319 replies to this topic

[Kin3ticX]

Russ Bullock, on 22 September 2014 - 12:16 PM, said:

It is the group queue that is frustrating players - especially groups on the smaller side.

I think this is where a big chunk of your player base is hitting a skill climb/cliff. There should be some kind of mechanism built into the debrief screen so they can see what they faced and mimic it should they choose to adapt. Believe me, I have seen a lot of sub-sub-suboptimal builds stomping around in the group queue.

[Crockdaddy]

Akulla1980, on 22 September 2014 - 12:30 PM, said:

As usual it's all the players who form 12 mans who are screaming no. Because the can't go wiping out the small pug groups.

So what needs to be decided is does this game cater for a smaller hardcore player base with a few 12 mans and everyone else who has the shits getting stomped playing only in solo
Or a broader base of players in a more FUN CASUAL ENVIROMENT. With more smaller groups?

I don't agree with you at all whatsoever. True 12 man groups are fairly rare. Even now. I have over 10,000 drops in my game history. You might say I play often. One item I would like to see is allowing solo players the option to join into the group queue to fill in. I'd love it if I was #12 on a random 11 man .... or 2 solo into a 10 man. This might better allow for a closer 3-3-3-3 reality. Notice I said the option to be in the group queue not mandatory.

Last note on 12 mans. Most units whom run full 12s want competition ... even when its my guys set up for a fight and we run into 228th in the conquest queue ... sure we almost always lose that match but we fight all the fiercer trying to beat them at their own game. 12 - 0 / 12 - 3 stomps happen but are not always for "auto epeen fun" for us either. I'd like to have my fight mean something.

[Aym]

Russ Bullock, on 22 September 2014 - 12:16 PM, said:

Honestly any groups in the solo queue really screws it up. The solo Queue right now is actually pretty amazing with an average team elo difference of around 40. Exact weight class matching 95% of the time etc.

It is the group queue that is frustrating players - especially groups on the smaller side.

That's what my suggestion would help fix, imo.

[Crockdaddy]

When I am "pugging" solo without any lancemates, I would love to be gap filler in the 12 man queue. This would allow 11 mans to roll and say put 2 solo with the 10 man while the 2 man comes into the 4/6 or 5/5 grouping and it may allow for greater ability to get closer to a 3-3-3-3 model. I think a simple check box giving me an option to fill group launches first (and then solo if no groups found) would be great.

[9thDeathscream]

CrockdaddyAoD, on 22 September 2014 - 12:41 PM, said:

I don't agree with you at all whatsoever. True 12 man groups are fairly rare. Even now. I have over 10,000 drops in my game history. You might say I play often. One item I would like to see is allowing solo players the option to join into the group queue to fill in. I'd love it if I was #12 on a random 11 man .... or 2 solo into a 10 man. This might better allow for a closer 3-3-3-3 reality. Notice I said the option to be in the group queue not mandatory.

Last note on 12 mans. Most units whom run full 12s want competition ... even when its my guys set up for a fight and we run into 228th in the conquest queue ... sure we almost always lose that match but we fight all the fiercer trying to beat them at their own game. 12 - 0 / 12 - 3 stomps happen but are not always for "auto epeen fun" for us either. I'd like to have my fight mean something.

If ur in anything under 8 man forget it. Gunna be stomp after stomp agaist you. Unless you are lucky. I've done enough drops in both queues to know the story. With various sized groups. Matter of the fact is small group = no fun.

[Thorn Hallis]

Someone always gets the rear end. For over a year it were the solo players, now its the small groups players. With that small player base I don't see any change happen in the near future that would satisfy every player.

[-Natural Selection-]

I find it funny that friends and I can form up a 4 man and play a couple hours until the rest start piling on. During that time mayyybe run into a 12 man once a day. Then when we get up to 10 or 12 players maybe face 1 or 2, 12 mans the rest of the night.

Where are all these 12 mans? Not saying they are not out there, but we sure as hell are not seeing a non-stop roll of them.

[topgun505]

All joking aside, pilots didn't often die in TT. Granted a gauss slug or clan erppc to the face would result in a red stain in the cockpit bit that wasn't a frequent occurrence (unless you play Megamek with its wonky RNG).

Technically speaking there's a lot more 'death' to be had in COD, BF4 and the like. Here you are mainly killing hardware.

Joseph Mallan, on 22 September 2014 - 09:20 AM, said:

Heck yes!
Nobody ever dies in this murder simulator.

[Aym]

CrockdaddyAoD, on 22 September 2014 - 12:45 PM, said:

When I am "pugging" solo without any lancemates, I would love to be gap filler in the 12 man queue. This would allow 11 mans to roll and say put 2 solo with the 10 man while the 2 man comes into the 4/6 or 5/5 grouping and it may allow for greater ability to get closer to a 3-3-3-3 model. I think a simple check box giving me an option to fill group launches first (and then solo if no groups found) would be great.

I Agree, and I think it would be good for "the community" and help interaction/growth. House Marik got as big as we did in part by recruting pug fillers in our groups.

