56 replies to this topic

[XX Sulla XX]

Well if they added this they would have to do it in a way that did not take a lot of extra programming. The simple way to do it is this. When you kill say 200 Timbers Wolves you know have the option of using one. It should be a large number and not something quick and easy to get. One downside would be popular mechs would be easier to get by far. So if you really wanted an Adder it might take a very very long time

[Syrkres]

XX Sulla XX, on 13 September 2014 - 11:07 AM, said:

Well if they added this they would have to do it in a way that did not take a lot of extra programming. The simple way to do it is this. When you kill say 200 Timbers Wolves you know have the option of using one. It should be a large number and not something quick and easy to get. One downside would be popular mechs would be easier to get by far. So if you really wanted an Adder it might take a very very long time

As a programmer of 30+ years (yes early 80's ) I don't think it would be to much to add.

Tracking Kills:

• Again They already track your kills, so they simply need to add an array/list that when you kill a mech it pops the name in there. They could even have it automatically increment your kill count without having to store it (getting rid of the need to store and check at end of match).
  
• At the end of the match it simply checks if the list is null/empty and if not, then loops through the list checking mech names and then adding one to your mech kill count.
  
• Your mech kill count would simply be a collection of all mechs (simply Map<mechName, killCount>).
  
• They would then have to store it (because not using Java - which could persist/store it on bean change).

Checking Available Mechs:

• Check your mech kill count and see if the number is over a threshold, if it is then make it available to use.
  
  • The really nice thing about this is they could add something I would love to see - A Mech Warrior normally doesn't start out owning every mech, they capture/earn them. With tracking kill count you could even have it so MW have to earn their Faction Mechs. Each MW would start out with one mech (beginning of war/season) and then earn mechs to use. Now your own faction mechs should be MUCH easier to earn, while opposite faction mechs are harder. - But this could be added down the line, but would give much more realism in the BT universe.

Code(java):
// MechWarrior object(this is your user profile), we will call it mechProfile;
private Map<String, Integer> killCount; // Map would be of MECHNAME to KILLCOUNT
// Method to increment Map
public void incrementKillCount(String mechName) {
killCount.put(mechName, killCount.get(mechName)+1);
}
public Integer getKillCount(String mechName) {
return killCount.get(mechName);
}
// Now with Java JPA you can have it so when a Bean changes it automatically stores it, C, would require you to store it yourself.


// Check if Mech is available to drop for CW
if (mechProfile.getKillCount(mechName) > xxx) {
// add to list of drop mechs - whcih they need to do anyways IS .vs. CLAN mechs
// They are going to have to check some indicator or field to see if you can use it.
}

Edited by Syrkres, 19 September 2014 - 06:40 AM.

[Shibas]

While it is a neat and interesting concept to gain clan mechs, I would find it somewhat better to follow the logic of clan mech salvage leads to IS-clan tech used mechs (like the bushwacker).
In the CW scenario, instead of kills, as that it's kinda a BS way to do it, there already is salvage recorded for c-bills after matches.  Use a system in place that would track clan mechs, as you mentioned, salvage-- not kills (since salvage is distributed among the team members).  After X amount of salvage is obtained you can get access to some of the mechs that are not available for purchase for cbills until a later date.  You could almost create it as a secondary currency "clan salvage" that you would use to purchase these mechs.  You have MC purchase for those that want to buy it outright, Clan salvage for X time (maybe during the season if they do the 3 months) and then cbills after that point.

Edited by Shibas, 19 September 2014 - 07:16 AM.

[Syrkres]

Shibas, on 19 September 2014 - 07:16 AM, said:

While it is a neat and interesting concept to gain clan mechs, I would find it somewhat better to follow the logic of clan mech salvage leads to IS-clan tech used mechs (like the bushwacker).
In the CW scenario, instead of kills, as that it's kinda a BS way to do it, there already is salvage recorded for c-bills after matches. Use a system in place that would track clan mechs, as you mentioned, salvage-- not kills (since salvage is distributed among the team members). After X amount of salvage is obtained you can get access to some of the mechs that are not available for purchase for cbills until a later date. You could almost create it as a secondary currency "clan salvage" that you would use to purchase these mechs. You have MC purchase for those that want to buy it outright, Clan salvage for X time (maybe during the season if they do the 3 months) and then cbills after that point.

This would again be an interesting way to handle it.
It could be done a few different ways.

• As you "earn" salvage (in C-Bills) you salvage more "parts". Thus each Mech would need to have a salvage value (or all mechs same) which you earn towards, When you earn enough salvage you can use that mech.
  
  • Rather than store individual mech salvages you could either base it on their cost (good idea) or percentage of cost, own faction mechs would be easier to salvage (read cheaper) while opposing faction mechs are hard (read more expensive). So a quick formula could be MECHCost * faction-modifier.
    
