103 replies to this topic

[Funkadelic Mayhem]

Darian DelFord, on 03 October 2014 - 05:18 PM, said:

The greatest buff the lights can get, as someone said above is to nerf the turning speed and radius of the heavier mechs. Its stupid how quick assault mechs can turn around,

THIS!!!!!!!!!!!!!! HECK FRACKING THIS PGI!


BUT


Some founders QQed and PGI upped their turning speed and radius. As I have said many times, the founders (thank you for your service) think they can get away with murder just because they are founders and QQ enough. They keep buffing heavy and assaults because founders QQed, now they have neglected lights to the point unless your a die hard light pilot like myself, you just dont want to put the time and effort into them.

Deathlike, on 03 October 2014 - 05:44 PM, said:

You know what really sucks... is if a Light pilot has to carry the team. It's already happened to me, at least twice today in the tourney.

It's disappointing too, including the sub-100 damage games.

your preaching to the choir brother! But with me its im expected to carry 9 out of 10 times. I just cant do it. Its at a point now, (put on your tin foil hats) I think PGI is testing me and my skills and effing me just so they can get some numbers for their stats. Its about MWO break time 4 me. I cant be the only one who notices if you win a match on X map, the next match on the same X map is a loss.

(pgi if you are reading this I cant be you test monkey anymore. My skills need to shine. I cant help it Im an awesome light pilot and you need to make what would be 600 dmg be 0) You need to stop!

Edited by Funkadelic Mayhem, 03 October 2014 - 05:54 PM.

[st1x]

Funky, you have NO idea how painful foundering lights were, we were constantly the targets and culprits because our hitboxs were broken, or we could out turn lrms (the boats cried) or net code simply stopped people from hitting us..streak cats were invented specifically to hurt lights...we're recieved the bad end of the stick all the way through and my god you should have heard the bitching when they took out collisions.

This worthy adversaries 2 contest is just a phalus past an unlubricated sphincter for any light pilots at the moment. Is there actually any single pilot out there that has managed to hit the magical 130 points? ive come close. once. but because it is a contest everyone is out bringing the meta to the yard. all evening ive seen just 9% on the queue...it zoomed up to 11% at one time but now its back. It is a horrible horrible time to be a light pilot, all of the promised love has yet to be seen and for the time being we are just being subjected to snuggles with struggles.

[Darian DelFord]

There are so many problems with lights, and some easy fixes out there. I think tomorrow I will make a big post that puts all these Light Topics into one thread and post it this weekend and or Monday

[Wolfways]

Foxfire, on 03 October 2014 - 03:53 PM, said:

Light mechs, as is, are the most unforgiving mechs in the game.

What do you mean by "unforgiving"?

[Darian DelFord]

Wolfways, on 03 October 2014 - 06:29 PM, said:

What do you mean by "unforgiving"?

My guess is you have to be on your A game almost every time or your toast. I know since the inception of the clans, any idiot with 12 M Lasers can just strafe my legs and I am hurting.

[Funkadelic Mayhem]

Darian DelFord, on 03 October 2014 - 06:32 PM, said:

My guess is you have to be on your A game almost every time or your toast. I know since the inception of the clans, any idiot with 12 M Lasers can just strafe my legs and I am hurting.

They dont even need to hit them, just get close.... This game used to be about skill, but some bad players QQed enough now assaults and heavies got buffs that in hindsight nurfed the lights.

[Mercules]

Viktor Drake, on 03 October 2014 - 03:28 PM, said:

The size of the light que is determined by the players, not by the lack of light mechs being viable and competitive. You can't purposely design lights to be overpowered just to encourage people to pick a playstyle that most don't enjoy and that is what would have to happen to get more people playing these.

They don't need to be overpowered, but currently there are much less rewards for playing a light. XP and C-bills can often come very slow unless you build strictly to get assists and kill steals and ignore tactics that might actually help your team win. No other set of mechs is penalized for playing it's role correctly. Anything a light can do a speedy medium can also do.

Viktor Drake, on 03 October 2014 - 03:28 PM, said:

Honestly light mechs are kind of like Healers in other MMOs. Everyone wants to play DPS but no one wants to heal. This doesn't mean healers suck, it just means most people prefer DPS, simple as that. Same with MWO, people perfer to DPS and to DPS you need to be in a Heavy or Assault. Mediums are like Hybrid characters useful and versatile but the last choice for inclusion to the party and the Lights are the pure support and healer classes, necessary to really do well but always in short supply.

