43 replies to this topic

[Victor Morson]

Saxie, on 05 October 2014 - 02:25 PM, said:

How about we wait for PGI to sort out post IGP before we start nailing them for not joining steam. I'm pretty sure it was IGP that wouldn't want to push the game to steam. Right now - Its PGI. If I buy a pack for 240 bucks I want PGI to get 240 not 160. Also seeing how volatile the steam community can be I don't truly see a real reason...

Someone should listen to the last couple AMAs.

This is directly addressed, free of IGP, by Russ as "not wanting to give them 33%" and how they "shouldn't have to." He also confirmed that pricing was heavily PGI's decision, and while decals/paint might be looked at, not much is being looked at elsewhere - except going to a Mech Pack only system.

So I stand by everything I just said. Even if 33% is set in stone for them, if it increases the paying player base over 33%, then it's worth doing. If it increases it WELL over 33% (since MW would have advertising then) then it's really worth doing.

I do hope PGI reconsiders next year. I do agree now is not the time to put it on Steam. It needs the major underlying issues and features finished first.

Edited by Victor Morson, 05 October 2014 - 02:31 PM.

[Kassatsu]

Saxie, on 05 October 2014 - 02:25 PM, said:

How about we wait for PGI to sort out post IGP before we start nailing them for not joining steam. I'm pretty sure it was IGP that wouldn't want to push the game to steam. Right now - Its PGI. If I buy a pack for 240 bucks I want PGI to get 240 not 160. Also seeing how volatile the steam community can be I don't truly see a real reason...

You could always just, you know, ignore the steam community page and not play it through steam.

Sure, a few would eventually manage to find their way to the official forums (the "go to website" link on the store page is quite elusive apparently), but would that actually be any worse than what we have now?



On the other hand, if their pricing model continues, I can't wait to see the reaction to gold mechs on the steam store page.

Edited by Kassatsu, 05 October 2014 - 02:33 PM.

[Deathlike]

It's simple...

If the game still is what it is today... unpolished, unfinished (in CW development, let alone UI 2.0), and unremarkable, then it's going to end up back where it started.

You can bump up the playerbase #s temporarily... but you can't keep those player #s stable and permanent if you don't have a compelling game for everyone to WANT to play.

Edited by Deathlike, 05 October 2014 - 02:32 PM.

[Victor Morson]

Deathlike, on 05 October 2014 - 02:32 PM, said:

It's simple...

If the game still is what it is today... unpolished, unfinished (in CW development, let alone UI 2.0), and unremarkable, then it's going to end up back where it started.

You can bump up the playerbase #s temporarily... but you can't keep those player #s stable and permanent if you don't have a compelling game for everyone to WANT to play.

Precisely why I think their strategy should actually be "Fix the problems, fix CW, and then do anything it takes to get this on Steam." It might be either that, or bleed out a slow death.

I like the Steam option myself.

[AEgg]

For whoever mentioned advertising, PGI actually did quite a lot of advertising back when the game was in early beta, particularly right when we went to open beta. Not so much anymore, though.

Also, getting this game to work on steam would be a lot of work, particularly for it to be a truly integrated title with steam friends and groups replacing MWO's clunky interfaces. It would be great if it worked, but that would mean redoing pretty much all of the (extremely limited) community features MWO already has.

[Kassatsu]

AEgg, on 05 October 2014 - 02:34 PM, said:

For whoever mentioned advertising, PGI actually did quite a lot of advertising back when the game was in early beta, particularly right when we went to open beta. Not so much anymore, though.

Also, getting this game to work on steam would be a lot of work, particularly for it to be a truly integrated title with steam friends and groups replacing MWO's clunky interfaces. It would be great if it worked, but that would mean redoing pretty much all of the (extremely limited) community features MWO already has.

And how many other games (particularly the F2P ones) actually bother going through the effort for proper steam community integration rather than simply being "on steam"?

Edited by Kassatsu, 05 October 2014 - 02:38 PM.

[Victor Morson]

I saw probably ten times as many ads for the now defunct MW: Tactics than MW:O for some reason.

Kassatsu, on 05 October 2014 - 02:38 PM, said:

And how many other games (particularly the F2P ones) actually bother going through the effort for proper steam community integration rather than simply being "on steam"?

A handful, but yep. A lot of them literally fire up their own launcher straight out of Steam.

[drinniol]

And how would being one amongst the hundreds of new games released each month equate into thousands of new players? The time that Steam guaranteed riches is well past.

[AEgg]

drinniol, on 05 October 2014 - 02:43 PM, said:

And how would being one amongst the hundreds of new games released each month equate into thousands of new players? The time that Steam guaranteed riches is well past.

True. But at the very least it would help to tie in existing steam communities. (i.e. people that already play together see someone they know playing MW:O and think about playing it themselves). Steam's colossal userbase is not a small incentive.

Also, anything that gets front-page on the steam store sells loads of copies. It likely costs a fortune to place ads there, though.

[drinniol]

AEgg, on 05 October 2014 - 03:00 PM, said:

True. But at the very least it would help to tie in existing steam communities. (i.e. people that already play together see someone they know playing MW:O and think about playing it themselves). Steam's colossal userbase is not a small incentive.

Also, anything that gets front-page on the steam store sells loads of copies. It likely costs a fortune to place ads there, though.

