446 replies to this topic

[Joseph Mallan]

Well since you don't like committees, he gave you an opportunity to give your opinion on ECM since Russ pretty much has said we will have a committee. You will have your voice heard here. Now.

[IraqiWalker]

EboneezeeR, on 16 September 2014 - 05:46 AM, said:

Whenever, if a Council be elected... and according to Russ "Bollox" Bullock it even will be forced to be. I just tell you one thing...

- Lads if something will go wrong with dat Council, and it will go wrong... As you sow shall ye reap.

..... Yeah, that's the whole point. It's also why we're asking the community to get more involved. Since if things go wrong, they go wrong for everyone, and if they go well, they go well for everyone. Not just the council members.

[Verdic Mckenna]

http://mwomercs.com/...player-council/

Anyone notice this is on hold?

[Joseph Mallan]

EboneezeeR, on 16 September 2014 - 05:46 AM, said:

- Lads if something will go wrong with dat Council, and it will go wrong... As you sow shall ye reap.

As should be expected. So if good ideas and discussion are sown, a bountiful harvest will be reaped. But if the council screws the pooch. Blame WILL rightly fall in their collective laps and little to no harm done to the community.

[Oderint dum Metuant]

Verdic Mckenna, on 16 September 2014 - 05:48 AM, said:

http://mwomercs.com/...player-council/

Anyone notice this is on hold?

It does not say it's on hold.

It say's that he's working on it, to compile the names and how they will establish a process to do this.

That's two different things.

[TamCoan]

IraqiWalker, on 16 September 2014 - 05:46 AM, said:

Both of you need to cool off, and clear your heads. No one here is out to get anyone.

Phrasing could be adjusted a bit, to be honest, however Fut was trying to say that if you don't like anyone else speaking for you, then you should do the speaking.

Which I agree has little (not, none) bearing on the actual topic of discussion. However, both of you are actually talking about 2 different things right now.

Relax, take a deep breath, and try to approach this without the idea that the other is out to get you. If you can't do that, then using PMs might be better than public forums.

Yeah, I probably came off a little harsh in my first response. However I stand by my point, my opinion on any other issue has no bearing on this issue. To bring such into the conversation is just railroading and an attempt to invalidate based on unrelated reasons. I am speaking for myself on this issue right here, right now.

[SI The Joker]

http://mwomercs.com/...player-council/

It sounds like Russ has his own short-list. That list may very well include or not include some of the folks on the "election" list. Think on that for a moment.

Personally... I'm still in the "making up my mind regarding how I feel about this" phase with regard to the committee/council/whateveritis thing we are discussing. My initial knee-jerk reaction was "HECK YES!"... but now I've thought on it and truly do find myself torn. I have too much experience in these spaces from leagues and countless beta programs that I've taken part in over the years... and almost all of that experience reminds me how poorly these things can turn out. Still, I'm torn - forever an optimist.

Now, whether you're for or against it (and maybe someone else has said this?) we should be freaking glad that PGI is making the turn here. We should be glad that they are coming to us (the community) and engaging in this way. Late? Sure it is. My gut tells me that IGP had more to do with that than we are told. Better late than never though, eh?

I digress.

If you don't want a committee hey - that's fine. Like I said... I may very well end up in your boat rowing with you once I make that decision for myself.

But in the mean time, offer something different. Help us, help PGI to make a better game that makes them boatloads of cash and creates a stable, long lasting Battletech/Mechwarrior gaming world for the myriad players in the world who have a deep, passionate love of the Battletech universe.

In the end, it's the only way we all win.

[N0MAD]

So PGI is going to appoint names, ohhh and no council now,, soon..
Well that de escalated quickly...

[Fut]

Joseph Mallan, on 16 September 2014 - 05:50 AM, said:

As should be expected. So if good ideas and discussion are sown, a bountiful harvest will be reaped. But if the council screws the pooch. Blame WILL rightly fall in their collective laps and little to no harm done to the community.

Exactly.
Besides, it's not as if the Councils suggestions will be implemented automatically. If they come up with some truly shite ideas, PGI will just pass.

