179 replies to this topic

[Volks Ward]

Darth Futuza, on 22 October 2014 - 02:27 PM, said:

Why change everything when you can just fix what's broken?

True but the fix broke it even more.

[Caustic Canid]

Darth Futuza, on 22 October 2014 - 02:27 PM, said:

Why change everything when you can just fix what's broken?

Are you saying that canon stock builds like the timberwolf d are broken?

I understand that pgi is trying to balance the game so that I.s. Pilots feel like they have a chance, but they are doing it by meddling with a very popular mech, that by default people payed money for.

I would rather they just buff I.S. mechs so they can compete.

[Pericles]

Caustic Canid, on 22 October 2014 - 02:10 PM, said:

Why does PGI have to nerf anything in the first place? Why couldn't they make everything else better so that no one had to lose anything?

Oh right, cause that would be more work, and this is PGI we're talking about.

Hate to sound like an ass but welcome to online gaming, there will always be constant nerfs and buffs. It's the nature of the beast.

[Kibble]

What part of the following do people not understand?

http://mwomercs.com/terms

PGI can do what they want with anything they want with or without your consent. The items you buy are not yours, they are PGIs. You are paying to rent them.

It is what it is. Adapt and deal with it.

Edited by Kibble, 22 October 2014 - 03:00 PM.

[Kael Posavatz]

Okay, said this before, here it is again post-patch.

I would not mind if the jump jets went to a hardpoint-based system that only allowed them to be put in the proper component.

Going to this new fixed JJ has give the Timberwolf S center torso many of the same problems as the Summoner/Nova. Those that would use that mech because it did NOT have a weapon hardpoint are now deprived of a mech.

Timberwolfs using S side torsos are now deprived of two tons and two critical slots in what is already an often-cramped location even if the spare mass can be made available.

The Kit Fox is STILL the only Clan ECM unit available. These changes are a kick in the knee to many of the torso-centric ballistic/energy side torso.

And...yes, it makes the IS more customizable in that they can pick the exact number of JJs AND where they put them.

And...as it cripples may Clan builds this could be construed as a Nerf...

The problem with that last point is that PGI has been doing so well this year (2014) at announcing why they were nerfing mechs and this was not classified as a nerf so...

Hardpoint system for JJ, yes. What we got, no.

[Lightfoot]

Removing fixed jump jets from all the fixed jump-jet mechs would not break the game and would fix a lot of what players perceive is wrong with these mechs which are crippled by forcing 5 tons of fixed jump-jets in critical hard-point locations.

PGI's invention of a Closed Mechlab for Clan mechs but a completely Open Mechlab for Inner Sphere is only acceptable if the restriction is not used to unfairly gimp the Clan mechs which PGI is doing with the fixed jump-jets. It's just to much to stomach guys and it does not balance anything because it only affects just a very few mechs and will block any meaningful balancing that might be possible if the fixed jump-jets were not already gimping these mechs so severely.

[ImperialKnight]

MajorFlack, on 21 October 2014 - 06:19 PM, said:

+1

I PAID for what I could do when I purchased the timberwolfs., not for random mandatory configurations down the line or at the whim of a programmer.

+1 to the BS call...

I will remember that anything stated about mech specs is written in wet runny sand and has the strength of a willow in the wind.

This is like buying a car only to have a mandatory recall that changes your leather upholstery to vinyl because <insert reason here> and not refunding the money you paid for the leather.

Take a queue number and get in the line behind the rest of the guys who bought Heavy Metals, Dragonslayers and Jesters.


This was a good change to balance the Timberwolf. Deal with it.

P.S. Yes, I spent real money on Timbys too. And I'm dealing with it

Edited by knightsljx, 22 October 2014 - 07:53 PM.

[ImperialKnight]

Zelthar the mecha wizard, on 22 October 2014 - 08:07 PM, said:

I built my Twolf as a brawler with MGs in and SRM using the TBR-S omnipods in the LT and RT.
Granted I barely use the Twolf(always preferred the Mad Dog.) but, now the fixed JJs in these side torso omnipods have more or less made it so the only build I found fun and useful can't be used any more because valuable tons and slots are wasted on JJs I never wanted or needed with this build.