  • With this simple form of salvage you would quickly earn access to all types of mechs. But using this an opposing faction Light Mech would cost probably the amount of your own factions Medium Mech.
• A second way which is basically similar to above, but when you "salvage" a mech to use, it subtracts that amount of your salvaged mech from your salvaged earnings.
  
  • So lets say I've salvaged 4mil C-Bills UI could afford most lights and many mediums, but I couldn't afford a Kit-Fox.
    
  • I could either continue to save for a more expensive mech, or spend a portion of that 4mil C-Bills to "salvage" a mech

With the above two thoughts you earn your way to using mechs. I would suggest it's cheaper than buying them, because a player will NOT want to grind out the C-Bills salvaged just to use a mech he already purchased (every season). Though if numbers are adjusted, your proposal method and mine would likely take about the same time. But a good player could just go after kills (which may not earn him as many C-Bills) and get the kills quicker. While others who focus on earning C-Bills could get quicker - would depend on play styles.

They would still have to add code to track season salvage (as compared to kills) and then depending on how you implement adjust salvage as mechs are "earned".

Again a good suggestion. My suggestion was that if you kill something you "salvage" parts from it.

[Joseph Mallan]

M X Striker, on 12 September 2014 - 01:28 PM, said:

Also, as a Merc company, we should eventually be able to run a mixed batch of Mechs anyway no? They should really account for this. Please take note PGI!

Depending on when you buy your Mechs and under which banner you collect your pay from. Working for Marik? Hey You can buy a Orion cheap. Kurita payin the tab? Good deal on Catapult-K2. Fighting on the Davion Boarder... Salvage one JagerMech Arm or just an AC from the OpFor.

Swag is a good thing... Now for the bad news. Wanna buy a Raven In House Steiner? Black. Market. Pricing!

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 19 September 2014 - 07:38 AM.

[Cranky Poed]

Why add a way to get more mechs when all you have to do is buy them with cbills or MC. Don't get me wrong I kinda like the idea, but I don't think this will promote good gameplay. I think it would break down to the whole team chasing down a mech to get the kill shot.

[Gas Guzzler]

Hellcat420, on 12 September 2014 - 01:46 PM, said:

or you could just have to capture a planet with teh mech factory on it, since it would give a reason for community warfare, and actually fit better than just "i killed 10 shadowhawks, i can use my salvaged one now!".

Dude.. you are taking this too seriously. MW4 had salvage as your primary method of getting mechs. Don't need factories, its a video game that doesn't track each individual bolt that holds these mechs together.

I would even argue for a simple "Salvage Points" type of currency that you gain slowly through fighting Clans, with bonuses when you get kills. Each chassis then has a salvage cost where you unlock the chassis (or individual variant) to use in CW... I think it would work.

[Thorn Hallis]

While the idea in itself is nice (and not new), I don't see that happen. Ever. Buying 'Mechs and equipment is ment to be MWOs sink. Getting stuff for "free" simply runs contrary to that.

[Gas Guzzler]

It isn't getting them for free. Or in my idea at least, your account has to have bought the mech with C-bills or MC already. The salvage system is just to be able to use the Mechs your account already owns in CW

Cranky Poed, on 19 September 2014 - 07:38 AM, said:

Why add a way to get more mechs when all you have to do is buy them with cbills or MC. Don't get me wrong I kinda like the idea, but I don't think this will promote good gameplay. I think it would break down to the whole team chasing down a mech to get the kill shot.

That's why generalized salvage points that can be used to unlock any Clan mech you own (already purchased with C-bills and MC) to use in CW is the way to go

Edit: After reading your post I think you are not understanding the OP. Currently, IS Factions and Merc units cannot use Clan mechs in Community Warfare. We are trying to find ways for IS forces to be able to unlock Clan mechs that their account already owns for use in CW.

Edited by Gas Guzzler, 19 September 2014 - 07:59 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Gas Guzzler, on 19 September 2014 - 07:45 AM, said:

Dude.. you are taking this too seriously. MW4 had salvage as your primary method of getting mechs. Don't need factories, its a video game that doesn't track each individual bolt that holds these mechs together.

I would even argue for a simple "Salvage Points" type of currency that you gain slowly through fighting Clans, with bonuses when you get kills. Each chassis then has a salvage cost where you unlock the chassis (or individual variant) to use in CW... I think it would work.

MW4 already had your money though gas. You paid for the game upfront.

[Shibas]

Cranky Poed, on 19 September 2014 - 07:38 AM, said:

Why add a way to get more mechs when all you have to do is buy them with cbills or MC. Don't get me wrong I kinda like the idea, but I don't think this will promote good gameplay. I think it would break down to the whole team chasing down a mech to get the kill shot.

