268 replies to this topic

[Mystere]

Kevjack, on 19 September 2014 - 08:59 AM, said:

A fresh Timberwolf?

Just because you are incapable of doing something does not mean no one else can. Otherwise, humanity will still be in the Stone Age ... or be totally extinct.

[Odins Fist]

Moonlander, on 19 September 2014 - 12:18 AM, said:

I recently posted something about this. I 1v1'd a Timberwolf not long ago. Only mech I came into contact with and I had no damage taken from any other sources. Just him an I in this particular location. Needless to say, I was destroyed. My damage done however, was 542... all to him mind you...

Something is definitely wrong with that picture. I should mention, I was in my DDC.

Hit Reg Issue... 542 is more then total Armor for a Timby if I remember correct.

[Glythe]

Timberwolf has 460 external armor. It also has something like 237 internal armor.


But if all your damage went to the chest then he can at most take about 280 damage frontally and still have a few points of internal armor left

Edited by Glythe, 19 September 2014 - 10:09 AM.

[Kain Demos]

Glythe, on 19 September 2014 - 10:03 AM, said:

Timberwolf has 460 external armor. It also has 237 internal armor.

Dealing 542 damage to one without killing it would qualify you for the "shotgun willie" achievement.

[Kirkland Langue]

All things being equal:
Clan > IS because of XL engine differences.
75T > 70T because of "moar stuff with same MM"
6E+2B+4M Hardpoints > half that number of Hardpoints because of "moar guns and more options".

Everything comes together on the Timberwolf which makes it pretty much the best choice.


I'd recommend focusing upon "fixing" the MM by either using Tonnage or Giving each Mech a Point Value and using that point value for the purposes of MM. The current MatchMaker is pretty much trash. Failing this - I would recommend just standardizing weights within each mech weight class.

[Kiryuin Ragyo]

Kirkland Langue, on 19 September 2014 - 10:08 AM, said:

All things being equal:
Clan > IS because of XL engine differences.
75T > 70T because of "moar stuff with same MM"
6E+2B+4M Hardpoints > half that number of Hardpoints because of "moar guns and more options".

Everything comes together on the Timberwolf which makes it pretty much the best choice.


I'd recommend focusing upon "fixing" the MM by either using Tonnage or Giving each Mech a Point Value and using that point value for the purposes of MM. The current MatchMaker is pretty much trash. Failing this - I would recommend just standardizing weights within each mech weight class.

Wait ttill we get an XXL engines, mech will blow from a scratch.

[Carrie Harder]

Kiryuin Ragyo, on 19 September 2014 - 10:09 AM, said:

Wait ttill we get an XXL engines, mech will blow from a scratch.

Actually, due to MWO's lack of engine crits, XXL engines would have the same overall durability/fragility as XL engines. The differences would be more critslots eaten in each side torso and probably some kind of heat penalty (the XXL gave +10 heat per turn in TT and doubled the amount of heat for movement).

[LordKnightFandragon]

Moonlander, on 19 September 2014 - 12:18 AM, said:

I recently posted something about this. I 1v1'd a Timberwolf not long ago. Only mech I came into contact with and I had no damage taken from any other sources. Just him an I in this particular location. Needless to say, I was destroyed. My damage done however, was 542... all to him mind you...

Something is definitely wrong with that picture. I should mention, I was in my DDC.

Big slow lumbering boats always get owned by smaller, lighter, more nimble opponents....pretty much every game. The Timberwolf packs the firepower of an Assault with the mobility of a medium or even a light. So it hosing your DDC, no big shock there lol.

But I really dont think the clans need to lose thier advantage of space and weapon efficiency. More crap stuffed into a smaller, faster container...compared to the IS, cant pack much into a massive container...

Glythe, on 19 September 2014 - 09:27 AM, said:

Lasers are the best weapon for their heat/damage/weight. Even more so when you actually have double heat sinks instead of 1.4 sinks.

I would love to see how well the Warhawk sports those 4 C ERPPC if we ever had 2.0 heatsinks...0.6 more heat dissipation x27 DHS lol....dayum.

[Joanna Conners]

The T-Wolf is just fine and I don't own one. If it's inspiring fear on the battlefield... PGI did it right.

[Dimento Graven]

You're missing the point.

The mech, in total has 460 armor. Doing over 500 damage to it, should have destroyed it, or at the very least, left it weaponless.

