22 replies to this topic

[Kyrie]

Hi all,

So now that PGI has divested IGP from involvement in MWO, it is reasonable to speculate that IGP has no other source of recurring revenue. I would then begin to wonder if IGP (7G Divertissement?) is going to liquidate and pull the plug on mwtactics.

Anyone have any solid info on whats going on over there? The mwtactics site has been down for a while now.

[Heffay]

Kyrie, on 10 September 2014 - 12:50 PM, said:

Hi all,

So now that PGI has divested IGP from involvement in MWO, it is reasonable to speculate that IGP has no other source of recurring revenue. I would then begin to wonder if IGP (7G Divertissement?) is going to liquidate and pull the plug on mwtactics.

Anyone have any solid info on whats going on over there? The mwtactics site has been down for a while now.

That is my guess. They will probably attempt to sell off the MWT assets as part of a liquidation process. But that's all guesswork right now. It's theoretically possible that they have enough of a nest egg that they can find new dev studios to publish, but that seems like pretty long odds.

[S3dition]

Heffay, on 10 September 2014 - 01:17 PM, said:

That is my guess. They will probably attempt to sell off the MWT assets as part of a liquidation process. But that's all guesswork right now. It's theoretically possible that they have enough of a nest egg that they can find new dev studios to publish, but that seems like pretty long odds.

Well, they owe all the founders a refund before selling off any assets. Failure to do so could result in forced liquidation and a criminal investigation into predatory business practices. Given that they continued to charge people for services they knew they couldn't perform, I doubt the Canadian government would ignore phone calls. If they can't issue refunds and criminal negligence can be proven, prison time isn't out of the question.

[Kyrie]

S3dition, on 10 September 2014 - 05:03 PM, said:

Well, they owe all the founders a refund before selling off any assets. Failure to do so could result in forced liquidation and a criminal investigation into predatory business practices. Given that they continued to charge people for services they knew they couldn't perform, I doubt the Canadian government would ignore phone calls. If they can't issue refunds and criminal negligence can be proven, prison time isn't out of the question.

It gets even more interesting as the start-up money for IGP/7G came from Canadian government investment fund. The "Fonds" something or other. Bound to raise a few eyebrows if government money is used to cheat people.

[S3dition]

Kyrie, on 10 September 2014 - 05:19 PM, said:

It gets even more interesting as the start-up money for IGP/7G came from Canadian government investment fund. The "Fonds" something or other. Bound to raise a few eyebrows if government money is used to cheat people.

Especially if they can tie a specific politician to it. That's something that can make headlines.

[Heffay]

S3dition, on 10 September 2014 - 05:03 PM, said:

Well, they owe all the founders a refund before selling off any assets. Failure to do so could result in forced liquidation and a criminal investigation into predatory business practices. Given that they continued to charge people for services they knew they couldn't perform, I doubt the Canadian government would ignore phone calls. If they can't issue refunds and criminal negligence can be proven, prison time isn't out of the question.

Not sure how bankruptcy works in Canada, but if it's the US the remaining assets are liquidated and divided up according to rights to the assets. Unfortunately, people who invested in the game are probably at the end of that line.

[El Bandito]

Allow me the moment to ROFL at the MWT founders.

[Fuligin]

Just FYI, I noticed that the gaming journalist that wrote this article said in the comments section that she has sent emails to inquire as to the status of MWT. Maybe she can get some answers.

http://www.rockpaper...comment-1670479

Edited by Fuligin, 10 September 2014 - 09:09 PM.

[S3dition]

Heffay, on 10 September 2014 - 06:49 PM, said:

Not sure how bankruptcy works in Canada, but if it's the US the remaining assets are liquidated and divided up according to rights to the assets. Unfortunately, people who invested in the game are probably at the end of that line.

But customers are not investors and are protected by consumer laws. You can't sell products you have no intention of producing. Willingly misleading consumers to buy vaporware is illegal.

[Heffay]

S3dition, on 11 September 2014 - 05:44 AM, said:

But customers are not investors and are protected by consumer laws. You can't sell products you have no intention of producing. Willingly misleading consumers to buy vaporware is illegal.

It will end up being a case of being morally right, but you still have to get in line with everyone else who is making a claim against the company assets. And the consumer is generally at the back of the line.

And proving that they had no intention of producing it will be difficult. If they have emails showing that they were actively trying to find a new dev studio, that would probably count as a good faith effort. If in December they said "well, Blue Lizard is out; let's just keep the pledge pages open until someone notices" then that is a case of willfully misleading customers. Proving that is going to make a lot of lawyers very rich.

[S3dition]

Heffay, on 11 September 2014 - 07:54 AM, said:

It will end up being a case of being morally right, but you still have to get in line with everyone else who is making a claim against the company assets. And the consumer is generally at the back of the line.

And proving that they had no intention of producing it will be difficult. If they have emails showing that they were actively trying to find a new dev studio, that would probably count as a good faith effort. If in December they said "well, Blue Lizard is out; let's just keep the pledge pages open until someone notices" then that is a case of willfully misleading customers. Proving that is going to make a lot of lawyers very rich.

