632 replies to this topic

[Garandos]

As suggested in the fresh "electing a player council of sorts" how about we do the nominations there? So the process does not get lost within a cross discussion of different things?

[Khobai]

Id be ok with NARC never running out of power if there was a notification youve been NARCd, some way to remove it other than damage: like an EMP pulse consumable, and if indirect LRM accuracy/screenshake was nerfed.

[Shredhead]

Rustic Dude, on 12 September 2014 - 11:40 AM, said:

Man, what did goons do to you? I reckon that they are pretty funny and helpful fellows when they are not squawking.

I made a mistake, and I am sorry. It was a generalisation that was not deserved for the biggest part of this group that I found was a funny benefit for the game when they were around. It's only some individuals in their ranks that I really don't like. Post edited accordingly.

ThisMachineKillsFascists, on 12 September 2014 - 11:41 AM, said:

You are not in the possion to judge over ppl´s bann as there was never a offical announcement for their bann.

Heck even most of those meantioned ppl do not know exactly why they have been banned.

Its cool that you do not need those ppl to speak for you but other ppl on the so called " island" might.

These two persons are some of the biggest jerks that were around in this community. We want 80 % approval for a proposition, leave those out of the discussion please.

Stalkerr, on 12 September 2014 - 11:43 AM, said:

Please don't mess this up. This is about making the game we all care about as amazing as possible, not about anyone's personal feelings about individuals/groups. If we don't work together, we'll fail separately.

See above.

[TheMagician]

I think of the original group that started kicking around the idea of a player's council, and ended up sending in a proposal, I'm the only one left playing (as far as I can tell anyhow). I'm curious if some will poke their head around again. I'll look for our original proposal. But, its important if we form such a council, that it represents the wide interests of the community. Thus, made up of competitive, and non-competitive players, as well as number crunchers, and those just passionate about the game.

But we also don't necessarily need a council or spokesperson to get ideas in front of the community. It just needs a player to start a well-written post with a great idea and then if enough people are interested in it, it can make its way to being voted on without necessarily needing a full council or 'leader'.

Edited by TheMagician, 12 September 2014 - 11:54 AM.

[Stormwolf]

Gas Guzzler, on 12 September 2014 - 11:47 AM, said:

I like the ECM and BAP changes... NARC never running out of power is scary though.

It usually gets destroyed in a LRM barrage anyway, just hope that it doesn't get stuck on your CT.

[TopDawg]

Agelmar, on 12 September 2014 - 11:40 AM, said:

PGI picks a focus group with community input.

Focus Group is comprised of the following:
IS Light
IS Med
IS Heavy
IS Assault
Clan Light
Clan Medium
Clan Heavy
Clan Assault

Each FG or Class Advocate is responsible for all chassis and changes (perks, hitboxes etc) and will work together to filter and funnel suggestions to the devs. Topics like ECM changes that impact all weight classes will be worked with through the group as a whole. RP players, PUG players, and competitive players should all make the group.

Perhaps 'elect' 'appoint' whichever one of each (RP, PUG, competitive) for each weight class. Numbers may get a bit unruly, but the idea is equal representation. Otherwise, a good post!

[Star Captain Brofist]

Bottom line is that they have to set us up for success and actually do the things they promise. There isn't much good history of that.

[Votanin FleshRender]

Tolkien, on 12 September 2014 - 11:45 AM, said:

Why would we believe you this time when you've shown utter disdain for the obvious will of 90+% of the community before?


Seriously, tell us all why this time is different? Is it because we have you by the short and curlies on your new game and you're finally realizing you need your community more than it needs you?

Unban vassago rain, unban roadbeer, unban sandpit, unban victor mason - these, standing cow of the DHB and Anders of the goons will be the player council, and you will listen to their decisions.

Sandpit seemed alright, but I've just browsed the reddit for the first time, didn't even know who most of those fellas were, and I gotta say, my takeaway was to believe Morson, Anders and co. would purposely sabotage the process. They have zero interest in seeing PGI succeed/repair the community at all.

[Heffay]

Not sure if it's been brought up before, but if you're going to do a poll I recommend getting a polling tool included in the game client. Maybe query a percentage of people who log in that are out of the recruit stage, with a link back to the forums where a Comnet thread is posted for the discussion so people can review.

That way you get a view of the player base, not the forum base. It's a significant distinction.

Don't forget the "don't give a F" option.

[Wrathful-Khan]

A o D, on 12 September 2014 - 11:46 AM, said:

However, demanding an 80% margin of concensus is ludicrous. No legitimate political body on Earth can make up their mind with that level of unanimity, much less a bunch of neckbeared stompy robot lovers like us.

This guy nailed it. The chances of an 80% concensus on ECM are about the same as Transverse raising 500k in the next 27 days

[ThisMachineKillsFascists]

Shredhead, on 12 September 2014 - 11:52 AM, said:

These two persons are some of the biggest jerks that were around in this community. We want 80 % approval for a proposition, leave those out of the discussion please.

See above.

Your post becomes more valid when you insult them as "the biggest jerks"

10/10

Edited by ThisMachineKillsFascists, 12 September 2014 - 11:56 AM.

[WerewolfX]

If we are doing recommendations. My vote is either with Bishop Steiner or Koniving being the voice and as a solution to future things that PGI institute a initiative for a player run council. Works for eve can work for here.

[Gwaihir]

Time to dust off my spreadsheets.

[Alex Warden]

before doing anything with ecm, rework the LRM system completely... blindshot streak LRM are not any more "TT style" than the ECM in mwo...