Part of the problem is the clan XL being able to survive complete loss of a side torso, requiring either CT, or both side torso destruction for kills (I'm not talking about legs or headshots here, most commonly we're firing at the torsos), where as the IS 'mechs with XL's suffer immediate death with the loss of one side torso, and considering the fragility or extreme size of IS side torsos combined with the BS Clan AC's, where each f'ing bullet from an AC that hits gets its own crit roll, tremendously increasing the probability that an IS mech is going to die once the internals on any torso are opened up the least little bit.

How AC's aren't getting beaten with the "******* Sword of Nerfing +5" like lasers were almost weekly, I don't know...

[AssaultPig]

that isn't how armor works in MWO; mechs have internal structure equal to the armor on each component.

500 damage is a lot to do to any one mech, but it isn't inconceivable that you could spread that across a timberwolf's arms/legs/torso without actually destroying any components.

I would suggest that if you actually managed to accomplish that you could stand to aim a bit better, though.

[KHETTI]

Only thing needing done to the crutch wolf is removing its ability to mount JJs.

[Hardin4188]

KHETTI, on 19 September 2014 - 11:18 AM, said:

Only thing needing done to the crutch wolf is removing its ability to mount JJs.

I understand that this isn't TT and some minor balance changes need to be made, but that's going a bit extreme.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Here is all I know.

Yesterday I took my Timber Wolf prime armed with Dual ER PPCs and Quad C-ER MLs and early in one match I ended running into a Ilya mounting 3 UAC/5s and 3 MLs. Confident in the superiority of my Timber Wolf I just bullied up and faced him head on planning on overwhelming him with my superior armor, firepower and no XL vulnerability. 30 seconds later I am flat on my back looking at my cored out mech while the Ilya struts off to kill someone else.

Now the thing here is that neither of us attempted any tactics, we just rolled up on one another at about 250-300m and unloaded until one of us died and the one who died wasn't the Ilya, heck it wasn't even close. So I see these sort of situations, and at that point it just boggles the mind how people can persist with Timber Wolf is OPed posts.

In conclusion, I am sure people are going to say things like, "if you torso twisted" or "you should have shot his ST instead of his CT" or "you obviously suck if you lost to an Ilya" or any number of other things I should have done however be that as it may, this is a very good example of a test on the sheer power of the Timber Wolf vs a comparable IS mech and the IS mech won, hands down without question. Timber Wolf OPed.....not by any experience I have had with them.

[Torgun]

Viktor Drake, on 19 September 2014 - 11:40 AM, said:

Here is all I know.

Yesterday I took my Timber Wolf prime armed with Dual ER PPCs and Quad C-ER MLs and early in one match I ended running into a Ilya mounting 3 UAC/5s and 3 MLs. Confident in the superiority of my Timber Wolf I just bullied up and faced him head on planning on overwhelming him with my superior armor, firepower and no XL vulnerability. 30 seconds later I am flat on my back looking at my cored out mech while the Ilya struts off to kill someone else.

Now the thing here is that neither of us attempted any tactics, we just rolled up on one another at about 250-300m and unloaded until one of us died and the one who died wasn't the Ilya, heck it wasn't even close. So I see these sort of situations, and at that point it just boggles the mind how people can persist with Timber Wolf is OPed posts.

In conclusion, I am sure people are going to say things like, "if you torso twisted" or "you should have shot his ST instead of his CT" or "you obviously suck if you lost to an Ilya" or any number of other things I should have done however be that as it may, this is a very good example of a test on the sheer power of the Timber Wolf vs a comparable IS mech and the IS mech won, hands down without question. Timber Wolf OPed.....not by any experience I have had with them.

So you're saying you had a TW that clearly was built more for sniping with all energy that ran really hot and came across an opponent that had mainly ballistics and ran way cooler and you lost in a close-range duel? That is your proof that TW is a-okay? Just run that through your mind once more, and post again afterwards.

Edited by Torgun, 19 September 2014 - 12:08 PM.

[AssaultPig]

The ilya was one of the prime candidates for the 'best/most OP' crown prior to the release of clans. The triple AC5/UAC5 ilya remains near the top of the list of mechs you least want to go face to face with in a dark alley.

Also a 2xERPPC/4xERMla fit is kind of hilariously heat-inefficient, which means slugging it out with a hyper-efficient ilya at short range is going to be a bad proposition (especially if you were on a hot map.)

I mean obviously timber wolfs get killed all the time. 'Overpowered' is not the same as 'invincible.' You played dumb by not leveraging your range and twist advantages and got beat.

Edited by AssaultPig, 19 September 2014 - 11:57 AM.

