114 replies to this topic

[Helsbane]

Why so much hate for the AC2? I can't spend a few million Cbills for my old pre nerf RoF?

[Carrie Harder]

It makes me a sad panda as well. My Shad 2H will continue to collect dust. :\

Edited by Carrie Harder, 10 September 2014 - 03:11 PM.

[Russ Bullock]

Helsbane, on 10 September 2014 - 03:09 PM, said:

Why so much hate for the AC2? I can't spend a few million Cbills for my old pre nerf RoF?

We are taking a tally of missing weapon modules now and will let you know when they will be added.

[Carrie Harder]

Russ Bullock, on 10 September 2014 - 03:11 PM, said:

We are taking a tally of missing weapon modules now and will let you know when they will be added.

There is hope for the dakka after all!

Edited by Carrie Harder, 10 September 2014 - 03:13 PM.

[Helsbane]

Russ Bullock, on 10 September 2014 - 03:11 PM, said:

We are taking a tally of missing weapon modules now and will let you know when they will be added.

Nice. My Jager DD and Shd 2H are waiting for me to pull the tarps off them again.

[Carrie Harder]

Russ Bullock, on 10 September 2014 - 03:11 PM, said:

We are taking a tally of missing weapon modules now and will let you know when they will be added.

To make things slightly fasterer, the ones I see missing so far are:

Range:
PPC
ERPPC
C-ERPPC
Gauss
C-Gauss
ERLL
LRM5
LRM10
LRM15
LRM20
C-LRM5
C-LRM10
C-LRM15
C-LRM20
UAC/5
C-SSRM2
C-SSRM4
C-LB 2-X
C-LB 5-X
C-LB 20-X

Cooldown:
AC/2
UAC/5
C-UAC/2
C-SSRM4
C-SSRM6
C-LB 2-X
C-LB 5-X
C-LB 20-X

I didn't list MGs or Flamers because they're continuous fire (can't benefit from cooldown buff?).

Edited by Carrie Harder, 10 September 2014 - 03:20 PM.

[Wintersdark]

Helsbane, on 10 September 2014 - 03:09 PM, said:

Why so much hate for the AC2? I can't spend a few million Cbills for my old pre nerf RoF?

I've always wondered why they keep bashing on the poor AC2. It's always been the weakest of the regular autocannons, requiring constant facetime... it get's ravaged by ghost heat (totally unnecessarily, as it's never been an alpha weapon), and yet it still sees nigh constant nerfs.

I'd suspect we won't get a cooldown module for the AC2, though, because with Fast Fire and such, there's a danger of getting to close to .5s. This leads to the AC2 generating ghost heat even though you're not firing enough weapons to formally do it.

[Carrie Harder]

Wintersdark, on 10 September 2014 - 03:19 PM, said:

I've always wondered why they keep bashing on the poor AC2. It's always been the weakest of the regular autocannons, requiring constant facetime... it get's ravaged by ghost heat (totally unnecessarily, as it's never been an alpha weapon), and yet it still sees nigh constant nerfs.

I'd suspect we won't get a cooldown module for the AC2, though, because with Fast Fire and such, there's a danger of getting to close to .5s. This leads to the AC2 generating ghost heat even though you're not firing enough weapons to formally do it.

If my maths are correct, fast fire + level 5 module would be somewhere around 0.59s cooldown.

EDIT: Approximately 0.5976s.

Edited by Carrie Harder, 10 September 2014 - 03:25 PM.

[Helsbane]

Hey Russ, while you guys are at it, how about a module for the UAC5 that reduces the chance of it jamming -or- shortens the duration of jam. Either works for me....

[White Bear 84]

While we are at it, can we get a gauss 'armor' buff module that increases gauss crits?

[Koniving]

Helsbane, on 10 September 2014 - 03:09 PM, said:

Why so much hate for the AC2? I can't spend a few million Cbills for my old pre nerf RoF?

Ghost heat.





You'd trigger it if it fired much faster.
God knows you can trigger it accidentally back just by using the AC/2 before the recent nerfs.


Now, with a Dragon that has the 10% faster firing ballistics quirk and NO unlocks (which means no +5% additionally faster firing rate)... you can fire fine. But if you add in the +5% elite...and just regular fire occasionally triggers ghost heat. Slap on a faster firing rate module and bam, AC/2s become worthless (due to ghost heat).

....Brilliant idea: Remove ghost heat!

Sucks.

[Wintersdark]

Helsbane, on 10 September 2014 - 03:25 PM, said:

Hey Russ, while you guys are at it, how about a module for the UAC5 that reduces the chance of it jamming -or- shortens the duration of jam. Either works for me....

I'd really like to see some more interesting limited use modules.

