103 replies to this topic

[Heisenbug]

One thing I haven't read in this post yet: you need a good rig (=host) to run lights. You better have a couple video cards from the last year or two, or your screen's gonna be a blur. Or your legs will have been shot out cause you're stopping to aim.

Light definitely require a higher skill level. But they also require better hardware.

[Mercules]

operatorZ, on 03 October 2014 - 10:22 PM, said:

Exactly, I don't play lights because it's too easy to be "hey, your alone, I run fast and I'm short so you can't hit me so I win" talk about a broken game mechanic. I also consistently see lights dominating the end of matches. A light should in no way be able to 1 v 1 any higher ton mech, barring severe player skill unbalance. A light mech being able to 1v1 a heavy mech isn't lore, tabletop or any other combination. Light mechs are 2nd class citizens in the mech world, NOT THAT I LIKE THIS. It's just the truth.

Um.... You are incorrect. Lights are in fact able to 1v1 heavy mechs in TT. There is this thing called maneuverability that lets the light mech get to the Heavy Mech's back, to a side, or to a range where the Heavy isn't bringing all his weapons to bear. The Light runs and builds up a +2 to hit the Heavy but moves fast enough or with the ability to get to cover so the Heavy is always +3 to hit him if not worse. I have taken 70 tonners out with those silly Locusts in TT.

operatorZ, on 03 October 2014 - 10:22 PM, said:

In order for light mechs to have a true purpose, (other than broken game mechanic that allows them to kill heavies and assaults by running around them.....lol and they call it skill) they need game modes that include goals and objectives that actually reward what lights mech should do, what they are designed to do "SCOUT"

Shall we give a breakdown of common Light Roles from the Lore?

Commando - Guerilla/Striker
Locust - Guerilla/Infantry hunter/Scout
Jenner - Striker
Firestarter - Infantry hunter/Support/Striker (Fires and smoke can be a beautiful thing to cover your brawler style mechs as they advance on a longer ranged lance.
Raven - Scout(at least the 3L the 4X was designed for fighting
Spider - Scout

operatorZ, on 03 October 2014 - 10:22 PM, said:

In addition....I have ZERO idea why OP cares that 1% of the que is lights, honestly if I enjoyed playing a mech class that was 1% of the que....how sweet that would be...no wait times and people don't know how to fight you. But that's not what this is about is it? This is about QQ so I can get some buffs...or why else would you even say anything?

Buffs? Unneeded. Ways to earn cash/XP that are not shared by bigger classes or "shoot things" which they can simply do better by grounds of being able to carry more guns would be nice.

[Heisenbug]

Mercules, on 03 October 2014 - 10:41 PM, said:

Irony is when someone makes an ignorant grammar error while calling someone ignorant.

...and the guy criticizing grammar needs to pound sand.

[Mercules]

Heisenbug, on 03 October 2014 - 10:59 PM, said:

One thing I haven't read in this post yet: you need a good rig (=host) to run lights. You better have a couple video cards from the last year or two, or your screen's gonna be a blur. Or your legs will have been shot out cause you're stopping to aim.

Light definitely require a higher skill level. But they also require better hardware.

Maybe? Definitely not a dual GPU setup since MWO only uses one card in nearly every case anyway. You should probably be running just as good a system for any chassis.

[Mercules]

Heisenbug, on 03 October 2014 - 11:04 PM, said:

...and the guy criticizing grammar needs to pound sand.

May I ask as to why you believe grammar is unimportant in a forum, a text medium where some 80% or our communication is removed leaving us only text to express ourselves with? So instead of expressing oneself clearly...

we shud al juss mash dem kees n soom dem der peoples knowd whatd we were has been talkin bouts ya no

[operatorZ]

Mercules, on 03 October 2014 - 11:03 PM, said:

Um.... You are incorrect. Lights are in fact able to 1v1 heavy mechs in TT. There is this thing called maneuverability that lets the light mech get to the Heavy Mech's back, to a side, or to a range where the Heavy isn't bringing all his weapons to bear. The Light runs and builds up a +2 to hit the Heavy but moves fast enough or with the ability to get to cover so the Heavy is always +3 to hit him if not worse. I have taken 70 tonners out with those silly Locusts in TT


Shall we give a breakdown of common Light Roles from the Lore?

Commando - Guerilla/Striker
Locust - Guerilla/Infantry hunter/Scout
Jenner - Striker
Firestarter - Infantry hunter/Support/Striker (Fires and smoke can be a beautiful thing to cover your brawler style mechs as they advance on a longer ranged lance.
Raven - Scout(at least the 3L the 4X was designed for fighting
Spider - Scout


Buffs? Unneeded. Ways to earn cash/XP that are not shared by bigger classes or "shoot things" which they can simply do better by grounds of being able to carry more guns would be nice.

Just because you killed a heavy in a light does not mean this is the normal expected outcome of these encounters, but nice try. Exception does not prove rule.

None of those mentioned roles mean brawling with mediums or heavies. I know the lore and have for 22 years.