[Metus regem]

There is a reason that after 3050 TRO the Timber Wolf became THE poster mech, yes it is a clan mech, yes it does enjoy the general benifits of that, namely being the 20% weight advantage that all clan mechs have, so yes, they really are pocket versions of the next weight class. But they do pay for that; They cannot go Zombie mode with STD engines and CT weapons, they run hotter due to how their weapons generate extra heat.

In MWO, the clan mechs have a lot of hard-wired equipment from heat sinks, locations for FF and Endo, Fixed Engine sizes, some have fixed Jump Jets and some have a fixed weapon. In wave 2, we have units with more fixed equipment from active probes to the other items that I had already listed.

All that being said, in MWO for being a clanner, I will have a choice of 13 mechs when they are all out, the IS have a lot more than that, not counting the differnt model numbers with in a chassis family. Come the release of wave 2, there is going to be mass crying about the Mad Dog or the Hellbringer, lots of call for nerf this or nerf that. Just remeber if you nerf it, too hard you will be crying that you lost because someone brought a sub-optium mech on your team.

People cryed about the Victor's and Highlanders being OP, and look what happened to them... How often do you really see them in a match these days?

People cryed about Gauss Rifles and PPC's well look what happened there...

People cryed about the poptarts, look what happened to Jump Jets...

All I ask is you use that thing in your head called a brain, and try to think about what extra effects could happen if something gets nerfed into the ground.

[Hagoromo Gitsune]

Carrie Harder, on 19 September 2014 - 10:13 AM, said:

Actually, due to MWO's lack of engine crits, XXL engines would have the same overall durability/fragility as XL engines. The differences would be more critslots eaten in each side torso and probably some kind of heat penalty (the XXL gave +10 heat per turn in TT and doubled the amount of heat for movement).

XXL ELARs got only +3 conctant heat but weight twice less than XL and got twice more power yeld output. Plus than we will get our hands on mighty XXL ELAR 440... and Atlas can run 124kmph wihout MASC

Metus regem, on 19 September 2014 - 11:59 AM, said:

There is a reason that after 3050 TRO the Timber Wolf became THE poster mech, yes it is a clan mech, yes it does enjoy the general benifits of that, namely being the 20% weight advantage that all clan mechs have, so yes, they really are pocket versions of the next weight class. But they do pay for that; They cannot go Zombie mode with STD engines and CT weapons, they run hotter due to how their weapons generate extra heat.

In MWO, the clan mechs have a lot of hard-wired equipment from heat sinks, locations for FF and Endo, Fixed Engine sizes, some have fixed Jump Jets and some have a fixed weapon. In wave 2, we have units with more fixed equipment from active probes to the other items that I had already listed.

All that being said, in MWO for being a clanner, I will have a choice of 13 mechs when they are all out, the IS have a lot more than that, not counting the differnt model numbers with in a chassis family. Come the release of wave 2, there is going to be mass crying about the Mad Dog or the Hellbringer, lots of call for nerf this or nerf that. Just remeber if you nerf it, too hard you will be crying that you lost because someone brought a sub-optium mech on your team.

People cryed about the Victor's and Highlanders being OP, and look what happened to them... How often do you really see them in a match these days?

People cryed about Gauss Rifles and PPC's well look what happened there...

People cryed about the poptarts, look what happened to Jump Jets...

All I ask is you use that thing in your head called a brain, and try to think about what extra effects could happen if something gets nerfed into the ground.

THEY HAVE NO BRAIN! You shouting in the desert...

[VagGR]

what many people seem unable to understand is that this is a game, a F2P online shooter game. Like it or not the TW needs nerfs. Why? Not because some guy couldnt take it out in a DDC because its outperforming everyother mech in the game. Clearly. There is no denying that. Now some average people that payed for clans now may feel Godlike in their TWs and may get upset but the truth is that if this game is to survive and be what we want it to be then there cannot be a single chassis in this game with that much higher performance (no matter if its called victor or timberwolf). Thats why the TW needs to be nerfed. Get it?

Now, it should not be nerfed to the ground but it cant stay as is now. Just use your brains think about it, do you want MWO to be 24 guys in Timberwolfs and Victors bunnyhoping behind long distance cover? is this the MWO you want? because like it or not some things need to be nerfed for the greater good

[Metus regem]

Hagoromo Gitsune, on 19 September 2014 - 12:03 PM, said:

THEY HAVE NO BRAIN! You shouting in the desert...

Well my comment was more directed to any DEV that may see this nonsense, and think an idiot with a soap box might have a point...

On the other hand, this is a sad state to find ourselves in, that more than half the people that have been in here can't display any forethought to their actions should they come to pass.