Edited by Alex Warden, 12 September 2014 - 12:01 PM.

[AidenDark]

Russ Bullock, on 12 September 2014 - 10:57 AM, said:

Okay how about this, this is what many of you have been waiting for:

Well first a question: Do you think you the community can come to an agreed upon consensus? One in which if the changes are implemented everyone says great job PGI on listening to us now we feel great about ECM and your ability to listen to feedback?

If the answer is Yes then I suggest the following:

You the community decide how your going to present a proposal, nominate a peer that you feel has the best handle on this, put together your own player council whatever you like but present a proposal that your peers vote on. The vote would likely need to be far greater than just 51% in favor. Perhaps something more like 80+%

At that point PGI will analyze the proposal, if we see any technical problems or balance problems that we feel perhaps you didnt see, we will point those items out to you. Then if necessary you can adjust your proposal and put it to a vote again, if successful PGI will again analyze and repeat if necessary until we have a final design solution for implementation.

PGI will then communicate how long it will take to implement with full explanation as to why, and we will patch the changes in upon the agreed upon delivery date. Once complete if this whole process has gone smoothly and civily we will proceed with doing things like this far more frequently or at least for other areas of the product that are controversial.

What do you say?

Did you guys take notice of Gaijin's Player council thing after their own forum issues (CM Scarper and others being hostile towards players)

Either way I'd say this is a step in the right direction for getting things fixed. Call me skeptically optimistic.

EDIT: I will state as a further sign of goodwill you should remove all bans also as Gaijin did. Some people banned may have been trolls but I'm sure plenty were just very vocal in wanting the game fixed.

Edited by AidenDark, 12 September 2014 - 12:05 PM.

[Shredhead]

Indiandream, on 12 September 2014 - 11:56 AM, said:

This guy nailed it. The chances of an 80% concensus on ECM are about the same as Transverse raising 500k in the next 27 days

I disagree. Getting 80% for a final consensus is absolutely doable.
Imo we should split forming a council and finding a good, working ECM proposal. A council is not needed to organize it at this point, it can pick up the stuff we prepared once they are formed.

[Livewyr]

Alex Warden, on 12 September 2014 - 11:59 AM, said:

before doing anything with ecm, rework the LRM system completely... streak LRM are not any more "TT style" than the ECM in mwo...

That is going to be a part of it. (LRMs are as central to the ECM equation as ECM itself.)

[SerEdvard]

Thanks, Russ! Get ready for thread explosion in 3, 2, 1....

Homeless Bill, on 12 September 2014 - 11:24 AM, said:

I'm shocked and pleased to see the offer. IW is complicated, so I don't know if we'll be able to pull it off, but thanks for giving us a chance for once.

For what it's worth, I nominate Homeless Bill to represent the community on this issue.

I posted this idea a while back, but here is my idea for a mild but significant rework of ECM:

- All Light and Medium mech variants can now carry ECM. Heavy and Assault mechs cannot carry ECM.
- Split ECM into 3 modes: Disrupt, Protect, and Counter
- DISRUPT Mode: Prevents any enemy within [180m] from acquiring missile locks and disrupts the minimap. Also prevents enemies within [180m] of an ECM in Disrupt mode from gathering target info (but does not prevent them from targetting the mech). However, an ECM in Disrupt mode will show up as a "ping" on the minimap of enemies and friendlies within the [180m] radius.
- PROTECT Mode: Forms a protective bubble of [180m] that protects friendlies within the radius. This bubble shows up in the minimap of all friendlies as a semi-transparent circle around the ECM. All friendlies within the radius of an ECM in Protect mode cannot be targetted indirectly by enemies (but does not block LOS targetting of friendlies by enemies), and missile locks by enemies are 50% slower.
- COUNTER Mode: Counters the effects of all enemy ECM in Disrupt or Protect mode within a [200m] radius.

ECM is currently too powerful for its size/weight, making it a "must have" for any mech with an ECM slot. This will reduce the effectiveness of ECM as a "hard counter" against LRMs, and introduce some penalties if the ECM is used to disrupt LRMs. This also gives Lights and Mediums a more important role in IW, since all variants can now carry it but the effectiveness of each one is much more muted.

Finally, I believe LRMs have had to be buffed too much in order to make them useful in a world where a hard counter to them exists (which is why missile spam is a problem when a team does not have ECM), so LRMs will need a nerf to bring them back in line. I propose something along the lines of the following:
- Reduce damage by all LRMs by 10% (back down to 1.0 dam per missile).
- Recycle time of LRMs reduced by 15-25%.

Edited by SerEdvard, 12 September 2014 - 12:05 PM.

[Amro One]

I vote for Sean Lang, he knows what the heck he is talking about.

Otherwise we don't need no player counsel. If we followed player banter from beta, this would be worse off then what Russ envisioned for a reboot of MW.

Last thing we need is a bunch of old timers from 12 years ago telling us how awesome MW4 was.
Clanner need to be buffed, IS needs to be nerfed blah blah blah bring us are rifleman and marauder crap.

3rd person view actually helped bring players in though the community said no.
No one complained about 2x PPC and Guass boats, but they changed it and the game is better now.

Leave it to Russ, he the man.

Point proven.

[Nicholas Carlyle]

I'd like to see Paul in this thread, and something from Russ on that 3PV poll.

I can't just let things totally go. There needs to be more than just a post saying "get me 80%".

This isn't on us, it's on PGI.