37 replies to this topic

[Iskareot]

I really want to know what Dev or person thought this up and thought it was a good idea????

Why?

What good does it do for a team?

Who benefits from it and how does it affect the team as a whole?


**So far this weekend I have seen (new) people in some drops that they just freaking ran in circles... had no clue and I mean noooooooo clue and made things worse for the team.

WHY IN THE **** can we not get a MM /ELO system that groups us with at LEAST someone in the same rough narrow ELO/Time in game MM somehow?

Who ever thought putting the good player with the bad player to balance it out should talk to the NFL, NHL, MLB, NBA, OGL gaming league and the horse racing industry... to see what they think of that lol.

[FupDup]

When the Steering Wheel Underhive collides with Mount Tryhard, bad things tend to happen and the result tends to be ggclose.

[Foxwalker]

You can rant, or you can try to help them. Sometimes I have found just saying follow the group and shoot at what everyone else shoots at can get good results. We have taken new players into TS and with only a little coaching they can do OK. It is just possible that mentoring new players instead of dumping them into a new player mosh pit can give them a better new player experience. Help the game succeed and make the new players feel welcome rather than ranting at them....

[Dino Might]

I don't see this happen as often - maybe it means I'm one of those bad players - but when it does, I'm more concerned about the new person's experience. For the game to continue, it needs to get more people playing. If someone starts playing now, with the well established power creep that practically requires a fully mastered mech with modules and all the goodies to make a significant difference in the fight, he's probably going to have a bad time.



How does the new player feel when dropped into a pool of mastered and completely customized mechs when he is in his first hunchback just after the 25 game bonuses end? He has no 2x efficiences, modules, and probably not even a preferred weapon set yet, and because he is inexperienced and doesn't have the c-bills available for all the weapons he wants to try. Result? He gets stomped repeatedly. This cannot be fun for him, and I'm pretty sure it drives off tons of new players. If I'm on his team, sure I might lose because we have a slight firepower disadvantage, but I can still play my game and have fun trying to shoot the other stompy robots, because I can make decisions and see and understand the impact of those decisions. The new guy is still trying to learn and will not know why or how he died, especially when a gauss/ppc dire wolf one shot alphas him in the back. There isn't much to keep the new player around except telling him, "don't worry, in a couple of months, you might get enough stuff and enough experience to kill one or two guys a match." It is already hard enough for a new player to fight an experienced player, why make it worse with the significant equipment bonuses for the experienced guy?



My solution - knock down the efficiency bonuses, and don't have the 2x multiplier at all. Nerf the cooldown modules, too - they are actually quite influential as they are now. These modules and upgrades should have some effect, but only a little, so that the experience player has just a tiny edge in the arms race. The experienced player already has the major skill advantage. This won't fix the problem of new guys getting dropped with highly experienced players and getting stomped, but it will cut down the equipment disadvantage the new players face, which right now, is considerable. When it comes down to "you died because he outplayed you, but if you had done X, Y, and Z better, you'd have gotten him," that is much more palatable than "you were in a hunchback with single heat sinks and he was in a fully kitted Shadowhawk - there was nothing you were going to do to kill him."

[El Bandito]

As long as those newbs know what a Direwolf is, they can be of use.

[Chagatay]

FupDup, on 19 October 2014 - 06:41 PM, said:

When the Steering Wheel Underhive collides with Mount Tryhard, bad things tend to happen and the result tends to be ggclose.

You know after awhile of listening to all of this forum rhetoric, I am damn near tempted to buy a steering wheel and drive a locust just because I can.

[Vassago Rain]

Chagatay, on 19 October 2014 - 07:23 PM, said:

You know after awhile of listening to all of this forum rhetoric, I am damn near tempted to buy a steering wheel and drive a locust just because I can.

There have been actual steering wheel challenges. Usually, the goal is to not finish last.

[DaZur]

Here's the reality and I'm positive most won't agree... but those who think it through will understand.

If PGI were to separate new and experienced players into separate queues two things would happen:

A.) If / when new-players, regardless if by their own volition or through forced graduation were moved from the shallow guppy pool into the big pool with the sharks they would ultimately be eaten alive... far worse then it is now.

B.) Knowing "A", they would forever choose to stay in the guppy pool.

Absolutely, the mixing of new and veteran players can and does occasionally result in massacres... That said, to a larger degree new players benefit from working in concert with veteran players.

It's the same way in the military... Green soldiers are routinely mixed with veterans for the very purpose of providing real-world experience through working closely with the veteran soldiers.

Difference is... In the real world it's expected that the veterans should protect and guard green soldiers from doing ignorant stuff, and provide a rich environment for learning. While in MW:O veterans dispise new players and use them like sacrificial meat-shields.

Edited by DaZur, 19 October 2014 - 09:59 PM.

[siLve00]

as i did start playing during beta.. i got slaughtered... that wasn´t realy frustrating.. but to to play 4:4 vs 8 were realy sucky.
I did learn how to play.. i didn´t care.. did my damage made my kills... got flamed by vets.. did flame as vet.

Elo suxx... grp vs grp / weight vs weight is the only real matchmaking ( atleast for me ).
Learn the hard way or.. simple.. die and move on.