Say, spread reduction for LBX/cLBX AC's; maybe SRM's too?
LRM Speed increase AND flight path levelling (so they're faster, but worse at arcing over cover - make them more direct fire.)
PPC min-range removal, but makes them explosive as per Gauss Rifle.

Such things... Changes that make weapons more interesting, provide more options, but don't necessarily flat out make them better.

Koniving, on 10 September 2014 - 03:30 PM, said:

Ghost heat.


<snipped great videos for brevity>

You'd trigger it if it fired much faster.
God knows you can trigger it accidentally back just by using the AC/2 before the recent nerfs.


Now, with a Dragon that has the 10% faster firing ballistics quirk and NO unlocks (which means no +5% additionally faster firing rate)... you can fire fine. But if you add in the +5% elite...and just regular fire occasionally triggers ghost heat. Slap on a faster firing rate module and bam, AC/2s become worthless (due to ghost heat).

....Brilliant idea: Remove ghost heat!

Sucks.

Exactly. Poor AC/2's. I loved them so much, even if they were technically bad.

[Helsbane]

Yeah, I was already using 3x and 4x AC2s prior to the nerf, and even with ghost heat, racking up 600 - 900 points per game. I never used macros, which are what brought about the ghost heat penalty for the AC2 in the first place. I just want my AC2s back, even if it costs me a pair of weapon module slots to get them.

[Seraphic Law]

Russ Bullock, on 10 September 2014 - 03:11 PM, said:

We are taking a tally of missing weapon modules now and will let you know when they will be added.

Why were some of the weapons excluded in the first place?

[Helsbane]

Seraphic Law, on 11 September 2014 - 04:59 PM, said:

Why were some of the weapons excluded in the first place?

That's what I was wondering as well. I mean, it's not like there are a lot of weapons to begin with. Smacks of laziness or carelessness, and neither is a good reason. It would be like me leaving out 10% of the drawers in a new kitchen design and telling the client, "Ah, I'll get to it at some point...."

[DAYLEET]

Ive been using dual ac2 for the last week, you are raining hell on someone as if you were using extremely fast lrm but you dont need a lock. The second you start plinking someone he stops whatever he was doing for either cover or shooting at you, you can get away with shooting any other ac but an ac4 puts too much pressure on someone, thats not a weakness btw. Last thing i want is see them buffd.

[Y E O N N E]

Actually, allowing ACs to rattle the enemy even more would be good. Break the pinpoint-strike + twist play by screwing the target's ability to aim six ways from Sunday. Balance it by having impulse fall off with range, just like damage.

It's a legitimate strategy.

[DAYLEET]

Yeonne Greene, on 11 September 2014 - 09:12 PM, said:

Actually, allowing ACs to rattle the enemy even more would be good. Break the pinpoint-strike + twist play by screwing the target's ability to aim six ways from Sunday. Balance it by having impulse fall off with range, just like damage.

It's a legitimate strategy.

Oh yeeeaaa, increasing the impulse will totaly screw your ability to shoot, wait, no it wont, it stunlock your opponent.

Stunlock is not a legitimate strategy, it's a crutch some sadomaso insist on using.

[DONTOR]

I used to LOVE AC2s, it was a weapon system that truly needed skill to do well with, no huge alpha to quickly finish mechs, so you had to be extrememly accurate. Not to mention exposed as you hit the enemy, which didnt used to be a problem since you could easily out-range everything but gauss rifles. Now it is actually better suited as a pair for brawling coupled with lasers or a cooler running AC weapon.

I truly hope they restore the AC2 somewhat, it desperatley needs some love.

Edited by DONTOR, 12 September 2014 - 08:40 AM.

[Y E O N N E]

DAYLEET, on 12 September 2014 - 08:23 AM, said:

Oh yeeeaaa, increasing the impulse will totaly screw your ability to shoot, wait, no it wont, it stunlock your opponent.

Stunlock is not a legitimate strategy, it's a crutch some sadomaso insist on using.

There's no such thing as stunlock in MWO because here are no weapons that prevent you from moving, which is what stunlock is. There are weapons that obscure your view with way too many particles (read: LRMs) and that's bogus. All I want is for your cross-hairs to wobble so feverishly under fire from multiple ACs that you can't really aim without making an educated guess. As long as the DPS is appreciably higher than alpha-striking several front-loaded weapons every 4-5 seconds, you can keep the target pinned behind cover while faster allies move in on him. That's the idea, and that is a legitimate strategy.

Recoil mechanics and impulse fall-off would be mandatory for balancing puropses, however.

Edit: Actually, there is stunlock in MWO but you have to be legged for it to go into effect.

Edited by Yeonne Greene, 12 September 2014 - 02:30 PM.