64 replies to this topic

[UnsafePilot]

skorpionet, on 12 September 2014 - 04:26 AM, said:

95% free ?!!? Mech Bays are for free in your country?

I didn't realize that the free mech bay comp's were region locked. That's a bummer, which country are you in?

[Johnny Z]

This is a big year for Mechwarrior thats for sure. Lets see what the next few months brings. If its as good as everyone is saying then yes, an A+ or 10/10 for the year is a given.

With an intro at start up and maybe a load screen or two and the addition of faction wars and some polish to ui2.0 they should call the reviewers back and see how much higher than a 7 they will get.

Edited by Johnny Z, 12 September 2014 - 04:33 AM.

[Torgun]

Khan Warlock Kell, on 12 September 2014 - 04:18 AM, said:

So UI 2.0 even if does have its flaws is nothing ? The clans arriving is nothing ? Unit creation is nothing ? The imminent arrival of Community Warfare is nothing ? That's just the major arrivals.

Seems an awful lot of nothing to me !!

UI2.0 is still full of flaws and not really an upgrade to the UI we had previously. I'm still staring at all the trial mechs mixed in with my own, which is simply crap. Clans is just more mechs, and as I said it's the only thing that comes at a steady stream. Unit creation is just a tag tag you put in front of your name, that you'd think it's progress worth mentioning should tell you how little has actually happened. And please don't add CW as part of their track record, as of now it's still just talk and doesn't exist. And don't get me into how many times CW has been promised to arrive...

[Brut4ce]

Torgun, on 12 September 2014 - 03:47 AM, said:

I recall when A+ actually used to mean something.

It still does but sometimes its meaning is a bit "scewed"

As for the OP, in support to your point i am offering you a "nerdy" dance for winning the Internetz



<S>

[BLOOD WOLF]

El Bandito, on 12 September 2014 - 02:25 AM, said:

Being free is not enough. LoL, DoTA2 and TF2 offers 100% of the core content for free, except skins, but they still earn far more money than MWO due to much more affordable price scheme--which directly contributes to player retention. You spend money, you feel obligated to stay and play. But with current prices on Hero and even regular mechs in MWO, or even simple bloody color pallette, an average player will feel no such urge to pay and stay committed.

[Bishop Steiner]

I'm still a ways off from "pat on the back" territory, but I am certainly past the "holding bitter recriminations, for slight, both real and imagined" from two years ago.

They have my attention, and barring any major screw ups moving forward, probably some of my money.

Report Card will come AFTER CW implementation.

But the Progress Report is "Improved".

[Bacl]

Kilo 40, on 12 September 2014 - 02:44 AM, said:

MWO is a completely different beast than LoL, DoTA2 and TF2 due to shear numbers of players. MWO is, and most likely always will be a niche game.

Think of the absolute best F2P MWO game you can imagine. I mean perfect. Now picture the size of it's player base. If you imagine it even remotely close to any of those games, then you're wrong. Those games are simply to big to compare to a game like this.

Not that I disagree with you that pricing needs some changes, and better pricing will keep more players.

If it was polished and had much more feature it wouldnt be a niche game since everyone would be able to jump in and give it a shot, from there they like it or not.

Now its a niche game because it is overpriced, incomplete, complicated and repetitive so only die hard fans ( well mostly) will be able to actually invest and support the current state of the game.

PGI have a ton of work to do...

Edited by Bacl, 12 September 2014 - 04:53 AM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Bacl, on 12 September 2014 - 04:52 AM, said:

If it was polished and had much more feature it wouldnt be a niche game since everyone would be able to jump in and give it a shot, from there they like it or not.

Now its a niche game because it is overpriced, incomplete, complicated and repetitive so only die hard fans ( well mostly) will be able to actually invest and support the current state of the game.

PGI have a ton of work to do...

It's a niche IP. Even the Successful MW2, 3 and 4 where niche. This game, this IP will never be some sweeping WoW, even if everything were free.

Never has been. Only way to make the learning curve accessible enough to even start getting it big is to water it down even more into MechAssault territory.

Plenty of affordable to free games out there. Few ever get big. Those that do, usually belong to either and uber huge IP, are advertised the heck out of and or are super easy to jump right in and get started.

None of those are true of this IP.

[Khan Warlock Kell]

I haven't ignored the flaws in the game, or the flaws in PGI's communication with the community, I have on numerous times pointed them out. There is still so much that needs to be done to turn this into a truly triple A title. what I am attempting to do is compare what we have now compared to what we had from PGI in 2013.

The truth is what was and has been achieved in the two years is just poles apart. 2013 Started with the promise of this amazing firework show that was jus going to blow out socks of, and what we actually got was damp squib banger and a sparkler that lasted thirty seconds, very little worth mention achieved. 2014 seems like PGI might actually have a firework show actually worth watching, from the preparations we have seen so far this year. so the A+ is to recognise what they have achieved this year. Not to beat them for what they failed with last year.

