81 replies to this topic

[Darwins Dog]

Hi all,

I'm looking to do a bit of upgrading on my computer, as I barely make the minimum settings. My FPS usually sits in the 30-40 range during minor engagements, but drops to around 15-25 (as low as 10) during heavy action. I have the game set to minimum everything except mech detail (because they look really ugly on minimum). I'm wondering what I should upgrade to get the best additional performance. I'd like to stabilize my FPS, but make the game look prettier if possible. I have about 300 USD to spend (maybe a little more).

My current specs:

• CPU - AMD Phenom II x4 940 Quad-core 3.0GhZ
  
• GPU - EVGA 512-P3-N871-AR GeForce 9800 GTX+ 512MB 256-Bit DDR3 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP
  
• MOBO - ASUS M4A79 Deluxe AM3/AM2+/AM2 AMD 790FX ATX
  
• PSU - CORSAIR TX Series CMPSU-750TX 750W ATX12V v2.3

I greatly appreciate any advice I can get. MWO is the main game I play, and the only one with heavy system requirements (Minecraft isn't as much of a resource hog).


UPDATE: After running some monitoring software I found my CPU was getting up to 80-85C . My guess is that it has been for some time. I ordered the cooling fan and thermal compound already, since the stock fan obviously wasn't cutting it. I'm not too keen on overclocking it now. I suspect it won't stand up to too much additional stress.

However, I got some extra money from selling sea urchins to a biology lab, and I now have ~570USD to play with. Now I can upgrade everything! This is what I am considering now http://pcpartpicker.com/p/HbmsVn (thanks for showing me this site btw, it's like smurfy for computers). I have the case, PSU (700W), etc. alreadt. My HDD is only 5400 rpm and 3GB/s SATA, but from what I've read that should only affect loading times. Thoughts?

Edited by Darwins Dog, 27 August 2014 - 07:46 AM.

[Odins Fist]

You can attempt to OC your CPU to 3.5GHZ and get a new GPU.

Nothing less then a GTX 760 or GTX 770 4gb superclocked edition EVGA.

Question #1: Are you running DDR 2 800 mhz or DDR2 1066?
Question #2: Have you or are you able to OC?

[Darwins Dog]

Odins Fist, on 25 August 2014 - 09:29 AM, said:

Question #1: Are you running DDR 2 800 mhz or DDR2 1066?

I believe it is DDR2 1066 (will have to double check when I get home)

Odins Fist, on 25 August 2014 - 09:29 AM, said:

Question #2: Have you or are you able to OC?

I've never done it before. I'm told that my MOBO makes it fairly easy, but I've never really looked.

[Rhaythe]

I just upgraded from an AMD Phenom II 6-core processor to an i7. The results for this game, which is processor-heavy, is night and day. I'm still running on a 3 year-old video card, but easily pulling 90+ frames per second on very good settings.

Go motherboard/processor first. And don't get anything but an i5 or greater. This game is very much not AMD friendly.

[Odins Fist]

Rhaythe, on 25 August 2014 - 09:39 AM, said:

I just upgraded from an AMD Phenom II 6-core processor to an i7.

The OP would have to build an entire new system other then PSU and case to do that.

I'm pretty sure he's looking NOT to build a new rig.

His Mobo won't take an i7, etc, etc, etc, etc,...

Edited by Odins Fist, 25 August 2014 - 09:54 AM.

[Darwins Dog]

Rhaythe, on 25 August 2014 - 09:39 AM, said:

I just upgraded from an AMD Phenom II 6-core processor to an i7. The results for this game, which is processor-heavy, is night and day. I'm still running on a 3 year-old video card, but easily pulling 90+ frames per second on very good settings.

Go motherboard/processor first. And don't get anything but an i5 or greater. This game is very much not AMD friendly.

I appreciate the feedback, but I don't think I can fit that into my budget. I would need new MOBO, RAM, CPU etc. to make that work. If you know of any good deals I'd love to hear about it.

[Rhaythe]

My concern is that you might upgrade your AMD processor, only to discover the game still plays relatively poorly. I can tell you coming from the six-core Phenom II that you won't get the performance upgrade you're really looking for. I was still pulling only around 40 FPS on medium settings, and that would tank down to low-twenties in the middle of a fierce firefight.

Maybe keep an eye on NewEgg? If you're at a 300 dollar-ish budget, they have a few i5 boards that might be along the lines of what you're looking for:

http://www.newegg.co...t=Combo.1795163

[Flapdrol]

This game is heavy on the cpu, but the 9800 gtx is really old and quite weak, so it's hard to tell, also depends on settings and resolution.

I suggest downloading MSI afterburner, then monitoring the gpu usage and fps during a game (afterburner makes graphs and works with any brand gpu).