This change would've been fine if they were put in the legs like on the Kit Fox, Summoner and Nova.

How I'm dealing with it

[Zainadin]

Lightfoot, on 22 October 2014 - 12:38 PM, said:

The way they have nerfed ERPPCs and SSRMs and DHS 1.4, I am not sure the D would even work. MWO logic states that AC's are okay to boat and be OP, but everything else gets the nerf-bat.

There is a very BIG difference in how the AC work. IS ac/20 1 slug@20dmg 1 hit location. Clans AC/20 breaks the 1 slug into 5 slugs@4dmg and hope to hit 1 location.

[whitelightshadow]

Just a notes of caution here, where I live if somebody changes anything related to a sale after the sale has been completed and it is detremental to the buyer it is considered an illegal act and the company is then held liable for damages.

You can not after you sold a car with a V6 motor, replace the motor with a 4 cylinder and still consider the sale fair.

Edited by whitelightshadow, 22 October 2014 - 11:24 PM.

[Zainadin]

whitelightshadow, on 22 October 2014 - 11:23 PM, said:

Just a notes of caution here, where I live if somebody changes anything related to a sale after the sale has been completed and it is detremental to the buyer it is considered an illegal act and the company is then held liable for damages.

You can not sell a car with a V6 motor and then because other people complain about it walk in and replace the motor with a 4 cylinder.

As someone else pointed out we didn't buy anything, we are renting in a way.
for example;
I gave them $120 for the clan package and now I can use the mech's from release day to the last day of the game. The mechs are part of the game not a single product. I know that all I am doing is un-locking the mechs that are in 'THE' game.
Instead of using c-bills to unlock the mech a month after release, I paid real world money to have access to it earlier.
I wanted access ahead of time knowing that first month I'll be beta testing the mechs.
The programers can only guess at balance until the data comes back. Sometimes the data pool isn't big enough to see a trend. After more players start to use it, the more examples of a of a possible trend. They are also getting more info back from the players. (sorta un-related; some people first thought only homosexuals could get ****- Acquired Immune Deficiency Syndrome, because they were the only ones getting sick.)

Edited by Zainadin, 22 October 2014 - 11:57 PM.

[fyurian]

All those adapted players really like srm's or lurms, i despise them. (the missiles)
Dakka players like myself are well kinda left out (i like pinpoint dmg over random hit reg)
I used to run 2x uac5 and 6 er meds (not really OP imho) but that cant be done anymore.

Give me some omnipod torsos with no missiles & jumpjets in it and all will be fine and dandy (oh and 1 laser slot)
I never use jumpjets, they are not worth my time.
nerfs beeing done:
lasers heating up more (i dealt with it) (poor nova's)
losing torso = extra heat (granted this is something i can perfecly understand)
ppc speed nerf (i dealt with it)
fixxed jumpjets = no ******* way hosé. the 2 much nerf line has been crossed...

[whitelightshadow]

Zainadin, on 22 October 2014 - 11:41 PM, said:

As someone else pointed out we didn't buy anything, we are renting in a way.

for example;
I gave them $120 for the clan package and now I can use the mech's from release day to the last day of the game. The mechs are part of the game not a single product. I know that all I am doing is un-locking the mechs that are in 'THE' game.

Instead of using c-bills to unlock the mech a month after release, I paid real world money to have access to it earlier. I wanted access ahead of time knowing that first month I'll be beta testing the mechs.

The programers can only guess at balance until the data comes back.

In other words I pay for a Ferrari and after they get the data they convert my Ferrari into a tricycle. It does not matter if I buy or rent it, it still boils down to the same thing.

Wow what a silly explanation to simply say we pay to have over powered mech to butcher others who cant afford it. All this until the defs decide to nerf the mech so the next mechs can be sold so the cycle can start all over again. I have seen this over and over since beta..... Wow so warm and fuzzy I feel now.

And beta testing is testing done BEFORE release of a product not after.... Thus you are not testing it, we do all the testing on the test server...

