76 replies to this topic

[Hoffenstein]

I hate how the quirks make my Mech's worse. All those negative traits are....wait, what? What do you mean they're all positive. Well in that case I DO like them!

[Khobai]

OP is wrong and should feel bad for wasting everyones time.

[HUNTERS MOON]

This is just another way to manipulate us. "We didn't nerf the clan mechs we buffed the IS mechs." SAME THING.

[Lukoi Banacek]

Lamhirh, on 04 November 2014 - 02:02 PM, said:

As I said quirks by themselves arent bad, the implementation is however flawed.It cold have been done better. And my personal opinion is that more general perks would give much more life to those frames than those we got. But I am fan of experimentiong, and giving meta build such siginificant boost is a crime in my book.

30% is alot. Its 30 dmg for every 100 you do. Its huge advantage, and not using it means you are weakening your own team.

You still can do it, noone prevents you, but it will cause people to react badly Having 30% more damage and not having 30% damage together gives 60% damage

30% quirks do not equate to 30% damage directly.

Secondly, it does not in anyway negate my previous comments...a thirty percent improvement to a ****** build or less than optimal weapon doesn't matter to min/maxers....they don't use them anyway. So, I welcome your opinion, but think it's incredibly flawed in it's understanding of the social dynamics of these kinds of games.

General perks would probably be better overall, I concur, but these quirks are not BAD for the game or threatening diversity in builds or in the use of previously under-utilized mechs, which is what your OP proclaims.

Quote

Freedom to make as good or as bad or as crazy setup as we wanted

You imply that somehow that's changed due to the quirks. That's pretty demonstrably false as I noted earlier.

[Impyrium]

If I may say so, I feel customization went too far in the ways of freedom in the first place, since it led to the problems where certain chassis can easily emulate another and do better. So the quirks will keep 'Mechs unique and actually worth taking over one another.

Edited by AUSwarrior24, 04 November 2014 - 02:35 PM.

[Dazzer]

I for one like the new system. My Hunchbacks like it too

after all my Hunchbacks already stat with a HUGE negative quirk that being I am the one driving it

[Doctor Proctor]

Lamhirh, on 04 November 2014 - 02:02 PM, said:

As I said quirks by themselves arent bad, the implementation is however flawed.It cold have been done better. And my personal opinion is that more general perks would give much more life to those frames than those we got. But I am fan of experimentiong, and giving meta build such siginificant boost is a crime in my book.

30% is alot. Its 30 dmg for every 100 you do. Its huge advantage, and not using it means you are weakening your own team.

You still can do it, noone prevents you, but it will cause people to react badly Having 30% more damage and not having 30% damage together gives 60% damage

What? I...huh? There are no 30% damage quirks and you know it. For some of these mechs it might be a 30% cooldown or heat reduction, but it could just as easily be a range increase. These CAN affect damage, but they are not a guaranteed percentage increase. Not to mention that, AGAIN, even if you're using a different weapon if it were in the same class as the buffed one it would be getting half of the bonus. So in 90% of cases it's not a "30% or nothing" choice, but a "30% or 15%".*

Lastly, the difference between having a 30% buff and not having a 30% buff is 30%. Where the hell are you getting 60% from? Get a math book or something...

*- There's also tons of mechs who have smaller 10/20% bonuses that don't affect things nearly as much, but can give you a reason to nudge a build a different way if you're looking to really fulfill a niche role or squeeze out every bit of performance that you can.

Edited by Doctor Proctor, 04 November 2014 - 02:56 PM.

[Praehotec8]

Well, the most competitive mechs were already good and did not get any buffs, so does that make them a liability to the team now also? (Let me provide the answer for you: no.) If your mech was good before, it will still be good. The only difference is that some of the "bad" mechs can be run in such a way as to make them less bad, and possibly even good. Just because those mechs may need to be configured a certain way to take full advantage of the buffs doesn't change the reality of the situation. At the end of the day, if your mech was good it will still be good, and if it was bad....well, now some of those have a chance to be good also. The "pros" are going to meta-game, and the rest of us will still have fun in whatever mechs we like.

[Neutron IX]

Dazzer, on 04 November 2014 - 02:40 PM, said:

I for one like the new system. My Hunchbacks like it too

after all my Hunchbacks already stat with a HUGE negative quirk that being I am the one driving it

This guy gets it!

[Lily from animove]

you have the same freedom as before, you just have now some things getting a bit of a buff instad of making the hole chassis useless as some were like before. Nothign wrong here.

[Lightfoot]

I went back to using the Protector recently, but you didn't buff it by giving it AC20 quirks or SRM6 quirks. The Orion is not a brawler, it's too easy to core in a few shots plus it has to compete with 2xAC20 Jagermechs. The Orion will always be best at mid to long range due to it's immense CT, immense left shoulder. The only way to get some survivability vs brawler specialized mechs is with range. Longer is better.

Some mechs are brawlers, some, like the Orion are not. MWO should treat them equally.

[Iqfish]

I'm a heavy MWO critic and the quirks are amazing, IMO.

I'm really interested in playing some matches with every single one of my mechs just to see how they perform.

And I couldn't even motivate myself to play one match a few weeks ago.

[TripleEhBeef]

I was a bit unsure about specialized quirks when I saw the roadmap, but it's actually worked out well for a lot of variant lines.

Take the Hunchback 4G and 4H. The most optimal builds on both were AC20 setups. The H was better though since it could carry two MLs instead of 2 MGs on the G.