If your gpu is always working at 90% or higher upgrade the gpu, if gpu usage drops to something like 50% during the match upgrade the cpu.

This game doesn't like amd fx cpu's. Whatever you do don't get one of those, as your current phenom II is probably faster in this game. If you're upgrading the cpu you'll need a new mobo and ram as well, so might as well get an intel.

If you're going to upgrade the gpu you could probably get a big gpu upgrade for next to nothing if you get a used gpu. I use a gtx470 which you could get for like 50,- or something.

[Goose]

You might spend some money on improving the cooling of your CPU as you overclock it, but really you need to look around the forums for "free" tweeks, on your budget.

Set a framerate limit, 45 or 30, and make some log files with FRAPS plus HWiNFOxx so you can see your bottleneck, then make a plan from there …

[Ruccus]

Definitely the graphics card I'd say. While not near the power of today's quad core Intel offerings the Phenom II X4 940 is still an adequate processor, plus to upgrade the processor you're looking at a motherboard upgrade as well. The 9800GTX is about a six year old graphics card, which is ancient in the graphics card business.

With a $300 budget I'd look at the GeForce GTX 760 (the 770 is a bit above your budget but I figure I'd mention it as well) and the Radeons R9 280, 285, and 280X. The 280 and 280X are out now, while the 285 will be launched September 2nd.

The 760 and 280 are a good value for a gaming graphics card while still having solid performance. Looking at Newegg the 280 is selling in the $220 range and the 760 is in the $240 range. The 285 should have a $249msrp when it's launched, and the 280X is selling for around $300. The 770 is in the $330 range.

I'm currently gaming with a Core i5 2500K@4.5ghz and a Radeon 7950 (which while not identical, is very similar in performance to the R9 280) and have no issues with performance except when there's a lot of smoke in the area (I have graphics set to "Very High" on DX11 with a 1920x1200 resolution). If you want to keep the card to put in a new rig later down the road you might want to spring for the 280X or 770, but the 760 or 280 should be fine for quite a while with reasonable settings.

Edited by Ruccus, 25 August 2014 - 03:21 PM.

[Lord Letto]

PCPartPicker part list: http://pcpartpicker.com/p/7np923
Price breakdown by merchant: http://pcpartpicker....23/by_merchant/

CPU: Intel Core i5-3470 3.2GHz Quad-Core Processor ($189.12 @ OutletPC)
Motherboard: Gigabyte GA-H61M-S1 Micro ATX LGA1155 Motherboard ($40.98 @ Newegg)
Memory: G.Skill Ares Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-1866 Memory ($69.30 @ Newegg)
Total: $299.40
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-08-25 19:26 EDT-0400

sell your old CPU, MOBO and RAM to go towards a GPU, something like a 560TI/69xx/78xx or Better

or if you Keep CPU, MOBO and RAM:

PCPartPicker part list: http://pcpartpicker.com/p/xrhgwP
Price breakdown by merchant: http://pcpartpicker....wP/by_merchant/

Video Card: EVGA GeForce GTX 770 2GB ACX Video Card ($299.99 @ NCIX US)
Total: $299.99
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-08-25 19:35 EDT-0400

if more VRAM Needed:

PCPartPicker part list: http://pcpartpicker.com/p/t6Lz6h
Price breakdown by merchant: http://pcpartpicker....6h/by_merchant/

Video Card: XFX Radeon R9 280X 3GB Black Edition Double Dissipation Video Card ($299.99 @ NCIX US)
Total: $299.99
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-08-25 19:37 EDT-0400

Looking at toms the Intel equivalents of your current CPU are:
Core 2 Extreme: QX6850, QX6800
Core 2 Quad: Q9550, Q9450, Q9400
I5-650,655K,660,661,670,680
I3-2100T,2120T

for current GPU:
Nvidia: 8800 Ultra, 9800 GTX, GTS 250, GTS 450
Nvidia Mobile: 560M, 660M

ATI/AMD: HD 3870X2, 4850, 5750, 6750, 7750(DDR3), R7 250 (DDR 3)
ATI/AMD Mobility: HD 4850, 5850, 7870M

Edited by Lord Letto, 25 August 2014 - 03:48 PM.

[Smokeyjedi]

I would have to say, buy a 30$ CPU cooler 4$ thermal paste and a 250$ GPU GTX760+ or R9 280+

Overclock that beauty CPU you got to near 4.0ghz.......and let the good times roll.

Learning more about overclocking and honing your tweaking skills will get you some crazy hidden performance.........Ram timing tightening etc. Custom user.cfg and MSI afterburner for custom GPU fan profiles and all around exceptional tool for gaming.