I agree 100% with your last point. How about instead of giving lights a broken game mechanic to somehow brawl with heavier mechs. ....Design game modes that actually allow and pay them for there "role" as scouts...PGI probably won't do this but they should....and to my point what in the OP addresses this valid point? All I see in this thread is whine about 1% lights in que...good light pilots should embrace this

I find it very ironic that the people claim to be such good light pilots...but still find time to comment how UP their mechs are. " look at me I'm so awesome in this piece of trash mech.....but could we get some buffs?" seriously do you guys even hear how you come off...

Edited by operatorZ, 03 October 2014 - 11:31 PM.

[Mercules]

operatorZ, on 03 October 2014 - 11:26 PM, said:

Just because you killed a heavy in a light does not mean this is the normal expected outcome of these encounters, but nice try. Exception does not prove rule.

None of those mentioned roles mean brawling with mediums or heavies. I know the lore and have for 22 years.

I agree 100% with your last point. How about instead of giving lights a broken game mechanic to somehow brawl with heavier mechs. ....Design game modes that actually allow and pay them for there "role" as scouts...PGI probably won't do this but they should....and to my point what in the OP addresses this valid point? All I see in this thread is whine about 1% lights in que...good light pilots should embrace this

I find it very ironic that the people claim to be such good light pilots...but still find time to comment how UP their mechs are. " look at me I'm so awesome in this piece of trash mech.....but could we get some buffs?" seriously do you guys even hear how you come off...

22 Years huh... You are short about 3 years from my experience with Battletech. Light mechs are not Scouts in Battletech. At first Battletech didn't have rules that required scouts. You set up the board and placed models/tokens on it and everyone saw where everything was. While the lore might have called a couple mechs Scouts you didn't actually use them that way.


Years later the double blind rules developed. Then you had a perfect opportunity to Scout. Lots of mechs became very adept at it but not all of them were lights. Griffons became excellent mechs for discovering enemies as you could move fairly quickly and hop to high terrain that would let you overlook wide areas of the map. You then had Long Range weaponry to allow you to start the initial engagement while you maneuvered your other forces. It had just enough armor to not die right away. Lights on the other hand usually had to spot the enemy and fade. They were typically outranged and too fragile to stick and shoot.

The Charger is an 80 ton SCOUT MECH.

Light does not = Scout.

Quote

Famous light scout 'Mechs include the Locust, Stinger, and Wasp, while the Commando, Jenner, and Panther are powerful combat units for their size.

Wipe that from your head. There are more scouts among the light classification simply because many of them move fairly fast and so can recon quickly, but there are medium recon mechs and I pointed out an Assault designed that way initially. Some Scouts are Lights but not all Lights are Scouts.

Light did and do indeed tangle with Mediums, Heavies, and even Assaults in Battletech. Typically they are in a supporting role where they flank the larger mechs while a heavier force meets them head on. Oddly enough this is the way they work best in MWO. Imagine that.

[Kilo 40]

I bought the KitFox package at the last minute on a whim.

I've tried IS lights in the past and usually get frustrated with them or bored with them. I would either die super fast, Or have to resort to sniping(Like SideStrafe in his Raven 3l) and end up being bored to tears.

but that kifox...just a blast to play.

Too bad the Mist Lynz looks to be crap

[Funkadelic Mayhem]

Just to catch people up on the OP....



keep making all the excuses in the MWO world... but lights need help. If you dont think so your a med/heavy/assault that in truth cant play that well and probably got a trophy just for showing up to what ever sport your parents forced you to play while the rest of us learned you dont get rewards just because your bigger and showed up!

[Mercules]

Funkadelic Mayhem, on 03 October 2014 - 11:49 PM, said:

Just to catch people up on the OP....



keep making all the excuses in the MWO world... but lights need help. If you dont think so your a med/heavy/assault that in truth cant play that well and probably got a trophy just for showing up to what ever sport your parents forced you to play while the rest of us learned you dont get rewards just because your bigger and showed up!

This is a very cool form of fallacy called Circumstantial Ad Hominem.

Quote

A Circumstantial ad Hominem is a fallacy in which one attempts to attack a claim by asserting that the person making the claim is making it simply out of self interest.

Person A makes claim X.
Person B asserts that A makes claim X because it is in A's interest to claim X.
Therefore claim X is false.

A Circumstantial ad Hominem is a fallacy because a person's interests and circumstances have no bearing on the truth or falsity of the claim being made. While a person's interests will provide them with motives to support certain claims, the claims stand or fall on their own. It is also the case that a person's circumstances (religion, political affiliation, etc.) do not affect the truth or falsity of the claim. This is made quite clear by the following example: "Bill claims that 1+1=2. But he is a Republican, so his claim is false."

There are times when it is prudent to suspicious of a person's claims, such as when it is evident that the claims are being biased by the person's interests. For example, if a tobacco company representative claims that tobacco does not cause cancer, it would be prudent to not simply accept the claim. This is because the person has a motivation to make the claim, whether it is true or not. However, the mere fact that the person has a motivation to make the claim does not make it false. For example, suppose a parent tells her son that sticking a fork in a light socket would be dangerous. Simply because she has a motivation to say this obviously does not make her claim false.