Eh... sounds like most people are stupid. I know of 3 MMOs where I gathered together a large group of "Healers" and told the DPS to go suck eggs. We cleared missions/quests/dungeons/raids without them and when I was told by a guildie to give up some of the healers because we were just wasting time I pointed out we went through the raid just as fast as a mixed team. Basically my point was we didn't need them, they needed us because DPS without mitigation was a losing prospect and there was very little we couldn't attrition down. That and most "Healer" classes in MMOs get skills/spells that they rarely get to actually use that can end up doing significant damage used correctly. It's just that most the time they are stuck hitting the same 4 buttons with buttons 5 and 6 thrown in from time to time because OTHER people can't figure out how to build a character that doesn't die without a constant influx of healing.

[Mercules]

Funkadelic Mayhem, on 03 October 2014 - 05:45 PM, said:

Some founders QQed and PGI upped their turning speed and radius. As I have said many times, the founders (thank you for your service) think they can get away with murder just because they are founders and QQ enough. They keep buffing heavy and assaults because founders QQed, now they have neglected lights to the point unless your a die hard light pilot like myself, you just dont want to put the time and effort into them.

I think you have some revisionist history going on there with a healthy bias against founders for no apparent reason. It wasn't the Founders who have been asking for a dumbed down game where big mechs dance like ballerinas. I think the vast majority of us were happy with the way mechs moved in Closed Beta other than mech running up hills full speed. I was happy when I heard they were going to make you slow down to go uphill(like you should) but then not happy with the way they implemented it.

[Project_Mercy]

I'm glad they're posting the totals for the tourney publicly. You'll notice that next to the direwolf parade, IS lights are basically at the top of the totals. It's because they're overly good. The ember being the worst offender. Keep that in mind. Next to dire wolves, the next most damaging and effective mech is an IS light, Higher scores than timberwolves and stormcrows which everyone is complaining about.

[Foxfire]

Wraeththix Constantine, on 03 October 2014 - 06:59 PM, said:

I'm glad they're posting the totals for the tourney publicly. You'll notice that next to the direwolf parade, IS lights are basically at the top of the totals. It's because they're overly good. The ember being the worst offender. Keep that in mind. Next to dire wolves, the next most damaging and effective mech is an IS light, Higher scores than timberwolves and stormcrows which everyone is complaining about.

To me, the issue isn't about how they perform in the hands of the upper class echelons of the light pilots. A light mech in the hands of a capable pilot is a potent mech.

The problem is the skill curve it takes to be anything but a liability to your side with a drop. This unforgiving nature of the class is why you see so few light mechs drop. The question, for me, comes down to what can you change to encourage more people to play light mechs without skewing the top tier?

*edits to add*

As I stated earlier, a minor mistake in a light mech is much more deadly to the pilot than it is in any other class.

Edited by Foxfire, 03 October 2014 - 07:27 PM.

[Jman5]

Darian DelFord, on 03 October 2014 - 05:18 PM, said:

The greatest buff the lights can get, as someone said above is to nerf the turning speed and radius of the heavier mechs. Its stupid how quick assault mechs can turn around,

I wish, but it wont happen. Too many people freaked out when they nerfed the victor's agility and now they're getting rid of it.

[mike29tw]

Wraeththix Constantine, on 03 October 2014 - 06:59 PM, said:

I'm glad they're posting the totals for the tourney publicly. You'll notice that next to the direwolf parade, IS lights are basically at the top of the totals. It's because they're overly good. The ember being the worst offender. Keep that in mind. Next to dire wolves, the next most damaging and effective mech is an IS light, Higher scores than timberwolves and stormcrows which everyone is complaining about.

Because the tourney is limited to single queue only.

[Darian DelFord]

mike29tw, on 03 October 2014 - 07:31 PM, said:

Because the tourney is limited to single queue only.

People conveniently leave that point out

[Funkadelic Mayhem]

Wraeththix Constantine, on 03 October 2014 - 06:59 PM, said:

I'm glad they're posting the totals for the tourney publicly. You'll notice that next to the direwolf parade, IS lights are basically at the top of the totals. It's because they're overly good. The ember being the worst offender. Keep that in mind. Next to dire wolves, the next most damaging and effective mech is an IS light, Higher scores than timberwolves and stormcrows which everyone is complaining about.

mike29tw, on 03 October 2014 - 07:31 PM, said:

Because the tourney is limited to single queue only.

Darian DelFord, on 03 October 2014 - 07:50 PM, said:

People conveniently leave that point out

you must not be refreshing you turny screen... other then the total score which are close across the board.. you dont get any other numbers... The turny scores you see on the turny page say nothing about how lights are OK. Sober Up!