Thorn Hallis, on 19 September 2014 - 07:49 AM, said:

While the idea in itself is nice (and not new), I don't see that happen. Ever. Buying 'Mechs and equipment is ment to be MWOs sink. Getting stuff for "free" simply runs contrary to that.

He's kinda warping it a bit, but the idea is still there. It wouldn't replace cbills, it would be a intermediate between MC and Cbills per "season" of CW. So the idea would be:

Here are mechs A, B, and C available during season 1 of CW. While fighting, you gain salvage points along with cbills. The mechs are not available for cbills during the season, but you can "salvage" them from actively playing during the season. For an overall cheaper value than cbills. After the season you would be able to purchase the mechs for cbills. This provides a way to keep people interested during particular seasons as you have to be active to acquire them (or $$ them) or have to wait until the end of the season to cbill them.

It's not a great idea, but it gives the illusion of salvage and acquiring mechs on the field.

[Lukoi Banacek]

This idea would allow IS pilots to use Clan Mechs in CW and vice versa...and eventuality PGI has hinted at but never really come to grips with explaining. The boogie man of "mixtech" is a powerful force...and for the sake of immersion and lore, rightfully so. But eventually.....some minor influx of Clan and IS mechs into each others ready pools is probably going to happen. How far doen the road will be interesting to see.

The OP is offering aninteresting mechanic on how it might occur. Not the when.

Sorry for typos....big thumbs, small phone lol.

Edited by Lukoi Banacek, 19 September 2014 - 08:00 AM.

[Gas Guzzler]

Joseph Mallan, on 19 September 2014 - 07:58 AM, said:

MW4 already had your money though gas. You paid for the game upfront.

Yeah, I already paid for my Clan mechs, I just want to use them in CW not add them to my account for free.

Edit:

Edited by Gas Guzzler, 19 September 2014 - 08:03 AM.

[Gas Guzzler]

Maybe I am in disagreement with the OP, but I am not advocating salvage as a replacement for purchasing the Mech with C-Bills/MC. I am just saying it would be nice if we could earn salvage points that could be used to unlock mechs already purchased through the Clan Collection, with C-Bills, or with MC, for use in CW. Does that make sense?

[Syrkres]

Thorn Hallis, on 19 September 2014 - 07:49 AM, said:

While the idea in itself is nice (and not new), I don't see that happen. Ever. Buying 'Mechs and equipment is ment to be MWOs sink. Getting stuff for "free" simply runs contrary to that.

You would not be getting them for free. You have to "own" the mech.

This is for CW, mainly where mech restriction comes into play. Right now IS cannot use Clan mechs, so there is no reason for me to buy any of the clan packages (and for all those who own clans and IS mechs they can't use some of the mechs they own in CW.

This ideas are to allow a player to "earn" the right to use a mech for CW (only).


@Gass Guzzler, and others.
Again this is NOT a replacement to getting mechs. This is to allow the USE of mechs you already own in CW (because right now as planned - you cannot).

Edited by Syrkres, 19 September 2014 - 08:16 AM.

[Gas Guzzler]

Syrkres, on 19 September 2014 - 08:14 AM, said:

@Gass Guzzler,
Again this is NOT a replacement to getting mechs. This is to allow the use of mechs you own in CW.

Yeah that is what I was assuming but everyone else is thinking that you are saying you don't have to buy them and I was trying to express that sentiment as well. I think between your post and mine they will see now..

[Cranky Poed]

Your right I did miss the point of the OP's post. While I was reading it I had to explain the difference between restarting a laptop and restarting a browser. My apologies!

Edited by Cranky Poed, 19 September 2014 - 09:39 AM.

[VanillaG]

Any system that is put into place needs to allow you gain and LOSE the ability to pilot a non-faction mechs. So when you win a match you gain salvage points. When you lose a match you gain no salvage points. When you lose a match with a non-faction mech you lose salvage points. I would be possible to lose the ability pilot a non-faction mech if you encountered enough loses to deplete your salvage pool.

I specifically call them non-faction mechs because this system should work in both directions. This way Clans can pilot IS mechs as well.

[Syrkres]

@VanillaG - That sounds interesting, while I was more interested in just gaining the ability to pilot a mech, to be more realistic you should (as you say) be able to lose the ability to pilot a mech.

Though this reminds me of a game the other day, I hate to say it was a stomping, where the opposing team was too split up and we killed 11 of them, then the last mech ran off and hid. With no loss people are doing this today just to save their KD ration, if you lose the ability to pilot a mech from a death, I think this would cause it even more.

So while I like it and much more realistic, I think it would cause even more people to run...

[ApolloKaras]

After thinking about this for a bit... The kills would have to be based per player. What I would fear is much of the same thing that we saw during some of these kill based award events which were supporting less team play and more "zomg gotta get the kill!!11". That is of course if I'm reading it through correctly?