123 replies to this topic

[Postumus]

If you want to bump the PPC by 100m/s, and the ERPPC by 200 or so, that would be fine. ERPPC is really hurting, especially the IS version which cannot use a Targeting Comp. If the ERPPC were given something closer to its previous velocity, that wouldn't wreck things because of its insane heat output.

HOWEVER. Gauss. It is still one of the best weapons in the game, hands down. It has excellent ammunition economy, no heat, insane velocity, high damage, and you can use it on mech torsos even with an XL engine. The projectile is so small and so fast, without any particles or tracers, that it is not hard to be able to nail someone at range several times before they figure out where you are. It has no minimum range. It has better ammo per ton than the AC/20. It costs only one more ton than the AC/20.

That is a giant, giant list of pros, balanced only by its low HP and explodyness (which is only after you lose all armor over it), and the charge up mechanic. I do not count the fact that it is 15 tons, because its a ballistic that does 15 points of damage at 1000m. Getting rid of the charge up mechanic, which is only really a hindrance to brawling with the thing, is just a bad idea. I remember when you would only ever see HBK-4G's with Gauss instead of AC/20s. Atlai, all with a Gauss, because Gauss wasn't a sniper ballistic, it was the best ballistic. No thanks.

[Lightfoot]

zortesh, on 21 September 2014 - 03:41 PM, said:

^ wasn't aware the no skill no drawback no heat guass ever left, I play dual guass mechs when I want easy mode, the chargeup mechanic made little difference to me.

Good, then it shouldn't make any difference if the charge held for 3 seconds to let the rest of us use it. Right?

And I don't know why people can't see the PPC is over nerfed now. It doesn't matter what I or you want. It's what Battle Tech says. Battle Tech balances all the mechs and load-outs to be roughly equal. MWO is locked into this GunWarrior thing where it's okay for Ballistics to blow mechs through the roof, but Energy weapons must be nerfed, controlled. I admit Energy can be exploited, but that is why you have a hard heat cap, then you don't have to worry about 9xERPPC Dire Wolves, they blow themselves up before they kill anything.

So you remove PPCs from their competitive balance. You just removed all the Energy-reliant Assault and Heavy mechs from competing. Light and Medium energy mechs can likely make just lasers work very well. Assaults, no way. So now assaults in MWO need Ballistic slots to compete.

So I don't care personally. I am well able to build a competitive mech and win games regardless of what PGI nerfs from week to week. Mechlab is my best skill. But when I see a frantic nerf like making PPCs slower than AC10's, but with a 90 meter minimum range I know PGI just ruined about a dozen mechs in their eagerness to continue to nerf the Gauss Rifle. Mechs I might have used or would like to use someday.

This is the over-arching issue, beyond just the damage and heat and weight comparisons, which people seem to be able to turn a blind eye too. It's about MWO fairly supporting all the Battle Tech mechs instead of just ballistics.

[TyphonCh]

I agree with the long rang combat to a point... It makes for a fuller experience to choose a role and play that role. But the weapons out currently fill that role just fine, nobody likes to be cored at 900m and not be able to enjoy a match. Its bad enough with lrms and how they are. Press R, get support. Repeat.
Now at least sniping with a ppc or guass takes skill and patience to line up a shot, rather than pointing and clicking for massive damage every 4 seconds. Imagine a DW with no guass charge and the ppc's at full speed?
Goodbye every light and medium mech that ever existed.

[MischiefSC]

So make lasers work by ballistics - PPFLD, have them shoot a projectile a la star wars.

Any mech with only 1 weapon type is nerfed and non-competitive.

There are plenty of pure energy builds that are competitive. Ask the laser vomit Timber Wolf. WubShee for the IS as a simple example. Laser-boat Battlemaster is... as effective as any BM.

False dilemma though. Any mech with mixed weapon loadouts is going to have an advantage as a given rule, a few synergy outliers (laservomit) aside.

PPc is part of the competitive lineup, if you don't think that you're not really looking at the competitive lineup. There's still DS poptarts in there if you restrict folks to IS only mechs for example. When CW rolls you'll see plenty of PPCs on the competitive IS teams, a few on the Clan competitive teams.

BT absolutely did not balance all the mechs and loadouts to be equal by the way. Not even vaguely close, not even a little. Missiles were generally crap for example. Pulse lasers were worth their weight much of the time because of the bonus to hit; it was hugely significant on a 2-12 roll. Clan LPLs were the best weapons no question and were insanely exploitable.

Also... lasers are pretty popular and common now, so it's not energy getting nerfed. In fact ACs have had the crap nerfed out of them again and again and again. AC2s are now useless, AC5s are only passable and AC20s are a narrow niche weapon. Clan ACs are only good for farming cbills.

PPCs are ballistics. They're not not better than all the other ballistics now. Ballistics are projectiles; that's what the PPC shot is, it's why it's PPFLD. You don't want it to be a ballistic weapon then it's a DoT or missile weapon.

This is part of the drama here. Wanting to pretend that PPCs need balanced with/against lasers when they function as a PPFLD weapon like ACs. Now they're balanced correctly for how they do damage and people want it to have the best of both again.