[EboneezeeR]

IraqiWalker, on 16 September 2014 - 05:48 AM, said:

..... Yeah, that's the whole point. It's also why we're asking the community to get more involved. Since if things go wrong, they go wrong for everyone, and if they go well, they go well for everyone. Not just the council members.

Joseph Mallan, on 16 September 2014 - 05:50 AM, said:

As should be expected. So if good ideas and discussion are sown, a bountiful harvest will be reaped. But if the council screws the pooch. Blame WILL rightly fall in their collective laps and little to no harm done to the community.

You both are right but... the one who gets screwed are all we and the game. Game which we all love. I'm not so agains council, but there is a big concerns did they able to manage.
My concern is... that PGI in face of Russ Bollox want to put all load of responsibility on Council which are doomed to fail. I's PGI you know. Which gonna lead to further repressions against game and players.

Edited by EboneezeeR, 16 September 2014 - 06:14 AM.

[IraqiWalker]

TamCoan, on 16 September 2014 - 06:04 AM, said:

Yeah, I probably came off a little harsh in my first response. However I stand by my point, my opinion on any other issue has no bearing on this issue. To bring such into the conversation is just railroading and an attempt to invalidate based on unrelated reasons. I am speaking for myself on this issue right here, right now.

That, I can understand, and see. However, that was meant for both, and the problem is that even if neither of you is intending to be aggressive, the internet is a very imperfect medium for conveying emotional context.

N0MAD, on 16 September 2014 - 06:08 AM, said:

So PGI is going to appoint names, ohhh and no council now,, soon..
Well that de escalated quickly...

You really need to actually read the posts before commenting on them.

[N0MAD]

Just a litle thought here.
If PGI had indeed wanted input from the community, the simple question that should of been asked was..do you the community want a player council.
I guess they didnt ask so they dont want community input.

[EboneezeeR]

N0MAD, on 16 September 2014 - 06:16 AM, said:

Just a litle thought here.
If PGI had indeed wanted input from the community, the simple question that should of been asked was..do you the community want a player council.
I guess they didnt ask so they dont want community input.

Exactly. The small thing about which everyone forgets behind the screen of Players Council effort.

Edited by EboneezeeR, 16 September 2014 - 06:19 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

EboneezeeR, on 16 September 2014 - 06:12 AM, said:

You both are right but... the one who gets screwed are all we and the game. Game which we all love. I'm not so agains council, but there is a big concerns did they able to manage.
My concern is... that PGI in face of Russ Bollox want to put all load of responsibility on Council which are doomed to fail. I's PGI you know. Which gonna lead to further repressions against game and players.

Yes, and that means its not IGP. If it fails as you expect, what have we Lost? ECM is already a mess. If it succeeds what do gain? An ECM that many players will like and less will loath.

Failure fall on the shoulders of 4-7 players, ECM likely stays as is, And the players can gloat "I told you so." Till the end of time. If it works PGI and the committee has helped make the game better for all players.

I honestly don't see a downside.

[Dark Jackal]

IraqiWalker, on 16 September 2014 - 05:46 AM, said:

I'm personally of the opinion that PGI can send a system-wide message through the game client, that can help drive players towards the forums. If the players don't show up, with a week-long window, that means they are not interested.

I'm sure most of those folks are aware of the forums from the get-go. That won't necessarily sit well with them if they feel forced to do something they don't want to as I can understand why folks may feel dis-inclined to come here just to post a blurb. After all, if there was a choice of coming here or playing the game I'd much rather have them play the game and provide some solid metrics for PGI which is something the community will have only a glimpse of.

Now, if PGI needs them for a survey, they could do as I've seen in other games like COH2 or PS2 where a pop-up comes up in the game with one or two questions to vote on feedback with a particular item or two. Then they don't have to take the survey if they choose not to at that point but it prevents feeling like shoe-horning folks that really don't want to come here.

[EboneezeeR]

Joseph Mallan, on 16 September 2014 - 06:19 AM, said:

Yes, and that means its not IGP. If it fails as you expect, what have we Lost? ECM is already a mess. If it succeeds what do gain? An ECM that many players will like and less will loath.