Edited by whitelightshadow, 23 October 2014 - 12:12 AM.

[Jam the Bam]

Caustic Canid, on 22 October 2014 - 02:10 PM, said:

Why does PGI have to nerf anything in the first place? Why couldn't they make everything else better so that no one had to lose anything?

Oh right, cause that would be more work, and this is PGI we're talking about.

No, because the time to kill would drop massively if every mech was as versatile and powerful as the timberwolf. Considering most clan mechs are still more powerful than IS mechs, it is needed which is why the IS quirks are appearing, but the timberwolf was head and shoulders above most of the clan mechs, it needed some reigning in.

Edited by Jammerben87, 23 October 2014 - 01:09 AM.

[MountainCopper]

Connaugh, on 21 October 2014 - 10:37 PM, said:

The SMN didnt loose significant weapon space through those JJs. Neither does the NVA. The TBR looses 2 slots in weapon relevant areas, still having 5 slot available. Some hard hitting loadouts are gone, a lot of others still possible.

Yeees, just 5 tons of your free tonnage locked, in case of the SMN. Hardly worth mentioning over the fact that no critical slot space in the side torsos was lost...


The most broken TBR loadouts now have to be slightly lowered. That is all. For instance, a Gauss Rifle still fits in the TBR-Prime RT.

Connaugh, on 21 October 2014 - 10:37 PM, said:

And finally: The omnipod card shouldn't be played in this one. Because there might be people out there that like to play the variants with their options as they are and not with the options other pods offer.

As said, this card was played for consistency reasons. As for limiting the range of possible builds, there is still a huge range possible for the TBR.

[Prophet of Light]

I do not like the changes on the jumpjets, i do not need JJ on my Tiberwolf builds (need the free tonnage) and i hate the thing that all my builds are ****** with the new patch . Damn fixed jumpjets-slots

[Platinum Spider]

The real problem here isn't just that the JJs are fixed it's that they do no good. The JJs on heavy mechs don't provide enough lift and you just hover and scrape against a cliff instead of "jumping" onto it. Instead of fixing the JJs on the TBR and KFX they should have unlocked the JJs on the Nova and Summoner.

[Volks Ward]

Platinum Spider, on 23 October 2014 - 02:49 AM, said:

The real problem here isn't just that the JJs are fixed it's that they do no good. The JJs on heavy mechs don't provide enough lift and you just hover and scrape against a cliff instead of &quot;jumping&quot; onto it. Instead of fixing the JJs on the TBR and KFX they should have unlocked the JJs on the Nova and Summoner.

Love this idea. I might rebuy my nova and Summoner variants.

I feel it is a mute point since no one from PGI has commented on the thread as of yet. But if PGI were to make it so JJ were removable for clan mechs like they are for IS mechs they would easily squeeze some more cash out of me in a heartbeat. Have to repurchase those sold off variants.

Edited by Volks Ward, 23 October 2014 - 11:33 AM.

[FatManBlue]

Well sure is a lot of chit chat about this nerf. My timberwolf is now about 25% less damage effective then prior. I'm wondering, after a game I just played, when will they force jump jets on the direwolves?? One direwolf had 1700+ damage another 1500+ damage and a 3rd 900+ damage.....all in the same game, all other mechs ranged downward from 400+ damage.. Now doesn't that seem a bit strong? (the dire). How big a drop in damage would it suffer after losing 8 tons and 4 slots to jump jets? We are talking about balance right?

[Commander Darius]

It ruined my TBR-S. Had to take off all of my heatsinks and machine gun ammo to maintain a decent arsenal. I dont even use the jump jets. They are useless to me. I hope they take this back. I really do. That was my favorite loadout of a timberwolf that has now been nullified to uselessness.

On a brighter note. Everything else seems pretty good.

Here is a relatively easy fix. Make it so that CT has an omnipod so we can have some of our previous loadouts with another chassis omnipod but lose some of our quirks like xp bonus or arm movement etc. That would be relatively balanced right?

Edited by Commander Darius, 23 October 2014 - 11:28 AM.