Mercules, on 03 October 2014 - 06:47 PM, said:

I think you have some revisionist history going on there with a healthy bias against founders for no apparent reason. It wasn't the Founders who have been asking for a dumbed down game where big mechs dance like ballerinas. I think the vast majority of us were happy with the way mechs moved in Closed Beta other than mech running up hills full speed. I was happy when I heard they were going to make you slow down to go uphill(like you should) but then not happy with the way they implemented it.

says the guy who is an elite founder and is to ignorant to know your posts can be looked up.

Edited by Funkadelic Mayhem, 03 October 2014 - 09:13 PM.

[Project_Mercy]

So, the fact that lights do a huge amount of damage, get a large number of assists and kill, and can accomplish scouting and running down other mechs, but somehow they're weak, because in group queue you can't charge the 3 DW and 3 TBR front on your own like you can in solo queue?

Group queue is not somehow better or more validated than solo queue. Plenty of people get carried far more in a group than they can carry in solo queue. The fact that pretty much all game decisions are based around "how does this effect group queue" is partially why solo queue is such a cesspool.

I'm totally willing to learn from your posts, but your posts and my reality do not line up. Lights are almost always the last mechs standing, they regularly have the highest damage done on the team, or at a minimum are really close to the assaults and heavies. Why do they have the highest damage? Because for the IS lights at least, it's pretty easy to stay around their backs.
Spiders, Firestarters and Commandos regularly run right through the middle of 1-2 lances of heavy and assault mechs and come out with yellow armor while they drop a strike and a UAV.

I expect that maybe in the high ELO games where people's aim is better, then maybe it's an issue; but If you're playing a light mech, that's what you signed up for. Not charging around with an invuln shield on like most of the time.

[CocoaJin]

That can also indicate that the lights aren't in the queue because they are all playing. Too me, I see that lights are being quickly dropped into games. It's not that there are too little lights, just a bunch of excess everything else

[Funkadelic Mayhem]

Wraeththix Constantine, on 03 October 2014 - 09:48 PM, said:

So, the fact that lights do a huge amount of damage, get a large number of assists and kill, and can accomplish scouting and running down other mechs, but somehow they're weak, because in group queue you can't charge the 3 DW and 3 TBR front on your own like you can in solo queue?

Group queue is not somehow better or more validated than solo queue. Plenty of people get carried far more in a group than they can carry in solo queue. The fact that pretty much all game decisions are based around "how does this effect group queue" is partially why solo queue is such a cesspool.

I'm totally willing to learn from your posts, but your posts and my reality do not line up. Lights are almost always the last mechs standing, they regularly have the highest damage done on the team, or at a minimum are really close to the assaults and heavies. Why do they have the highest damage? Because for the IS lights at least, it's pretty easy to stay around their backs.
Spiders, Firestarters and Commandos regularly run right through the middle of 1-2 lances of heavy and assault mechs and come out with yellow armor while they drop a strike and a UAV.

I expect that maybe in the high ELO games where people's aim is better, then maybe it's an issue; but If you're playing a light mech, that's what you signed up for. Not charging around with an invuln shield on like most of the time.

of course your posts and reality dont line up. You read into and make up your own posts to reply to and make up a reply that has nothing to do with whats being talked about except what ever you fill in your head to justify denying lights are far from fine.

CocoaJin, on 03 October 2014 - 10:00 PM, said:

That can also indicate that the lights aren't in the queue because they are all playing. Too me, I see that lights are being quickly dropped into games. It's not that there are too little lights, just a bunch of excess everything else

EVEN by the logic that "all lights are in a match" that still leaves the % you see. But that is to smarty pants dance for some of you. LMAO. The player base is not that big... and numbers dont lie... even if mainstream media news taught you they do.

Edited by Funkadelic Mayhem, 03 October 2014 - 10:12 PM.

[operatorZ]

Wraeththix Constantine, on 03 October 2014 - 09:48 PM, said:

So, the fact that lights do a huge amount of damage, get a large number of assists and kill, and can accomplish scouting and running down other mechs, but somehow they're weak, because in group queue you can't charge the 3 DW and 3 TBR front on your own like you can in solo queue?

Group queue is not somehow better or more validated than solo queue. Plenty of people get carried far more in a group than they can carry in solo queue. The fact that pretty much all game decisions are based around "how does this effect group queue" is partially why solo queue is such a cesspool.

I'm totally willing to learn from your posts, but your posts and my reality do not line up. Lights are almost always the last mechs standing, they regularly have the highest damage done on the team, or at a minimum are really close to the assaults and heavies. Why do they have the highest damage? Because for the IS lights at least, it's pretty easy to stay around their backs.
Spiders, Firestarters and Commandos regularly run right through the middle of 1-2 lances of heavy and assault mechs and come out with yellow armor while they drop a strike and a UAV.

