 19 August 2014 - 02:34 PM, said:

That clarifies it, thanks. I guess I looked dead. All I had left was legs and CT, and head, no armor on those parts either.

Any opponents that were targeting you either got confused or were themselves destroyed before they could capitalize on your situation. It's quite common for players to shut down due to overheat on maps like Caustic, and shutting down will usually just make your opponent smile as they line up a shot on your cockpit or exposed internals.

As for Terra Therma, splitting up into threes is possible, but not attractive to me - if the enemy realizes this is happening, they can simply swarm through your first position while the rest of your team is splitting up. Because they're so hard to coordinate (and because the game conditions people to hesitate before exposing themselves,) split-group tactics are a low-percentage gamble outside of an established team. We just don't have enough general tactical knowledge in the player base for complex tactics to successfully be undertaken without voice coordination.

The alternate tactics I advocate are setting up a kill zone out of sight of the entrance to the caldera (i.e. they can't see you before they commit to coming out,) and just staying away from the bowl of heat and failure by sweeping left or right around the outside looking for victims. Both tactics can fail, and both are subject to sabotage by people who Don't Get It, but they always have a much better chance than flipping a coin to see who gets into the Caldera first, particularly since the most common reaction for both teams is to frantically backpedal and clog the ramp at the first sign of combat - then take turns poking their noses out to get shot at by the entire enemy team.

[SethAbercromby]

The Cauldron in Therma is a very tricky area of the map. All entrances are designed as choke points, so only a very limited number of 'Mechs can pass through them at the same time. The other trick is that the paths leading to the entances are reached by traversing a rather narrow path upwards, which drastically limites fire support otions for an invading force.

Contrary to that, the inside of the cauldron is flat and players can see and fire at any entrance point from the outer ring, which allows them to fire at invading 'Mechs from multiple angles. The shape also allows them to push out of the cualdrom much more effectively as it is pushing in, allowing for very effective sweeps on enemies trying to hold the entrance points from outside.

To put is short, when a team is holding the cauldron, it is near impossible to overwhelm them by force, as focus fire can be achieved much easier and retaliation execued more effectively. The best strategy is to not play by their rules and to lure them out to a position where your team can press an advantage.

[Heydiddly]

Unfortunately, people tend to be too cowardly to push into the caldera when it's taken (or even when it isn't, which is just ludicrous) even if you tell people when to push and even go first. However, getting people to back off tends to be a bit easier, since they probably won't damage their precious paintwork doing so. Therefore, my preferred tactic is to poke your desired terrible entrance a bit (sweep a few lasers across as many enemies as you can, get everyone's attention), then back away and have everyone either a) set up a firing line where your whole team can nail the enemy as they filter out one by one or, if your entrance doesn't allow that like the narrow ramp doesn't, have everyone hide round a corner ready to ambush. This relies on the fact that people tend to be just as bloodythirsty and impatient as they are cowardly, so if they see a lone enemy retreating from them, at least a few will inevitably chase you out... poor fool them! Best case, you mop up their entire team, worst case you gain a small numbers advantage to use as you see fit. While obviously not foolproof, this has provided me reasonable success amongst my puggy peers.

As for appearing dead when shutting down... yea, I've done that once or twice, it's hilarious when it works but it usually doesn't. Protip: if you see an enemy that you think might only be playing dead, hit them anyway (a single laser will do); if the crosshair turns red, you are doing damage so they must still be alive. Teach them the error of their ways.

Edited by Heydiddly, 19 August 2014 - 04:15 PM.

[Yelland]

If you take the center - hold it. Once red has it and people are peeking, regroup for another strategy. Otherwise one by one folks will shoot once get hit twice until its 1-4 red.

When it works... I like to regroup in E7, once red knows you are there you can pick them off coming to you from bridge.

Another thought, avoid announcing your team by being the first one to lookie loo. Unless you are scouting for the purpose of splitting their lines. Stay with team so more of you surprise them at one time.

[Ace Selin]

Catra Lanis, on 19 August 2014 - 02:30 PM, said:

But you disappear from radar and can not be targeted no matter how close they are unless they have BAP, in short they have to rely on visual?

Mechs do die standing up and if you look broken, especially if near a wall, crate etcit could look like you died and then leaned against the wall/crate.

Personally, if ive been in a battle and weve won and held position, any mech that looks like its standing ill shoot it. If its a live but powered down mech, my crosshair will flick red when i inflict damage, then ill kill it. If the mech is really dead the crosshair stays white.