[Lord Letto]

Smokeyjedi, on 25 August 2014 - 04:22 PM, said:

I would have to say, buy a 30$ CPU cooler 4$ thermal paste and a 250$ GPU GTX760+ or R9 280+

Overclock that beauty CPU you got to near 4.0ghz.......and let the good times roll.

Learning more about overclocking and honing your tweaking skills will get you some crazy hidden performance.........Ram timing tightening etc. Custom user.cfg and MSI afterburner for custom GPU fan profiles and all around exceptional tool for gaming.

PCPartPicker part list: http://pcpartpicker.com/p/yX73NG
Price breakdown by merchant: http://pcpartpicker....NG/by_merchant/

CPU Cooler: Cooler Master Hyper 212 EVO 82.9 CFM Sleeve Bearing CPU Cooler ($29.98 @ OutletPC)
Thermal Compound: Arctic Silver Ceramique 2 Tri-Linear 2.7g Thermal Paste ($3.98 @ OutletPC)
Video Card: Diamond Radeon R9 280X 3GB Video Card ($242.98 @ Newegg)
Total: $276.94
Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
Generated by PCPartPicker 2014-08-25 23:14 EDT-0400

Edit: I Say GPU First, followed by CPU, MOBO and RAM.

Edited by Lord Letto, 25 August 2014 - 07:17 PM.

[Darwins Dog]

Wow, thanks for all the replies everyone! I'm leaning towards the overclocking + GPU route, but I'll have to do the hardware analysis first. Eventually everything will get replaced, but I have to start somewhere.

[Ruccus]

Darwins Dog, on 25 August 2014 - 07:40 PM, said:

Wow, thanks for all the replies everyone! I'm leaning towards the overclocking + GPU route, but I'll have to do the hardware analysis first. Eventually everything will get replaced, but I have to start somewhere.

Just remember before you buy an aftermarket cooler to measure how much space you have inside your case. The Hyper 212 Evo works well but it's a monster cooler that won't fit in smaller (and some medium sized) cases.

[Kanya Pryde]

Playing on a 1920x1200 monitor at 1080p.

Specs:

GTX 280 (sli 2 cards)
Intel Core 2 quad 2.83
8 gb ram on mobo
windows 7 64bit
EVGA 132-CK-NF78-A1 LGA 775 NVIDIA nForce 780i SLI ATX Intel Motherboard
Antec Signature SG-850 850W Continuous Power ATX12V / EPS12V SLI Certified CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified ...

Want to upgrade my experience... I've been running the game on low(ish) settings for a year now, and have fps capped at 30, which helps make it stable.

Took the advice of this board and ran MSI afterburner and noted GPU usage did not go much beyond 60% (spike to 65%) when I put the game on high settings.

I would prefer to not have the game chugging along at 25 fps and then suddenly drop to 16 fps. Honestly, this was my first time trying it on high settings (and obviously it looks so much better).

I have been considering buying a 770 4gb card... but is there something else I need to do/consider? I currently have 0 experience overclocking (I did look into it a little with cpu but my intel multiplier is locked).

[NeoCodex]

One thing you need to know: no more AMD!

Upgrade your CPU and MB to Intel - without a question!

If you need to know more, the MWO problems have nothing to do with gpu, most nowadays gpu's are good enough and just severely bottlenecked by the bad single thread performance that cryengine demands from the cpu. The AMD is the only reason for your poor performance. Even if you upgrade to the latest model 8core you will gain no improvement (maybe about 10%, 3-5 fps), because AMD cpus have BAD single thread performance. That is just how it is.

Overclocking does not help either, I had a Phenom II 965 OCed to 4.2 and it barely did anything. Fps was still jumping 20-40 even on low details.

Upgrade to Intel cpu like 4670K - it's what I did. It runs same clock speed, OCed to 4.2 as well, but it just runs BETTER. Make that double better. I can play on very high with FSAA on directx11 now with stable 60 fps.

As somebody before me mentioned, he runs at 90 fps on and i7 with crappy gpu, and I capped my fps at 60 because of refresh rate and I prefer more constant fps than jumping from 50-90, it can feel a little weird sometimes, it's just this game that it jumps around so much. But it's true I did ramp up all the settings to the max, since not much of a difference can be felt across them.

It hurts me so much when people recommend you upgrading or just OCing the crappy AMD cpu which was clearly NOT designed for gaming. You need single core performance since the game engine is pretty much single core bound, and all those extra cores don't do anything. Once you understand how a cpu works and why is MWO bottlenecked by it, you will always look for ways to improve your single thread performance to increase fps in gaming.