If you want to play vs skilled players... arrange wars.. team battles w/e is out there ( idk i didn´t play for 1 year bc of the Elo bs ).
That´s the only real deal.

3-4 years of WoT @ the unicorn side of the game.. will let you think different when you have to deal with newbs in your team or as enemy.

[InspectorG]

Chagatay, on 19 October 2014 - 07:23 PM, said:

You know after awhile of listening to all of this forum rhetoric, I am damn near tempted to buy a steering wheel and drive a locust just because I can.

I think that unlocks an achievement...

[RalphVargr]

DaZur, on 19 October 2014 - 07:40 PM, said:

Difference is... In the real world it's expected the veterans largely protect and guard green soldiers from doing stupid stuff, and provide a rich environment for learning. While in MW:O veterans dispise new players and use them like sacrificial meat-shields.

This ex-sergeant approves of your post.

[Scratx]

I am still convinced the biggest disservice to newbies is the default third person view setting.

[Lynx7725]

El Bandito, on 19 October 2014 - 07:05 PM, said:

As long as those newbs know what a Direwolf is, they can be of use.

Eh nope. Ran into one who didn't go with the team and couldn't hit anything worthwhile. Even if he had just moved up with the team, he'd been more useful as a distraction and armour soak.

And another two who refused to move from spawn in a Caustic game. We won that one, but was also treated to a couple of beautiful looking headshots on two friendly Dire Wolves.

Oh and I ran into you earlier. Alpine. Think I gave you some run for your money, but when 3 Dire Wolves crapped on an Atlas and a Orion (the other teammates ran after some squirrels...), well not much can be said.

[Greenjulius]

Scratx, on 19 October 2014 - 07:55 PM, said:

I am still convinced the biggest disservice to newbies is the default third person view setting.

3PV just needs to go away. It teaches players how to play the game wrong.

[siLve00]

Lynx7725, on 19 October 2014 - 07:58 PM, said:

Eh nope. Ran into one who didn't go with the team and couldn't hit anything worthwhile. Even if he had just moved up with the team, he'd been more useful as a distraction and armour soak.

And another two who refused to move from spawn in a Caustic game. We won that one, but was also treated to a couple of beautiful looking headshots on two friendly Dire Wolves.

Oh and I ran into you earlier. Alpine. Think I gave you some run for your money, but when 3 Dire Wolves crapped on an Atlas and a Orion (the other teammates ran after some squirrels...), well not much can be said.

so thats a problem of the cashshop and the "free" mechs ( if there is still such a thing like back in the days ).
Don´t correct me if iam wrong.. i know iam right lol

2 Years ago i did say somewhere in the forum.. make dem newbs play 50-100 matches before they can buy mechs.

[Lynx7725]

siLve00, on 19 October 2014 - 08:05 PM, said:

2 Years ago i did say somewhere in the forum.. make dem newbs play 50-100 matches before they can buy mechs.

Can't really do that if you want to stay solvent as a business. Us old farts just have to carry harder.

[Mystere]

Chagatay, on 19 October 2014 - 07:23 PM, said:

You know after awhile of listening to all of this forum rhetoric, I am damn near tempted to buy a steering wheel and drive a locust just because I can.

I have one for you to try:



Please tell me how it goes.

Edited by Mystere, 19 October 2014 - 08:18 PM.

[Lynx7725]

Mystere, on 19 October 2014 - 08:17 PM, said:

Actually looks quite doable. Enough buttons to hold most of the current important controls, and you probably can control direction with the foot pedals, with one reserved for jump jets.. hmm might be worthwhile...

[Chagatay]

^ That looks way too high tech....I am looking for a more traditional wheel setup. The pedals are a nice thought maybe a stickshifter as well would make it a one-of-a-kind experience. BJ-series would probably be the best cockpit to go with that setup.

[El Bandito]

FupDup, on 19 October 2014 - 07:09 PM, said:

I saw the saddest new player ever earlier today. He was in a trial stock Dire Whale in third person mode. He was so terrible at the game that he literally couldn't track his lasers over a 4 LPL Highlander, not even for just a split second. He also shot at a lot of the players on his own team (my team), and surprisingly nobody teamkilled him (but I so wanted to and I'm sure several others did, such as an Atlas that he unloaded on). He was literally the embodiment of the Steering Wheel Underhive.

Or perhaps he was even so bad that even a steering wheel would be an upgrade. Maybe he was playing on a touchscreen?

Lynx7725, on 19 October 2014 - 07:58 PM, said:

Eh nope. Ran into one who didn't go with the team and couldn't hit anything worthwhile. Even if he had just moved up with the team, he'd been more useful as a distraction and armour soak.

And another two who refused to move from spawn in a Caustic game. We won that one, but was also treated to a couple of beautiful looking headshots on two friendly Dire Wolves.

Oh and I ran into you earlier. Alpine. Think I gave you some run for your money, but when 3 Dire Wolves crapped on an Atlas and a Orion (the other teammates ran after some squirrels...), well not much can be said.

Guess I didn't make myself clear. I want the newbs to know which mech is the Direwolf so when I say "Focus the Direwolf!" they will know what to shoot at.

Edited by El Bandito, 19 October 2014 - 08:56 PM.