It still doesn't guarantee a F2P game anything, though, that other advertising wouldn't do - and other advertising doesn't take an open-ended cut of the revenue stream.

[Kassatsu]

drinniol, on 05 October 2014 - 03:08 PM, said:

It still doesn't guarantee a F2P game anything, though, that other advertising wouldn't do - and other advertising doesn't take an open-ended cut of the revenue stream.

I used to go out of my way to find every F2P I possibly could in the hopes that one wouldn't be a blatant P2W cash grab... Was disappointed many times by their amazing descriptions.

Probably less than 5% of what I found (and I've likely tried well over a hundred titles over the years) was due to an advertisement. Steam store front page as a new release? Kind of hard to miss.

[Alienized]

you dont want this game on steam.
everytime EVE was on steam sale it got flooded by players that just moaned that its too hard or it takes too long to achieve something or that you have to actaully read that well done tutorial... you even had to tell them to look at the damn monitor and find that undock button
which was a fat button on the right side of the screen. central position.
so definetly a no to steam.

[Gremlich Johns]

How many Free to Play games are listed on Steam?

[InvisibleTank]

I agree that, before releasing on steam, mwo needs to be well polished, including performance and graphical optimizations, GOOD user tutorials that anyone can understand that explain all of the game's components and idiosyncrasies, more game modes and play options (think small maps with 4v4, options for 8v8, longer battles with respawns via tickets or tonnage, a 1v1 arena, single class matches), lower prices that aren't going to scare non-hardcore mechwarrior fans away, the list goes on...

And once that's done, they need to advertise the HELL out of it. I'm a pretty decent fan of MW, and only discovered the game even existed this last March by a random. Then I started playing and the game initially seemed a bit sterile, and extremely difficult to not die in the first 2 minutes. I only stuck with it because I really enjoy MW. Anyone else would have left after the first day or two...

[Kassatsu]

Gremlich Johns, on 05 October 2014 - 03:20 PM, said:

How many Free to Play games are listed on Steam?

A lot. Better start counting.

Even with the sheer number of games, new releases always get a big wave of new players. There's bound to be that one guy out there that loved Mechwarrior (number here) and doesn't know about MWO... And then that other guy that will actually enjoy MWO after trying it.

The game needs a LOT of polish before anyone seriously considers trying to get it on steam and should never have "launched" in the state it was in (thanks IGP, at least, I assume it was them).

[Victor Morson]

drinniol, on 05 October 2014 - 02:43 PM, said:

And how would being one amongst the hundreds of new games released each month equate into thousands of new players? The time that Steam guaranteed riches is well past.

Except it's not, because it still brings huge influxes in, in particular if it's not a "me-too" game. Releasing an indie "creepy shadow side scroller" might not be advisable now, but the number of "big robot games" are minimal.

Plus all the people who remember MW and would see it there and check it out.

Steam is like Android apps: If you can get it on the top of the list for a few days a ton of people will download it since it's just two buttons.

[Rebas Kradd]

Steam. You will never find a more wretched hive of instant-gratification scum and lazy noobery.

MWO is a niche title for a reason - its basic nature, heavy customization, multiple nuances, and significant learning curve drive away the "just let me play nao" FPS kiddies - the very kind that choke up Steam with their prepubescent angst. Okay, I exaggerate a bit. But the general trend is there - Steam caters to simpler games.

So whether PGI would profit by introducing the game to Steam, much less a game that's not feature-complete or polished, is a real debate.

[Victor Morson]

Rebas Kradd, on 05 October 2014 - 04:04 PM, said:

So whether PGI would profit by introducing the game to Steam, much less a game that's not feature-complete or polished, is a real debate.

This part, I agree with. This game should not be on Steam as it is right now.

I'm talking post-CW re-launch, after major changes are made to the biggest problems. Only then. If this game went on Steam right now like it is, it'd kill it utterly because it would make the Transverse PR disaster look minimal.

Next year, I think they should re-evaluate.

[Farix]

Victor Morson, on 05 October 2014 - 02:19 PM, said:

Putting MW:O on Steam insures that you will get a massive influx in players. Given the current playerbase, that could easily be ten times the number of players currently in the game, or more.

Where is the evidence that there will be a massive influx? What other F2P with a Metacritc score of less than 70 gained hundreds of thousands of new players by being on Steam? Here are some examples against

Dragon's Prophet (Metacritc: 63, 82 24-hour peak): http://steamcharts.com/app/229100
Hawken (Metacritc: 73, 697 24-hour peak): http://steamcharts.com/app/271290
Age Of Wushu: (Metacritc: 74, 35 24-hour peak): http://steamcharts.com/app/265650

These numbers are from players who play the game through Steam and those are NOT confidence inspiring numbers. They are definitely not worth all the trouble of getting on Steam.

Edited by Farix, 05 October 2014 - 04:58 PM.

[Blakkstar]

Pay Gabe Newell to keep not releasing Half Life 3 so we can deal with an influx of clueless n00bs? No thanks.

Steam is not a guaranteed panacea...especially for F2P games. What PGI needs to do right now is get this game out of beta and keep building goodwill with the community (which I believe they are), to keep players in and grow the game slowly. There may be a good time for a Steam launch, but this is not it. Honestly, it may never make sense, and that's fine.