DO NOT WASTE MONEY ON ANOTHER AMD. Just get a proper gaming CPU. Currently, for it's price range and OC potentital 4670K is still king, and it makes it worth upgrading to new MB too. It's super cheap, and with a decent OC it reaches the performance of stock i7's that are almost double the price (and those don't oc as much as this one). For a good and quiet cooler at reasonable price I suggest the Scythe Ashura. For motherboards, any Z87 will do, I would recommend Asus Maximus VI Hero if you want to get something a little more flashier, this mb was made for gamers and has many extra oc features and support. So instead of going for a an expensive i7, get a good MB and a cooler and OC your 4670k and you will still come trough cheaper.

If you can't afford to upgrade to Intel, than don't do anything, it's a complete waste of time and money. Just save up and buy the real thing.

Edited by NeoCodex, 25 August 2014 - 10:34 PM.

[Kanya Pryde]

While I'm asking questions... would a solid state hard drive improve the way MWO runs?

[Oderint dum Metuant]

Kanya Pryde, on 25 August 2014 - 09:54 PM, said:

Playing on a 1920x1200 monitor at 1080p.

Specs:

GTX 280 (sli 2 cards)
Intel Core 2 quad 2.83
8 gb ram on mobo
windows 7 64bit
EVGA 132-CK-NF78-A1 LGA 775 NVIDIA nForce 780i SLI ATX Intel Motherboard
Antec Signature SG-850 850W Continuous Power ATX12V / EPS12V SLI Certified CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified ...

Want to upgrade my experience... I've been running the game on low(ish) settings for a year now, and have fps capped at 30, which helps make it stable.

Took the advice of this board and ran MSI afterburner and noted GPU usage did not go much beyond 60% (spike to 65%) when I put the game on high settings.

I would prefer to not have the game chugging along at 25 fps and then suddenly drop to 16 fps. Honestly, this was my first time trying it on high settings (and obviously it looks so much better).

I have been considering buying a 770 4gb card... but is there something else I need to do/consider? I currently have 0 experience overclocking (I did look into it a little with cpu but my intel multiplier is locked).

You have two problems.

First an old slow quad core under 3ghz this is going to be your chief problem that needs fixing.
Either by replacing or over clocking.

Second the game has no sli support still; so you can't use both GPUs

[Oderint dum Metuant]

NeoCodex, on 25 August 2014 - 10:08 PM, said:

One thing you need to know: no more AMD!

Upgrade your CPU and MB to Intel - without a question!

If you need to know more, the MWO problems have nothing to do with gpu, most nowadays gpu's are good enough and just severely bottlenecked by the bad single thread performance that cryengine demands from the cpu. The AMD is the only reason for your poor performance. Even if you upgrade to the latest model 8core you will gain no improvement (maybe about 10%, 3-5 fps), because AMD cpus have BAD single thread performance. That is just how it is.

Overclocking does not help either, I had a Phenom II 965 OCed to 4.2 and it barely did anything. Fps was still jumping 20-40 even on low details.

Upgrade to Intel cpu like 4670K - it's what I did. It runs same clock speed, OCed to 4.2 as well, but it just runs BETTER. Make that double better. I can play on very high with FSAA on directx11 now with stable 60 fps.

As somebody before me mentioned, he runs at 90 fps on and i7 with crappy gpu, and I capped my fps at 60 because of refresh rate and I prefer more constant fps than jumping from 50-90, it can feel a little weird sometimes, it's just this game that it jumps around so much. But it's true I did ramp up all the settings to the max, since not much of a difference can be felt across them.

It hurts me so much when people recommend you upgrading or just OCing the crappy AMD cpu which was clearly NOT designed for gaming. You need single core performance since the game engine is pretty much single core bound, and all those extra cores don't do anything. Once you understand how a cpu works and why is MWO bottlenecked by it, you will always look for ways to improve your single thread performance to increase fps in gaming.

DO NOT WASTE MONEY ON ANOTHER AMD. Just get a proper gaming CPU. Currently, for it's price range and OC potentital 4670K is still king, and it makes it worth upgrading to new MB too. It's super cheap, and with a decent OC it reaches the performance of stock i7's that are almost double the price (and those don't oc as much as this one). For a good and quiet cooler at reasonable price I suggest the Scythe Ashura. For motherboards, any Z87 will do, I would recommend Asus Maximus VI Hero if you want to get something a little more flashier, this mb was made for gamers and has many extra oc features and support. So instead of going for a an expensive i7, get a good MB and a cooler and OC your 4670k and you will still come trough cheaper.

If you can't afford to upgrade to Intel, than don't do anything, it's a complete waste of time and money. Just save up and buy the real thing.

The phenom I I series are fine chips; theres nothing wrong with these and overclocking will help; but it won't solve the issue outright.
They are old and one has to temper expectations; one also has to bear in mind budgets when suggesting new hardware (asus maximus boards don't come cheap) amd weather the features are worth the extra $.

Overclocking his cpu isn't a waste of time; but neither is it a magic wand