Edited by Khan Warlock Kell, 12 September 2014 - 05:06 AM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Khan Warlock Kell, on 12 September 2014 - 05:04 AM, said:

I haven't ignored the flaws in the game, or the flaws in PGI's communication with the community, I have on numerous times pointed them out. There is still so much that needs to be done to turn this into a truly triple A title. what I am attempting to do is compare what we have now compared to what we had from PGI in 2013.

The truth is what was and has been achieved in the two years is just poles apart. 2013 Started with the promise of this amazing firework show that was jus going to blow out socks of, and what we actually got was damp squib banger and a sparkler that lasted thirty seconds, very little worth mention achieved. 2014 seems like PGI might actually have a firework show actually worth watching, from the preparations we have seen so far this year. so the A+ is to recognise what they have achieved this year. Not to beat them for what they failed with last year.

Well, we certainly agree that 2013 was a colossal failure. Of course, what none of us actually know is all the reasons why, we just can see the Affects, not the cause. Even modest success in 2014 would seem a huge step up from the low of the preceding year (still trying to figure out the whole Launch Event dud).

I certainly think they have done rather well this year, overall (de-syncs are driving me buggy, as is server connection issues in general...grrrrr), and while not wanting to dampen enthusiasm, just want to "keep it real" at the same time, as cheerleading really is not a help, long term.

Still I appreciate the positive nature of the OP, even if I am not quite willing to be as generous in my ecvaluation.

[Blacksoul1987]

for what its worth I think they are doing a respectable job this year so far. still a long way to go though.

[Joseph Mallan]

ThatDawg, on 12 September 2014 - 02:03 AM, said:

Biscuits.

... Kick Buttowski?

[WintermuteOmega]

I think they made a valiant effort as of late.

And yes, the whole pricing-Model needs adjustments. I don't think the consumables are earning much money (maybe in competitive play), the colors are so expansive i just stick with the few i got free or bought early on. Premium time is a nice way to go, but with enough Money in the bank isn't wort much. I like the Mech-Packages, but i have been lucky enough to have enough expandable income to afford them, not everyone is so lucky. I don't know how PGI can archive a viable business-model without breaking too many eggs. And comparing MWO to LOL or other hugely successful games is not quite Fair imho. But then again i still can't understand how Path of Exile is making money since i had really search for something to buy to honor the Devs with some Money for a really nice F2P game.

[Satan n stuff]

skorpionet, on 12 September 2014 - 04:26 AM, said:

95% free ?!!? Mech Bays are for free in your country?

You don't need mechbays, they are a convenience not a necessity. If you sell off mechs you don't intend to play again soon, you can grind your way through every chassis without ever being short on cbills. After a while you'll have enough to buy, upgrade and sell mechs whenever you feel like it so you won't even need to keep mechs you aren't currently playing.

Edited by Satan n stuff, 12 September 2014 - 05:45 AM.

[Bacl]

Bishop Steiner, on 12 September 2014 - 04:57 AM, said:

It's a niche IP. Even the Successful MW2, 3 and 4 where niche. This game, this IP will never be some sweeping WoW, even if everything were free.

Never has been. Only way to make the learning curve accessible enough to even start getting it big is to water it down even more into MechAssault territory.

Plenty of affordable to free games out there. Few ever get big. Those that do, usually belong to either and uber huge IP, are advertised the heck out of and or are super easy to jump right in and get started.

None of those are true of this IP.

I dont agree to this, giant robots are pretty universal, again you like i or not. The way you build your mechs is actually easy, yes the UI 2.0 is making it overly difficult and counter intuitive but bring back UI1 this would suddenly be '' oh so thats how its done''. Getting rid of hidden or poorly explained mechanics like ghost heat/ weapon linkage, fall damage per classes/altitude NARC targeting or targeted.

A lot of F2P games out there are way more complicated than this in essence but having better presentation layout and explications really makes the difference.

Another major fact is the way the game is, it is a "F2P" that you download online, to dont have retail boxes in stores so in the case of MW2,3,4,Merc etc. You couldnt try them without actually buying them. MWO you download, try it then you make your mind about it.

I doubt it will ever be like LoL or WoT but the game itself has the potential to please much more than its die hard fans, yet again its how PGI exploit the potential the problem.

[El Bandito]

^This. Bishop you are very mistaken about the whole "niche" factor. Previous MW games were designed to be single-player focused games that had to be bought in the first place. MWO is a F2P MP only game designed to attract not only the core MW fans, but also casual players. And it is doing bad on the casual base in part due to the expensive MC cost per everything, bar the mech bay.