I didn't say it was easy. Just that it would happen if you could prove it. Though the fact that they didn't inform anyone that the developers were terminated and continued to use their copyrighted logo afterwards is certainly a good start at proving willful misrepresentation.

[Ristle]

I'm hoping MWT makes a return in some form, since it had some nice ideas and potential going for it. Like it used a model similar to Hearthstone with the grinding and buying, which we all know how much of a success that model is due to the low cost of entry. As a founder in that game, I figured I would wait for it to get better optimized with patches and all that, then I come back and it's pretty much poofed into eternal site disabled and people are saying over here on MWO that it's been that way for a a little while now.

As far as refunding goes, I would imagine it would be long and drawn out in process, and go down similarly to how 38 Studios vs Rhode Island went. Depending on how they got funding, there could be loans to be repaid, and then there's the whole MW license agreement that I'm not sure anyone outside of PGI/IGP know the specifics of. Then further down the line would be us wacky founders, who possibly signed away any hope of seeing a return based on a multitude of factors. Best worst case scenario is possibly looking into class action for false advertisement or something, but that's overkill. I mean I know how much the average BT fan LOVES them some overkill, but that's more of a last ditch effort to recoup if the game is officially shuttered and money isn't returned, due to it never getting out of closed beta, and I believe the highest package was going to have the names in the credits ala MWO Legendary Tier reward.

This just looks to be one of those, "Wait and see" events. I'm hoping they're remaking it in an actually good engine with new dev at the moment, since it's not like MWT hasn't changed hands several times already.

[S3dition]

If you were an MWT founder, kiss your money goodbye. Even if they were ordered to issue refunds, they would just declare bankruptcy and vanish. You can't get blood out of a turnip, no matter how hard you squeeze.

[Heffay]

Kelly Zmak (head of IGP) is now running a gaming consulting company in California. I think that says everything it needs to say about the state of IGP.

http://performanceahead.com/about/

Edited by Heffay, 12 September 2014 - 05:22 PM.

[Country Gravy]

That's why they let PGI go. They are shutting to doors and selling off assets. MWT is dead. Too bad. I loved the concept and I am a sucker for TB combat. It could have been a good representation of the TT game with a collectible card game thrown it. There is money I am not getting back, but at least I threw my support toward the type of BT game I would like to play.

[JakeEDogge]

Makes me so glad I never wasted my hard earned dollars.

[Nightfire]

Fuligin, on 10 September 2014 - 09:09 PM, said:

Just FYI, I noticed that the gaming journalist that wrote this article said in the comments section that she has sent emails to inquire as to the status of MWT. Maybe she can get some answers.

http://www.rockpaper...comment-1670479

Sorry but anything relevant you had to say was instantly lost by linking to Rock Paper Shotgun!
I will never go to that site again. #gamergate #notyourshield

[AzureDragoon]

I was interested, but the Closed beta appeared to be a perpetual beta, with lacking updates turned me away from signing up. Seems I made the right call, and feel sorry for the Founders.
Remember, according to Blue Lizard Games, when they reached out to IGP (not that I want to forgive them for hiding that fact from people for 9 months that they weren't part of the project anymore), they said that IGP was supposed to make an announcement this week....

Well, it's Saturday, and I believe this forum post from someone who managed to stay logged in on the forums sums up the frustration:

https://www.mwtactic...off-the-lights/

Ladies and Gentlemen, I encourage you all to start submitting tips to news sites, critics, and so on.. Somethings going on, and I don't like the evidence I'm seeing, I think it's time you all start getting some help to bring this issue to widespread public attention. Maybe one of them might be interested in doing so.

I actively encourage someone who worked with the project, to also talk to us here, I think the fans deserve to hear some answers to what's going on.

If it's cancelled, I think all money spent by customers, should be refunded, as the promised finished product was not released.

If it's not cancelled, then get some Devs who want to work with the fans, and actuallly make, and complete the game!

Edited by AzureDragoon, 13 September 2014 - 10:23 AM.

[JayKay17]

If anyone is still interested and still doesn't know. IGP filed for bankrupcy on Oktober 1st.
You can find more info in wikipedia. http://en.wikipedia....Game_Publishing

Edited by JayKay17, 17 December 2014 - 11:46 AM.

[Gwydion Ward]

JayKay17, on 17 December 2014 - 11:45 AM, said:

If anyone is still interested and still doesn't know. IGP filed for bankrupcy on Oktober 1st.
You can find more info in wikipedia. http://en.wikipedia....Game_Publishing

Was just about to post about this myself. (as i was a founder for it under the 'lowest' tier). The game did look like it held promis.. and it 'seemed' to be getting better in terms of how it ran during its beta/alpha phase..

But yea... its up for sale as part of the Bankruptcy agreement: http://raymondchabot...for-sale/26192.