But now, with the AC20 quirks for the G, and AC10 quirks for the H, there is some differentiation. The G is now the walking AC20 of Doom it was supposed to be. The H now trades that raw firepower for more range, ammo endurance, and versatility that the AC10 brings.

One is geared towards massive frontloaded damage, while the other one gets a bit of dakka thanks to the range and cooldown quirks. The 4H is now no longer outright better than the 4G. They are quite even with one being a close range destroyer and the other a medium range hitter.

[UrsusMorologus]

Doctor Proctor, on 04 November 2014 - 01:22 PM, said:

Everything about this post is wrong. Take something like the Grid Iron. I basically ran mine as a clone of the HBK-4G with a 3xML and AC/20 loadout, just with a 30% C-Bill bonus and a cool paint job. Now it got some quirks for UAC/5 and MPL, which made me think perhaps I should try out that build and see how it goes. If it goes poorly, I can always switch back to my 3xML and AC/20 and it will still perform just like it used (technically better, since half the quirk bonuses apply generically to all ballistics and energy weapons). Nothing is forcing me to switch builds.

Okay lets talk about Grid Iron. You cant slot 2 UAC5 unless you strip the arms and use them as dead meatshields, at which point you cant use enough MPLs for the buff to matter. You can run one UAC5, but christ it's not even worth taking the chassis if you are only going to put one UAC5 in that big deformed shoulder on a mech that goes 87kph and cant even JJ. And the interesting part of the mech that sets it apart from the 4G is the missile launcher, which doesnt even get a buff. So the weapon quirks are useless for a hunchback in practice. And the Grid Iron still sucks because the generic quirks that it gets are only lifting it from T5 to T3ish--its still a trash mech.

The other end of the scale you have Cicadas and a couple of other builds (like my ON1-V) that are perfectly matched to the quirks and are getting massive bonuses to performance.

Quirks are a solution to a weapon problem, not a solution to a mech problem. They fail to balance the mechs.

[Past]

I agree with OP i have builds i am now compelled to change that i don't want to but the feeling of missing out is too great so now i will be getting rid of my creations to conform to a template and i really hate that.

No longer will i go on to smurfy and think how will i plan my next 3 variants and tinker round for ages with various combinations it will just be a matter of putting on the relevant weapons and fitting whatever ammo and cooling is possible from there feels pretty damn hollow really.

[Kiiyor]

Lamhirh, on 04 November 2014 - 12:56 PM, said:

QUIRKS. GOOD IDEA DONE BAD.

Balderdash.

So the poorer performing mechs have had a performance boost. YAY. However, the same issues that made them a poor choice in the first place are still there! The Awesome still makes the DW look like a Russian ballerina, has garbage hitboxes, worse weapon placement, and is slow as hell. It's still the mech of a masochist, only now it can fire the weapon it was built around effectively!

There are no medium buffs that are the slightest bit overpowered, even the auto shotgun of the Cent or the mega Lurms of the Hunchie. Mediums are still delicate as hell, and can't boat anywhere near enough weapons to make their perks overpowered. BlackJacks are still delicate little flowers. They can carry some awesome Wub now, but DUBSTEP WON'T PROTECT THEM WHEN A METAWOLF TURNS THEM INTO A CANOE.

You can STILL carry all the loud outs that were effective prior to the patch! Most have even had half-buffs! Dual GAUSS is now 7.5% better in Yagers! Missiles are around 10% better in Stalkers! Lots of lights and mediums have had their laser durations cut, so they can deliver damage faster!

And lastly, give it some freaking time. Wait for the number crunchers to gravitate towards their new FOTM builds. Wait for the min-maxers to science a new meta. Wait for the whine threads about individual mechs. PGI have proven they are more than willing to listen, RESPOND, and tweak balance issues now.

Surely you can at least attempt to keep your benefit of the doubt hat on, even for 24 hours, before you start sharpening your pitchfork.

[Rando Slim]

Also I don't know if the OP noticed but in most cases the quirks are half generic and half weapon specific......so your old builds (or anything else you come up with) will still at least be slightly better, even if not min/maxed perfectly. This is the most interesting day in MWO since the clans dropped, I like it, mostly cause I own tons of previously really crappy chassis.

Edited by Scrotacus 42, 04 November 2014 - 05:52 PM.

[Jesus Man]

Did I miss something or are not allowed to customize your mech outside of the quirks given?

Wait, you still can do whatever you want to your mech? Oh... why are we complaining then?

Sure the new quirks give incentives to use certain weapons, doesn't mean you can't still go nuts doing whatever you want. Additionally half the quirks just apply broadly to one or more of the three weapon types.

[Chrithu]

627, on 04 November 2014 - 12:59 PM, said:

guys... quirks are a bonus. you don't have to take 'that' weapon that get quirks. And almost all quirks are split between on specific weapon and a weapon group. And you don't lose anything if you don't build your mech that way.

A firebrand with boom-equip will always be 40 pinpoint damage to the face, you don't need to use PPCs.

All those whinings for some bonus quirks...

Gotta agree here.

Quirks didn't make me change my Jester Setup (2 LPL + 4 MPL) or my Ilya Murromets setup (1 AC 20 + 1 AC 10 + 3 ML). As far as I judge the quirks they have been done good (except for the catapult K2 faux pas). Mechs that were competitive still are regardless of build and even a build that uses quirks to the max don't get an extreme buff. Unplayed mechs though now finally have at least a few options to create a competitive build on them.

[Cerlin]

Khobai, on 04 November 2014 - 02:19 PM, said:

OP is wrong and should feel bad for wasting everyones time.

I could not agree more. If you do not like the quirks do not use em.