546 replies to this topic

[KamikazeRat]

Bishop Steiner, on 22 September 2014 - 02:14 PM, said:

That the Cyclops wins. Period.


Zeus will become another Orion. The masses clamor for it, it arrives, the overwhelming mediocrity of it shines through, nobody drives them now, and people that do are made fun of.



That's what "people are passionate" gets you.



Of course, sans any serious nods to Info Warfare? Cyclops is just at meh. But it's meh with 10 tons more to play with.

True...BUT...the protector was the first hero i purchased...KNOWING it was bad...because i loved the Orion chassis that much.
Zeus (and the Thug) would have doing the same thing, i don't care if it collects dust on a shelf...its mine...all mine....my precious


whoa...i went a little gollum there...

Edited by KamikazeRat, 22 September 2014 - 02:22 PM.

[FupDup]

Bishop Steiner, on 22 September 2014 - 02:20 PM, said:

pipe dream.

9 tons for twice the heat of a large laser, but only 50% more damage. Sounds like Ghost Heats wet dream, lol.

It doesn't have to be as bad in MWO as it was in TT.

Think of all the mechs with just 1 energy hardpoint like the Shad 2H and Cicada 3C. THINK OF THE CHILDREN!

Edited by FupDup, 22 September 2014 - 02:24 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

FupDup, on 22 September 2014 - 02:23 PM, said:

It doesn't have to be as bad in MWO as it was in TT.

Think of all the mechs with just 1 energy hardpoint like the Shad 2H and Cicada 3C. THINK OF THE CHILDREN!

Oh, so we make a special case anti suck policy just for that?

[FupDup]

Bishop Steiner, on 22 September 2014 - 02:30 PM, said:

Oh, so we make a special case anti suck policy just for that?

The anti-suck policy would be to make the weapon viable for anyone who wanted to use it. There are just certain variants that would enjoy its benefits the most.

[Weaselball]

Bishop Steiner, on 22 September 2014 - 02:30 PM, said:

Oh, so we make a special case anti suck policy just for that?

Yes, but only because the Zeus will be bringing it to the party.

[Bishop Steiner]

Weaselball, on 22 September 2014 - 02:31 PM, said:

Yes, but only because the Zeus will be bringing it to the party.

I refer to the weapon itself.

Pulse lasers have labored unde rht esuck bat for 2.5 years, as have flamers. But the Binary Laser gets pass and gets to be something it was not in TT? As in, good?

Thanks, I'd rather they just unsuck pulse lasers.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 22 September 2014 - 02:33 PM.

[Weaselball]

Bishop Steiner, on 22 September 2014 - 02:32 PM, said:

Thanks, I'd rather they just unsuck pulse lasers.

Let's compromise.

Unsuck Pulse lasers, and release the Zeus. It's win/win, really.

[FupDup]

Bishop Steiner, on 22 September 2014 - 02:32 PM, said:

Pulse lasers have labored unde rht esuck bat for 2.5 years, as have flamers. But the Binary Laser gets pass and gets to be something it was not in TT? As in, good?

Thanks, I'd rather they just unsuck pulse lasers.

[KamikazeRat]

Yeah, Blazer is bad.... 100% more heat to make it do 50% more damage.

now on sale: buy an 8 Pack for $8, or a 12 pack for $16

...wait....

Edited by KamikazeRat, 22 September 2014 - 02:38 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

FupDup, on 22 September 2014 - 02:36 PM, said:

because..... reasons, apparently? It's Russ's topic, maybe he can tell us why, in the name of balance, Pulse Lasers are still not worth it, 75% of the time. (well Clan ones are ok, or were until MPL got heat murdered...again)

[FupDup]

Bishop Steiner, on 22 September 2014 - 02:37 PM, said:

because..... reasons, apparently? It's Russ's topic, maybe he can tell us why, in the name of balance, Pulse Lasers are still not worth it, 75% of the time. (well Clan ones are ok, or were until MPL got heat murdered...again)

Aren't you the one who used to argue that the IS Medium and Large Pulses were worth it sometimes?

Not that I disagree with pulses (both sides) being outclassed for the most part. I'm getting nostalgic for "full auto wub" pulses from MW4 and tractor-beam pulses from MW3 again. :\

Edited by FupDup, 22 September 2014 - 02:40 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

KamikazeRat, on 22 September 2014 - 02:37 PM, said:

Yeah, Blazer is bad.... 100% more heat to make it do 50% more damage.

now on sale: buy an 8 Pack for 8, or a 12 pack for 16 dollars

...wait....

admittedly in TT, it was 50% more dmg, to one location. Almost made it worth it.... except a PPC/Er PPC was 2 tons less, did 2 less dmg, but also from 1-6 less heat...with 3-8 hex better range.

[MasterErrant]

i CHOSE THE CYCLOPS we already have multiple 80 tonners. I would really like the mauler though. and it the right time...

[Bishop Steiner]

FupDup, on 22 September 2014 - 02:39 PM, said:

Aren't you the one who used to argue that the IS Medium and Large Pulses were worth it sometimes?