[Metafox]

Russ Bullock, on 22 September 2014 - 11:51 AM, said:

1) Solo queue was very upset that any groups at all were in and wiping them.
2) Putting all 2-3 man groups in with the solo queue means removing groups of 9 and 10 from the group queue.

Then make groups of 4 made up of one of each weight class, groups of 8 made of of 2 of each weight class, finally 12 mans made up of the 3,3,3,3.

I'd really prefer to keep things as they are. I really don't want to go back to the days where I can't play unless we have the exact correct number of people on TS.

[KingCobra]

Thorn Hallis said (Someone always gets the rear end. For over a year it were the solo players, now its the small groups players. With that small player base I don't see any change happen in the near future that would satisfy every player.)
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I have the perfect answer to the group MM queues problems but like everything else on these forums it always is over shouted and under valued.

Edited by KingCobra, 22 September 2014 - 12:56 PM.

[stevemac]

The only changes I would make is the following

Make the group Q 1-12 giving solo players the option to join the group Q ( allowing people to make groups of 11)
Give 2 man groups the option of being in the solo Q or the group Q but limit it that to 2 man groups 3 or more should be in the group Q

What ever is done please don't lock down the group sizes IE 4,8,12. I dont want to go back to telling the 5th guy so your S.O.L.

Edited by stevemac, 22 September 2014 - 01:26 PM.

[Mogney]

The solo queue has never been more fun that it is now.

The group queue has never been more fun than it is now.

I think changing the game mode to a vote system will make it even better.

Please dont mix the group and solo queues again, it would be a step backwards.

thanks,
Mogney

[Tastian]

I think the current solo and group queues are amazing - best matches ever in fact. What I think could use some work is the elo brackets (or lack thereof). I get frustrated as an experienced player when I get dropped with several very new players running trial mechs. And I know new players get frustrated filling up spots in an elo bracket with veterans. I really really really wish we had skill brackets. They could still be set up into tiers based on current elo math. But the brackets would never mix. The MM would never pull players from the 'new player' elo bracket to fill up slots in a 'veteran player' game. And vice versa.

[MischiefSC]

Group in solo queue = playing with an advantage. Even just 2 players is an advantage. That's why the revolt against groups in solo queue. Putting any groups back in solo queue is bad.

A better option is trying to focus the group queue around homogeneity of group sizes between teams.

[9thDeathscream]

So what we are saying is screw the casual player base?? Bugger the small groups. Who cares as long as the larger organised groups are having fun! Is that right or am I misinterpreting this thread?

Some people just wanna group with 1 or 2 friends or relatives and go have a run. Maybe win a few games. Not get annihilated 90% of the time.

The way it is either go in a larger group or be fodder. So wheres the fun?

Edited by Akulla1980, 22 September 2014 - 01:14 PM.

[Aym]

Akulla1980, on 22 September 2014 - 01:11 PM, said:

So what we are saying is screw the casual player base?? Bugger the small groups. Who cares as long as the larger organised groups are having fun! Is that right or am I misinterpreting this thread?

Some people just wanna group with 1 or 2 friends or relatives and go have a run. Maybe win a few games. Not get annihilated 90% of the time.

The way it is either go in a larger group or be fodder. So wheres the fun?

You're missing quite a bit. Many are saying they like things as are, some are saying we hope to improve the experience for small groups and large groups and individual players.

[Bishop Steiner]

Russ Bullock, on 22 September 2014 - 11:51 AM, said:

Getting on with it, isn't possible. Any change we make is viewed as a fatal error by some and the right move by others. We need more agreement on what the best trade offs are.

A few things to keep in mind:

1) Solo queue was very upset that any groups at all were in and wiping them.
2) Putting all 2-3 man groups in with the solo queue means removing groups of 9 and 10 from the group queue.

We can make this a lot more competitive but you guys need to let me know what is acceptable. Off the top of my head if we could put groups of 2 and 3 in solo queue and restrict group queue to group sizes of 4, 8 and 12. Then make game mode selection a vote instead of a hard stop. Then make groups of 4 made up of one of each weight class, groups of 8 made of of 2 of each weight class, finally 12 mans made up of the 3,3,3,3.

The match maker would have a grand time of putting matches together.

I prefer my Solos stay solo, TBH. But I have long said, put a check box on it. Give people the option to be included in group drops if they so desire and the pool needs a body. How hard could that be to add?

Work the actual Elo/Skill formula more, if possible.

[Gas Guzzler]

Akulla1980, on 22 September 2014 - 12:47 PM, said:

If ur in anything under 8 man forget it. Gunna be stomp after stomp agaist you. Unless you are lucky. I've done enough drops in both queues to know the story. With various sized groups. Matter of the fact is small group = no fun.

That has not been my experience at all. Always have fun in small groups. Nothing wrong with a little challenge.

[9thDeathscream]

Gas Guzzler, on 22 September 2014 - 01:16 PM, said:

That has not been my experience at all. Always have fun in small groups. Nothing wrong with a little challenge.

Well it hasn't been my experience. First introduction to new system many moons ago was being dropped 4 times against the same 12 man. In a row. Kinda puts a bad taste in your mouth. Then half the people you used to play with say go to hell with the group queue i am sick of continually being stomped.