Failure fall on the shoulders of 4-7 players, ECM likely stays as is, And the players can gloat "I told you so." Till the end of time. If it works PGI and the committee has helped make the game better for all players.

I honestly don't see a downside.

ECM? What bad in ECM? Except the fact that it's not avaliable for every mech... like it should be.

[IraqiWalker]

N0MAD, on 16 September 2014 - 06:16 AM, said:

Just a litle thought here.
If PGI had indeed wanted input from the community, the simple question that should of been asked was..do you the community want a player council.
I guess they didnt ask so they dont want community input.

In a way they did. They proposed this idea, and if the community didn't want it, the support for it would be non-existent. This is them asking the community. If we don't participate, we don't want it, and if we do, then we do want it.

It saves time to immediately make the proposal and see what happens instead of asking "Do you want it?" and then waiting 4 days or so before then making the proposal. You can just make the proposal and it either gets shot down or not. More efficient, and less time consuming.

Dark Jackal, on 16 September 2014 - 06:20 AM, said:

I'm sure most of those folks are aware of the forums from the get-go. That won't necessarily sit well with them if they feel forced to do something they don't want to as I can understand why folks may feel dis-inclined to come here just to post a blurb. After all, if there was a choice of coming here or playing the game I'd much rather have them play the game and provide some solid metrics for PGI which is something the community will have only a glimpse of.

Now, if PGI needs them for a survey, they could do as I've seen in other games like COH2 or PS2 where a pop-up comes up in the game with one or two questions to vote on feedback with a particular item or two. Then they don't have to take the survey if they choose not to at that point but it prevents feeling like shoe-horning folks that really don't want to come here.

To clarify, the message would be to inform the players of what's happening, and ask them to chime in if they want. Not force the players to go to the forums, to give feedback they don't want to give, or care to give.

EboneezeeR, on 16 September 2014 - 06:22 AM, said:

ECM? What bad in ECM? Except the fact that it's not avaliable for every mech... like it should be.

The magic 180 meter invisibility bubble? The fact that there is literally no counter to a double stack of ECM other than another double stack of ECM, or BAPs. Both only working at less than 180 meters. These are problems that have plagued the system since day 1.

[PappySmurf]

I can understand Russ and his desire to get back into the graces of his community for financial reasons.PGI cannot survive on love of the IP alone it needs new blood and $USD to continue to operate .I am against the player counsel number 1 because it is a distraction to issues with MWO that are higher priority for the survival of the game itself.

Another factor is the blame game if there was a player counsel blame for the games flaws and underachievement could have been placed on these individuals as a prelude to (It was all there fault this idea did not work or why were shutting down the game).If the game dies I want it to be because PGI did not listen to its player base and fans and I hope this does not happen but I have seen other company's do this to justify there failures.

If Russ & Brian and PGI want the community's help we would all be glad to vote or comment on good solid ideas for the games improvements and help in its profitability and longevity.

Edited by PappySmurf, 16 September 2014 - 06:25 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

N0MAD, on 16 September 2014 - 06:16 AM, said:

Just a litle thought here.
If PGI had indeed wanted input from the community, the simple question that should of been asked was..do you the community want a player council.
I guess they didnt ask so they dont want community input.

EI was not a choice by the workers alone. Management HAS to embrace it for it to work. SO PGI comes to us says Will you form a committee, to tackle task A?

Now the community, either steps up or turns its back. Which ever way they chose, they have spoken. Proactive is better than Stagnant.

Even if the community was 100% on board, management (PGI) can still sabotage or attempt to sabotage the efforts. Which are you half full or half empty? Positive or Negative?

[B0oN]

Excuse me if I am a bit hoarse after shouting against shitstorms for 18 months .
Sadly I am so hoarse that someone else needs to take over as my throat ... which is where the malady begins :

As much as I esteem some of the people in here, I don´t trust any one of you making OUR (or mine) voices heard for sure this time around .
Neither do I trust PGI in hearing US out, because history and lost trust has to be earned back (which I really hope they try/do)

Leaves an akward situation, even without trying to factor in the politicking that WILL be part of this "Council"

:/

Leaves me between chairs ...