Not that I disagree with pulses (both sides) being outclassed for the most part.

I have argued their situational value. Which is not the same as calling them good. SImply that in all cases, and scenarios, they are not bad. But...those are pretty few and far between.

And the miniscule better damage on CMPL, for the heat, less range and twice the tonnage? Not great. If they at least cut the beam duration to closer to the IS version, it would still have utility.

[KamikazeRat]

Bishop Steiner, on 22 September 2014 - 02:39 PM, said:

Almost made it worth it

stressed that part...in MWO, the only niche it would fill is mechs that have 1 energy slot. and even then the heat from it will dissuade almost everyone from using it....still, if they want to throw it in the mix...im game....prepare for people trying to boat them and blowing up shortly thereafter. (like the 9cERPPC dire wolves)

Edited by KamikazeRat, 22 September 2014 - 02:46 PM.

[FupDup]

Bishop Steiner, on 22 September 2014 - 02:41 PM, said:

I have argued their situational value. Which is not the same as calling them good. SImply that in all cases, and scenarios, they are not bad. But...those are pretty few and far between.

And the miniscule better damage on CMPL, for the heat, less range and twice the tonnage? Not great. If they at least cut the beam duration to closer to the IS version, it would still have utility.

I've always favored just rebuilding them from the ground up to be "laser dakka." Making them be "laser almost-FLD" might work if the right values are chosen, but it seems like a missed opportunity to make them have a truly "different" mechanic than regular lasers with modified values.

KamikazeRat, on 22 September 2014 - 02:44 PM, said:

stressed that part...in MWO, the only niche it would fill is mechs that have 1 energy slot. and even then the heat from it will dissuade almost everyone from using it....still, if they want to throw it in the mix...im game....prepare for people trying to boat them and blowing up shortly thereafter.

We could mod the values a bit to make it closer to worth the exchange.

As the starter values, we'll take 50% more damage than the LL and 100% more heat:
Damage: 9 x 1.5 = 13.5
Heat: 7 x 2 = 14

So far, not that great. Better than TT, but not that good yet. I'd probably bump the damage up to somewhere in the neighborhood of 15.5. It would still be less damaging than 2 LL, which would be fine because it weighs 1 ton less and only needs 1 hardpoint.

Depending on how merciful PGI is, it might also get a max alpha limit of 2, which would enable it to fire a larger alpha than Large Lasers without receiving a heat penalty (this probably has a 50-50 chance of happening).

Edited by FupDup, 22 September 2014 - 02:50 PM.

[MauttyKoray]

Cyclops - Gonna have to throw my lot in with this one. Its a very unique mech aesthetically and I personally love its design and function. It will be a nice addition to the assault line up.

Zeus - My 2nd choice and it should definitely come out soon/the near future. Another great Assault weapons platform to bring another option for firepower to the front line.

Charger - Have people even read up on this thing?! Seriously, its a light mech on an assault chassis. Its FAST I'll give it that, however the firepower is equal to or less than many lights, and the armor it carries is a fraction of most other assaults. People complain about mediums being too big and not being durable enough or carrying enough firepower...well there's your basic comparison for this assault: big with a lack of fire power and armor. It would require some SERIOUS hardpoint fudging and quirks to make this mech any real use, or just scrap the speed for more armor/weapons.

[KamikazeRat]

MauttyKoray, on 22 September 2014 - 02:49 PM, said:

Charger stuff

some of the other variants actually turn it into a decent assault. but yeah, we would have the 5slas joke of a mech...that could be easily turned into a alternate awesome with possibly better hitboxes. but it wouldnt get the quirks that have brought the awesomes out of mothballs.

[Lightfoot]

I think Zeus due to the many variants and diversity, and the Banshee, Highlander, Battlemaster have the 90 ton Assault level pretty well covered. Only the Orion is 75 tons in the Heavy class too. Victor is weighted for jump-jets, Awesome for Energy and Missiles. No all-around 80 tonner except the Zeus, which has some of everything. It can adapt.

[Zordicron]

I cose Cyclops, because I drool thinking about what Alex could come up with for that thing. Plus Zeus IMO is very similar looking to an Awesome, and while i want it to be in sometime soon also- I mean I am not sure how the player base would respond to having another Awesome but that got better hitbox and scaling lol. Still, I want it eventually.

Russ, on the Cyclops, it would be an ideal time to re-introduce the glowing eye(s) of Atlas. Imagine it on a toggle, and that big mega mono-eye turns angry red when the fighting starts. Or on a night map- ECM raven is tooling around looking for a target, comes around a corner in the dark, GLOWING RED EYE OF ANGRY staring back.

Alex, on the Cyclops, I know you have awesomesauce in a jar waiting for this thing(and the Supernova and Cauldron Born) I imagine a little less "hat" art style on the head, more cowl/shield type instead.

Seriously though, Giant glowing eye would make it the coolest thing since sliced bread.