Edited by El Bandito, 12 September 2014 - 06:16 AM.

[Mawai]

El Bandito, on 12 September 2014 - 01:51 AM, said:

Current pricing scheme is still bad for player retention.

I'd have to disagree. You can play and enjoy MWO without buying anything ... that is the point. How does the pricing scheme affect retention?

Retention is affected by a desire to keep playing the game ... how do they address this?
- make the game not boring after 50, 100, 500, 1000, 10,000 matches
- to do that they need to supply reasons to play your next match (CW) and some reward from each match that isn't exactly the same as the last match (i.e. skill trees)

How much stuff costs only affects folks who don't want to spend the price of a dinner or a couple of cups of coffee to reduce the grind in a game.

What is the ONLY thing you are likely to have to pay for if you play MWO for any length of time? Mechbays ... that is it. You can go a long way with just 4 and PGI has had a number of competitions recently giving away mech bays ... but that is the only thing that you might have to buy to be able to get access to all aspects of the game. (Hero mechs, camo, colours, cockpit items and premium time are ALL totally optional).

I see lots of folks wishing things were cheaper ... they'd love everything to cost $1.00 then they might buy that hero mech they have wanted instead of paying $15.00 for it. However, if hero mechs were $1 ... MWO would be out of business since they would not sell 15x more of them ... or 30x more if they wanted to double revenues. There just aren't that many players. In addition, rarity tends to make things more attractive ... its how they managed to sell $500.00 gold mechs ... if the prices were so low that everyone would have one then that might hurt sales.

If you want a hero mech or other content ... save up ... put aside that one latte a week for three weeks and buy a hero mech. Give up one coffee a day at starbucks for 2 weeks. Skip going out to see a movie on the weekend. Don't hit the bar on Saturday night one week.

Some folks will say "but I can't afford what MWO costs to buy stuff" ... that is a bit disingenuous since everyone playing MWO has a decent computer and high speed internet access ... and if they really have no way to save from their budget the cost of a meal at a restaurant to pay for content ... then MWO is still F2P ... and they don't really need that paid content anyway.

Do I get as much enjoyment from buying a hero mech as I do from going out to see a movie ... yes! Far more actually since the movie is over in 2 hours and the mech lasts for years.

MWO costs what it costs ... presumably they used market data to come up with the pricing scheme ... but lowering those prices won't keep more folks playing the game. Making the game more interesting and compelling will keep folks playing.

Edited by Mawai, 12 September 2014 - 06:50 AM.

[CMDR Sunset Shimmer]

El Bandito, on 12 September 2014 - 02:01 AM, said:

Current pricing scheme is even worse for keeping new players, BTW. If they do not drop money, even $5, new players will not feel invested enough to stay, and go for other FTP mecha games, where pricing is better.

what other f2p mecha game? because so far as I know, the only other F2P mecha game is Hawken, and it can barely be classified as a mecha game.

[El Bandito]

Mawai, on 12 September 2014 - 06:49 AM, said:

I'd have to disagree. You can play and enjoy MWO without buying anything ... that is the point. How does the pricing scheme affect retention?

Players are more likely to purchase something with real cash, cheaper the price is. And the said player is much more likely to stick around and play the game if he had spent some money in the first place. F2P business 101.

Only reason aside from nostalgia, that I am still here playing this boring arena game over and over is because I spent more money on MWO than any other title, and that in someway makes me feel obligated to continue playing it. If I hadn't spent any money I would have already forgotten about this game.

Flash Frame, on 12 September 2014 - 07:40 AM, said:

what other f2p mecha game? because so far as I know, the only other F2P mecha game is Hawken, and it can barely be classified as a mecha game.

Why? Elaborate.

Hawken features mechs as core playing content. Thus it is a mecha game.

Being arcadey does not exclude it from being a mecha game.

Edited by El Bandito, 12 September 2014 - 08:13 AM.

[TLBFestus]

Khan Warlock Kell, on 12 September 2014 - 03:33 AM, said:

"Stuff".....

WE need to judge them on what happens from now on in.

I agree with the sentiment of your post, but just so you know, I think many of us ARE judging them on what happens from now on in.

However, it's tough to forget all the mistakes and poor choices of the past all that quickly, at least for some of us. Think of it as a Scale;





Right now PGI is in "credibility" deficit with a lot of the community. Sure they have improved, are seemingly improving, but the past errors still outweigh the current improved situation.

Until they level those scales, and even after that, many will not be willing to trust them or move on from past mistakes/insults.
Even if we are willing to do our best to ignore or forgive the past there is still a tendency to go "here we go again" much more quickly than if they had a great track record with us from the get go.

In short, PGI is going to have accept that they are going to continue to have to slog through distrust and accusations for some time yet until they can "balance the scales".