60 replies to this topic

[Sprouticus]

Thanks All. I do understand the limitations, but when I am scoring half as much in my Summoner than an equivilently configured stormcrow, there are more issues at hand.


I have tried the 3 and 4 ERLL as well and found it lacking.


Ill try the SRM & streak builds, but I have found that the hit boxes on this are what is holding it back form performing as an infighter.

Ill switch to playing escort/support as well. I tried that some last night, but it was a low number of drops so I didnt get much of a feel for it. Seems like Ihave to run it like a large kitfox instead of a medium....

[Empyrus]

I run stock Prime (only basic bonuses, no elites, no modules), and do rather well with it.
It is a big medium, not a heavy. It is a support mech, not a killer. You need the right attitude to do well with it, you're not in it for personal glory.
You can keep the ERPPC firing constantly due to fast cooldown and good cooling, while throwing some LRMs at enemies when you have a good shot (use them sparingly), and once the armor's gone, use the LB-X for crit-seeking.
It is resilient even without max armor, as long as you keep twisting and generally speaking avoid getting shot (use its mobility).
There are better mechs... but it is not a terrible mech as many think, as long as you know how to leverage its, admittedly meager, strengths.

(No idea about custom loadouts, i never could figure out one i'd like so i run it with stock.)

Edited by Empyrus, 16 September 2014 - 08:17 AM.

[GDFan]

C-UAC10 with 2 tons ammo in RT
C-LRM 15 with 1.5 tons ammo in LT
4 C-ERML (2 in each arm) set to chain fire

works well for me

[Ghogiel]

It was actually pretty decent when having 4JJ was fun.

[C0VVB3LL]

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...f967ff1cc975ba5

[Jeb]

its clan, it must be overpowered!!!

No really it is as bad as it seems
It's the only clan mech I can't stand playing, and I actually like playing the Adder now and then...

[Splatshot]

4 erml and uac20
5 ssrm 6.

[Foxwalker]

Works better than the Cat A1 with LRMs. You can mount mixed racks, 1 x 15, 2 x 10 and 2 x 5 racks. 9 - 10 tons of ammo. On chain, due to the mixed cool downs, it never stops firing. I have averaged 600-1000 damage per match in it.

Another way that is really simple is just 2 ERPPCs and all the rest heat sinks. It is a 30 point damage alpha at mid-longish range with reasonable cool downs and sustained fire on most maps. I have matches damages and kills with Victor Dragon Slayers in that build.

Anyone that says it is a bad mech, just does not understand it.

[Roland]

Two ERPPC's.

[Mothykins]

SMN-B

Or, if you are the cheese; SMN-D just don't get shot. Ever.

[Empyrus]

Foxwalker, on 16 September 2014 - 08:40 AM, said:

Anyone that says it is a bad mech, just does not understand it.

If they say it is bad compared to the Timber Wolf, they're right for sure... But then pretty much any mech is bad compared to the Timber Wolf.
Or when compared to the Stormcrow, which can, on paper, do anything the Summoner can, minus jump jets (which are borderline useless in the game currently due to their overnerfed state).

[TygerLily]

Five A+SRM6's has been a fun ride.

Dracol, on 16 September 2014 - 07:15 AM, said:

I leveled mine with ACs in the nipples. The high mounts were great for ridge cresting/humping.

YES, this was pretty effective. UAC10, 3 tons ammo. UAC/5 2 tons ammo. High mounts are nice.

[Lucian Nostra]

UAC/10, PPC, SRM4

2 LRM15, LRM 10, 2 Medium Laser

2 PPC, 2 Mediums, 2 Machine guns.

No the Summoner isn't a Twolf but i like piloting Summoners a whole lot more and have had good results with them

Edited by Lucian Nostra, 16 September 2014 - 08:50 AM.

[Bront]

Hoax415, on 16 September 2014 - 07:16 AM, said:

Yes its that bad when compared to the best mech in the game.

It doesn't have endo. It is not 35/55/75/100 tons. It can't mount ECM. It doesn't have some form of special geometry that gives it great hardpoint positions or lets it protect its hitboxes effectively.

Those are the four criteria for being a good mech in MWO.

Technically, 40/60/80 have some advantages as well, but only the Victor and maybe the Cicada has ever made great use of them.

But it's worse than that.

- The summoner is missing the tonnage to mount lots of heavy weapons because it doesn't have Endo AND it has 5(6?) hardmounted JJs that weigh 1 ton each.
- The Summoner's geometry means the CT is always exposed from angles it shouldn't be, and it's legs are freakishly huge (A problem the Loki will have as well, as canon wise, they have the same legs due to production savings issues during development)
- The Summoner lacks lots of hardpoints to boat smaller weapons, which is ideal to make up for badly positioned or lack of tonnage.

Points 1 and 3 go hand in hand, as the summoner doesn't have Endo so it could mount the larger weapons (It needed the room), but it's lacking the tonnage and/or hardpoints to mount a reasonable amount, and in MWO, there is often efficiency in mounting multiple mid-range sized weapons (LLs, AC5s, LRM10s, SRMs, etc)

[Monkey Lover]

Ghogiel, on 16 September 2014 - 08:20 AM, said:

It was actually pretty decent when having 4JJ was fun.

I agree, it was a lot more fun when you could jump on top of building. Now I wish I could cut it to 1 jj just to get over rocks because jumping up isn't working.

[Viges]

gauss+4mls

its not bad its just worse than madcat

[Revis Volek]

Mcgral18, on 16 September 2014 - 08:06 AM, said:

UAC20/Gauss in the torso, 4 ERMLs, ammo.

That one is reasonable. You could also go SRM18 and a UAC10, but that's ammo limited and short ranged.

Mcgral has the build right there...

That one is one of my fav clan builds in general. Just easy to use and a big high mounted DAKKA cannon!

The other build i really excel with is my B config. which i use 1x LRM 15 Left Torso, 2x LRM 10 ARM (faster recycle then the 20) 2x ER Med and 1x MG (1/2 Ton Ammo) for a little finishing if you get crit lights running around your.

Rest LRM ammo and of course I run some modules to help with the LRM since I couldn't get BAP on.

[Duncan Jr Fischer]

I actually bought one out of my old love for this mech (the only clan mech I own) and that was a giant waste.
Yes, you can find a fairly good build trying to forget it's not a medium that it feels like. If you're good pilot, you'll find a way to shine in Summoner. But in MWO this mech is no match for its tonnage rivals.
No Endo, and it's got locked Jump Jets which is a mad waste of tonnage for me, as jumps in MWO are just so heretical to Battletech...

[Monkey Lover]

you can do 3med laser and a real ac20 in a blackjack

[Empyrus]

Duncan Jr Fischer, on 16 September 2014 - 09:23 AM, said:

as jumps in MWO are just so heretical to Battletech...

Indeed... IIRC Mechwarrior 4 jumps were, while nerfed compared to the boardgame, considerably stronger than they're in this game (and due to map design, usually waste of tonnage).

Two changes to make the Summoner better:
1: Buff jump jets, either give the Summoner a JJ boost quirk, or just buff them overall.
2: Remove Timber Wolf S (replace with A or so that the Summoner doesn't have a superior competitor, make it the only jumping Clan heavy.