20 replies to this topic

[Ertur]

This is a fact that was brought up when the module changes were made. However, it has not been addressed in any way.

The JR7-K variant is completely obsolete now. Every possible build can be exactly duplicated with a JR7-D. However, the -D can run builds that are not possible for the -K. This was also true before the module change, but the -K used to have an extra module slot to make up the difference. The -K and -D are unique in that they have this relationship -- there are no other two mechs where one can replicate all possible builds of the other while also having extra hardpoints.
[edit to add: I missed the Stalker 4N, but since that is overlapped by TWO mechs and not just one, this is still technically true. Sorta.]

Maybe it would help to have a Venn diagram. Draw a circle. Then draw a larger circle around the first, surrounding it completely. The small circle is the set of all possible -K builds. The larger circle is the set of all possible -D builds. Again, this relationship is absolutely unique in the game.
[edit to add: except for the Stalker 4N]

The JR7-K should have it's extra module slot restored for this reason. That would leave the -K and -O as having one extra module, while the -F and -D would have the standard loadout of modules.

Edited by Ertur, 26 August 2014 - 10:55 AM.

[Monkey Lover]

http://mwomercs.com/...age__p__3630323

They don't care man

[Elizander]

We can go with quirks for it I guess.

[Ertur]

Just keeping it on the radar.
Also people started in on other mechs. I don't have a problem with other mechs. It's just that this is a completely unique situation. There was balance before, now there is not.

Also, the quirks are identical now, too.
The -K needs something, and the module being put back is the obvious correction.

Edited by Ertur, 25 August 2014 - 10:13 PM.

[Kiiyor]

Elizander, on 25 August 2014 - 10:10 PM, said:

We can go with quirks for it I guess.

Quirk: CT reduced by 30%.

Hmmm...

Quirk: All Jenner CT's reduced by 30%. Jenner K crap by comparison again.

[John1352]

Like I said in one of the other Jenner K threads: Welcome to the Stalker 4N club little Jenner, I hope you enjoy your indefinite stay!

As I often switch between NARC and SRMs on my Jenner D, I sometimes think that I should have kept my K, but really, it wouldn't make a lot of difference.

[TercieI]

"Trust me. They'll let you rot, little buddy."

-Stalker 4N

[Ertur]

Did the Stalker 4N have an extra module before the module system change? If so, then it should have one now. Missed that, though, and feel derpy. Edited OP.

[Rizzelbizzeg]

The Stalker 4N is the only stalker with 20 tubes in the arms, so it is a little different.

There does need to be something to differentiate the JR7-K and D. Quirks seem like the place to do it.

[Damien Tokala]

PGI, please break all the jenners, kthnxbai

[Sandslice]

Ertur, on 26 August 2014 - 10:57 AM, said:

Did the Stalker 4N have an extra module before the module system change? If so, then it should have one now. Missed that, though, and feel derpy. Edited OP.

All Stalkers, including Misery, had only one base module before change.

[Ertur]

Rizzel: You sure? Smurfy's site shows that is the 3H with 20 tube arm launchers. 4N has one 10 tube arm launcher.

Aso, if the 4N had the same modules as the others before, then it isn't a good comparison. The JR7-K had an extra module before the change, now it does not.

[FDJustin]

Kiiyor, on 25 August 2014 - 10:12 PM, said:

Quirk: CT reduced by 30%.

Hmmm...

Quirk: All Jenner CT's reduced by 30%. Jenner K crap by comparison again.

30% reduced what? Damage? If that's what you mean, you've got to be joking.


A module for a single missile hardpoint might be a bit much for compensation. Some sort of quirk might be appropriate. Not sure what though. 5% missile cooldown?

[TercieI]

Rizzelbizzeg, on 26 August 2014 - 11:07 AM, said:

The Stalker 4N is the only stalker with 20 tubes in the arms, so it is a little different.

There does need to be something to differentiate the JR7-K and D. Quirks seem like the place to do it.

Ertur, on 26 August 2014 - 11:24 AM, said:

Rizzel: You sure? Smurfy's site shows that is the 3H with 20 tube arm launchers. 4N has one 10 tube arm launcher.

Aso, if the 4N had the same modules as the others before, then it isn't a good comparison. The JR7-K had an extra module before the change, now it does not.

Yeah. That's the 3H. The 4N is the 3F minus one hard point and 25 degrees of torso twist. It has been in a situation very similar to the JR7-K's current situation (only much worse) for a long time.

Sandslice, on 26 August 2014 - 11:12 AM, said:

All Stalkers, including Misery, had only one base module before change.

And now all have 1/2/2.

Edited by Terciel1976, 26 August 2014 - 11:27 AM.

[DEMAX51]

Yup. Needs to be fixed... probably never will be.

i'd even be happy with something as simple as a 10% faster missile weapon cooldown (or less missile heat or something), to compensate for the missing hardpoint.

[Rizzelbizzeg]

Ertur, on 26 August 2014 - 11:24 AM, said:

Rizzel: You sure? Smurfy's site shows that is the 3H with 20 tube arm launchers. 4N has one 10 tube arm launcher.

Aso, if the 4N had the same modules as the others before, then it isn't a good comparison. The JR7-K had an extra module before the change, now it does not.

Terciel1976, on 26 August 2014 - 11:26 AM, said:

Yeah. That's the 3H. The 4N is the 3F minus one hard point and 25 degrees of torso twist. It has been in a situation very similar to the JR7-K's current situation (only much worse) for a long time.

And now all have 1/2/2.

Oh yep yep, you're right, that's the 3H I'm thinking of with the 20 tubes. Sorry about that, carry on

[Ph30nix]

the jenners are still in a good place even the worst of them is better then some other mechs at their job. So please get in line lol

[Satan n stuff]

Rizzelbizzeg, on 26 August 2014 - 11:07 AM, said:

The Stalker 4N is the only stalker with 20 tubes in the arms, so it is a little different.

There does need to be something to differentiate the JR7-K and D. Quirks seem like the place to do it.

That's the 3H. The 4N is the one that has exactly zero unique features.

Edited by Satan n stuff, 26 August 2014 - 12:21 PM.

[Funkadelic Mayhem]

It will be like the ravens leg hitboxes. They know it needs to be fixed, they just dont seam to care.

[Kiiyor]

FDJustin, on 26 August 2014 - 11:26 AM, said:

30% reduced what? Damage? If that's what you mean, you've got to be joking.


A module for a single missile hardpoint might be a bit much for compensation. Some sort of quirk might be appropriate. Not sure what though. 5% missile cooldown?

30% reduced CT size. Hmmm, I should probably have made that clearer.