[Kilo 40]

Funkadelic Mayhem, on 03 October 2014 - 11:49 PM, said:

Just to catch people up on the OP....



keep making all the excuses in the MWO world... but lights need help. If you dont think so your a med/heavy/assault that in truth cant play that well and probably got a trophy just for showing up to what ever sport your parents forced you to play while the rest of us learned you dont get rewards just because your bigger and showed up!

That cherry picked screen shot doesn't mean a thing.

Edited by Kilo 40, 04 October 2014 - 12:03 AM.

[Funkadelic Mayhem]

Kilo 40, on 04 October 2014 - 12:00 AM, said:

That cherry picked screen shot doesn't mean a thing.

LOL yes it does!! It means everything to lights.... Walk out of your fog and join the MWO that wants to survive past the next 5 years, unless you want to wait another 10 years for another mech game.

Mercules, on 03 October 2014 - 11:54 PM, said:

This is a very cool form of fallacy called Circumstantial Ad Hominem.

de·ni·al
dəˈnīəl/
noun
noun: denial

• the action of declaring something to be untrue.

"she shook her head in denial"

synonyms:
contradiction, refutation, rebuttal, repudiation, disclaimer; More
negation, dissent
"the reports met with a denial"

• the refusal of something requested or desired.

575]"the denial of insurance to people with certain medical conditions"

synonyms:
refusal, withholding; More
rejection, rebuff, repulse, veto, turndown;
formaldeclination
"the denial of insurance to certain people"

• a statement that something is not true.

575]plural noun: denials

575]"official denials"

Edited by Funkadelic Mayhem, 04 October 2014 - 12:13 AM.

[Nothing Whatsoever]

Too bad I've got a bunch of Lights already mastered.

Otherwise, I'd be trying to mastering them!

[Funkadelic Mayhem]

Praetor Knight, on 04 October 2014 - 12:15 AM, said:

Too bad I've got a bunch of Lights already mastered.

Otherwise, I'd be trying to mastering them!

Iv got just about all the light mastered.... whats your point?

[Kilo 40]

Funkadelic Mayhem, on 04 October 2014 - 12:09 AM, said:

LOL yes it does!! It means everything to lights.... Walk out of your fog and join the MWO that wants to survive past the next 5 years, unless you want to wait another 10 years for another mech game.

LOL no it doesn't!!

all it means is at the one single point in time, 1% of the mechs in the queue were lights.

literally seconds later it could have been over 25%.

[Nothing Whatsoever]

Funkadelic Mayhem, on 04 October 2014 - 12:16 AM, said:

Iv got just about all the light mastered.... whats your point?

zachly! I suppose!

---

We need MOAR!!! And I mean MOAR Lights!!!

Fleas, actual Urban Mechs, Firemoths, Mist Lynxes (on the Horizon) so on and so forth.

[Funkadelic Mayhem]

Kilo 40, on 04 October 2014 - 12:20 AM, said:

LOL no it doesn't!!

all it means is at the one single point in time, 1% of the mechs in the queue were lights.

literally seconds later it could have been over 25%.

and at any time lights are the lowest % in the queue. So yes.... Lights need help, dont be scared.. It will be OK if lights get some much needed help. Stop trying in vain to stop it because you cant aim.

[Kilo 40]

Funkadelic Mayhem, on 04 October 2014 - 12:23 AM, said:

and at any time lights are the lowest % in the queue.

many times they are. yes. I don't think anyone disputed that.

But your attempt to imply that they are regularly at 1% of the queue is just dishonest.

Quote

dont be scared.. It will be OK if lights get some much needed help. Stop trying in vain to stop it because you cant aim.

what's up with the crappy sarcastic attitude? Why would you think that pointing out your cherry picked screen cap means that i can't aim or I'm against lights getting a buff?

ESPECIALLY after I just got through posting about how much I love the kitfox?

[Funkadelic Mayhem]

people play whats best.... assaults/med/ heavies are NEVER EVER EVER NEVER EVER 1% of the queues... keep trying to justify your QQ for the buffs to everything but lights that in hindsight nurfed the lights.
Probably because you got a chip on your shoulder because a light killed you once.
cant talk yourself out of or around only lights go down to 1%. "(pix or st*u!)" as they say.

Edited by Funkadelic Mayhem, 04 October 2014 - 12:46 AM.

[Kilo 40]

Funkadelic Mayhem, on 04 October 2014 - 12:44 AM, said:

people play whats best.... assaults/med/ heavies are NEVER EVER EVER NEVER EVER 1% of the queues... keep trying to justify your QQ for the buffs to everything but lights that in hindsight nurfed the lights.
Probably because you got a chip on your shoulder because a light killed you once.
cant talk yourself out of or around only lights go down to 1%. "(pix or st*u!)" as they say.

why are you lashing out like this? where exactly did I "QQ for the buffs to everything but lights"? where did I say that I'm angry about lights? do you always lash out like this when someone points out that you're wrong about something?