I expect that maybe in the high ELO games where people's aim is better, then maybe it's an issue; but If you're playing a light mech, that's what you signed up for. Not charging around with an invuln shield on like most of the time.

Exactly, I don't play lights because it's too easy to be "hey, your alone, I run fast and I'm short so you can't hit me so I win" talk about a broken game mechanic. I also consistently see lights dominating the end of matches. A light should in no way be able to 1 v 1 any higher ton mech, barring severe player skill unbalance. A light mech being able to 1v1 a heavy mech isn't lore, tabletop or any other combination. Light mechs are 2nd class citizens in the mech world, NOT THAT I LIKE THIS. It's just the truth.

In order for light mechs to have a true purpose, (other than broken game mechanic that allows them to kill heavies and assaults by running around them.....lol and they call it skill) they need game modes that include goals and objectives that actually reward what lights mech should do, what they are designed to do "SCOUT"

In addition....I have ZERO idea why OP cares that 1% of the que is lights, honestly if I enjoyed playing a mech class that was 1% of the que....how sweet that would be...no wait times and people don't know how to fight you. But that's not what this is about is it? This is about QQ so I can get some buffs...or why else would you even say anything?

[Deathlike]

st1x, on 03 October 2014 - 06:09 PM, said:

Funky, you have NO idea how painful foundering lights were, we were constantly the targets and culprits because our hitboxs were broken, or we could out turn lrms (the boats cried) or net code simply stopped people from hitting us..streak cats were invented specifically to hurt lights...we're recieved the bad end of the stick all the way through and my god you should have heard the bitching when they took out collisions.

This worthy adversaries 2 contest is just a phalus past an unlubricated sphincter for any light pilots at the moment. Is there actually any single pilot out there that has managed to hit the magical 130 points? ive come close. once. but because it is a contest everyone is out bringing the meta to the yard. all evening ive seen just 9% on the queue...it zoomed up to 11% at one time but now its back. It is a horrible horrible time to be a light pilot, all of the promised love has yet to be seen and for the time being we are just being subjected to snuggles with struggles.

Well, I'm probably a special case... ranked #17 now (will obviously lose pace once I sleep) and got 12 of the 20 total at the moment. I need the money, and farming c-bills in a light requires a bit of effort (and not dying so stupidly often, which I still do).

Wraeththix Constantine, on 03 October 2014 - 09:48 PM, said:

So, the fact that lights do a huge amount of damage, get a large number of assists and kill, and can accomplish scouting and running down other mechs, but somehow they're weak, because in group queue you can't charge the 3 DW and 3 TBR front on your own like you can in solo queue?

You're assuming that happens frequently, but it doesn't happen like that often at all.

Quote

Group queue is not somehow better or more validated than solo queue. Plenty of people get carried far more in a group than they can carry in solo queue. The fact that pretty much all game decisions are based around "how does this effect group queue" is partially why solo queue is such a cesspool.

The solo queue is unfortunately influenced by the lack of tutorials. Even the basic skill of using "R" is Lostech. That's reality. It's hard to see progression if the new players don't really know where to begin.

Quote

I'm totally willing to learn from your posts, but your posts and my reality do not line up. Lights are almost always the last mechs standing, they regularly have the highest damage done on the team, or at a minimum are really close to the assaults and heavies. Why do they have the highest damage? Because for the IS lights at least, it's pretty easy to stay around their backs.
Spiders, Firestarters and Commandos regularly run right through the middle of 1-2 lances of heavy and assault mechs and come out with yellow armor while they drop a strike and a UAV.

I expect that maybe in the high ELO games where people's aim is better, then maybe it's an issue; but If you're playing a light mech, that's what you signed up for. Not charging around with an invuln shield on like most of the time.

Generally, there are only 3 possibilities where Light mechs are the last man standing...

1) Players ignore them - this happens a lot, when shooting down the Dire Wolf or the Atlas is easier for the majority of people.

2) The light pilot stays away from combat. Of course, pilots+mechs of all shapes and sizes tend to hide in combat, so don't be surprised to see a Dire Wolf stay hidden and be useless for no particular reason... just as much as a Locust.

3) The light pilot... shockingly knows how to play the mech. If you've ended up at this option, that's a tiny minority to speak out against.

[Mercules]

Funkadelic Mayhem, on 03 October 2014 - 08:41 PM, said:

says the guy who is an elite founder and is to ignorant to know your posts can be looked up.

"Says the guy who is an elite Founder and is TOO ignorant..." Irony is when someone makes an ignorant grammar error while calling someone ignorant.

In any case feel free to go through every single post I have every written... ever... Give me an instance where I would have called for Heavy and Assaults to become more agile or Lights to become less. Take your time since you will be going through all of them and still not finding one.