23 replies to this topic

[Innocent]

Currently heatsinks submerged in water provide added cooling. Firing weapons at mech parts submerged in water cause reduced damage.

Why can a light mech, fully submerged, get to shoot anyone and cause damage?

Weapons below the water line should not be able to fire. It is especially annoying that an ecm light can sit in the water fully submerged, invisible to radar, and still able to fire on opponents.

Please fix this.

[Jonny Taco]

water should also slow down mechs. How much is obviously up for debate though.

Edited by lartfor, 08 November 2014 - 08:13 AM.

[pyrocomp]

With that geometry... To 40 km/h or stronger. The lights would be affected much stronger... And River Sity (day and night) will be a hell or will need a third bridge between citadel and boat region.

[TimePeriod]

lartfor, on 08 November 2014 - 08:08 AM, said:

waster should also slow down mechs. How much is obviously up for debate though.

It would be a linear speed reduction if we discount any water-currents, temperature and compositions, not to mention ebb and flow.

[pyrocomp]

TimePeriod, on 08 November 2014 - 08:14 AM, said:

It would be a linear speed reduction if we discount any water-currents, temperature and compositions, not to mention ebb and flow.

Mmm, hard to tell. Linear from what? From top speed at that throttle will be ok, until you are no deeper than your knees. After that there will be stronger effect, and with torso submerged... Well, it may come to 10-15 km/h difference.
And, the dependence on the engine for each chassis... I doubt it will be linear, turbulence tend to have quadratic effects, which will mean death to Lights anyway.

[TimePeriod]

pyrocomp, on 08 November 2014 - 08:30 AM, said:

Mmm, hard to tell. Linear from what? From top speed at that throttle will be ok, until you are no deeper than your knees. After that there will be stronger effect, and with torso submerged... Well, it may come to 10-15 km/h difference.
And, the dependence on the engine for each chassis... I doubt it will be linear, turbulence tend to have quadratic effects, which will mean death to Lights anyway.

All in all, you would be royally screwed if you stood in the water as a light.

[Durant Carlyle]

Innocent, on 08 November 2014 - 08:05 AM, said:

Currently heatsinks submerged in water provide added cooling. Firing weapons at mech parts submerged in water cause reduced damage.

Why can a light mech, fully submerged, get to shoot anyone and cause damage?

Weapons below the water line should not be able to fire. It is especially annoying that an ecm light can sit in the water fully submerged, invisible to radar, and still able to fire on opponents.

Please fix this.

The effects we have are enough. We don't want to get TOO realistic here.

[Peter2k]

Innocent, on 08 November 2014 - 08:05 AM, said:

Currently heatsinks submerged in water provide added cooling. Firing weapons at mech parts submerged in water cause reduced damage.

Why can a light mech, fully submerged, get to shoot anyone and cause damage?

which small mechs?

I think only the locust is actually small enough to be COMPLETELY submerged isn't it?



even if not, how many spots are actually deep enough?
I think I know 1, maybe 2, depends on how lenient you are on competently submerged
not one provides a tactical superiority in any kind of way to hide in, except for trolling I guess

suggestion:
- move out of range
- wait for light to come out
- profit

or:
- converge on him with more than one mech
- aim
- make click on left mouse button
- profit

i think you're problem is probably more that you still have to lead you're weapons (because of lag or just travel time) and you don't see where those spindly under armored legs exactly are

Innocent, on 08 November 2014 - 08:05 AM, said:

Weapons below the water line should not be able to fire. It is especially annoying that an ecm light can sit in the water fully submerged, invisible to radar, and still able to fire on opponents.

Please fix this.

streaks explode on contact with water (I guess all missiles, but LRM's have a different angle)
this is a problem for said lights as well

honesty I have done a thousand drops after the stat reset and I have yet to run into a situation where I thought that's kinda unfair

lartfor, on 08 November 2014 - 08:08 AM, said:

water should also slow down mechs. How much is obviously up for debate though.

right
like we need another thing that needs to be calculated on the CPU
hope they bring out Mantle support along with that improvement

also Direwolf sneaking up on you from behind through water at full 30kph or so

Edited by Peter2k, 08 November 2014 - 01:58 PM.

[pyrocomp]

Peter2k, on 08 November 2014 - 01:51 PM, said:

right
like we need another thing that needs to be calculated on the CPU
hope they bring out Mantle support along with that improvement

Pfff, make a table and pick from it (as many things can be done in this game), calculations at this point are uncomparable with everything else.

[Peter2k]

pyrocomp, on 08 November 2014 - 01:58 PM, said:

Pfff, make a table and pick from it (as many things can be done in this game), calculations at this point are uncomparable with everything else.

a simple solution that is not convoluted or complicated to get

you must be new here

[pyrocomp]

Peter2k, on 08 November 2014 - 02:01 PM, said:

a simple solution that is not convoluted or complicated to get
you must be new here

Not since long here, yes.
Comlicated solution - no. My primary job includes heavy data grinding and long (weeks) calculations. You literally make everything you can a table, then launch into it. So many tables, maybe, but that's not complicated and totaly worth in some cases. Is ASMed it's the fastest you can get compared to everything, even on the superclustes.

[LordKnightFandragon]

Yeah, water does nothing for ya....I have submerged my mechs up to thier knees with the DHS in the legs and notice no change in heat dissipation.

[Durant Carlyle]

LordKnightFandragon, on 08 November 2014 - 04:01 PM, said:

Yeah, water does nothing for ya....I have submerged my mechs up to thier knees with the DHS in the legs and notice no change in heat dissipation.

It actually DOES increase your heat dissipation. Not by a lot though.

Edited by Durant Carlyle, 08 November 2014 - 04:17 PM.

[Peter2k]

pyrocomp, on 08 November 2014 - 02:32 PM, said:

Not since long here, yes.
Comlicated solution - no. My primary job includes heavy data grinding and long (weeks) calculations. You literally make everything you can a table, then launch into it. So many tables, maybe, but that's not complicated and totaly worth in some cases. Is ASMed it's the fastest you can get compared to everything, even on the superclustes.

frankly I meant because PGI doesn't just come up with simple solutions

I know you could make it simple
but judging from past balance attempts, it wouldn't be easy to implement or to understand

Edited by Peter2k, 08 November 2014 - 05:23 PM.

[Pjwned]

Because of smaller mechs being significantly submerged in water at times, I often find the water in certain levels (mostly Forest Colony and River City) to be annoying to deal with when piloting my Jenner, and also annoying to deal with when fighting other light enemies in the water whether I'm in my Jenner or not.

[LordKnightFandragon]

Durant Carlyle, on 08 November 2014 - 04:16 PM, said:

It actually DOES increase your heat dissipation. Not by a lot though.

By 0.0001% Cuz I couldnt fire any more shots when I tried it....it was 8 or it was 8......no increase at all, and absolutely no increase to heat dissipation that was enough to say so......sooo, technically, I suppose it does increase heat loss, but practically? it does nothing...

[SaltBeef]

For realism a mech going 160 kph into the water would faceplant immediately. Mechs should have to slow in 15ft of water.

[LordKnightFandragon]

SaltBeef, on 09 November 2014 - 10:55 AM, said:

For realism a mech going 160 kph into the water would faceplant immediately. Mechs should have to slow in 15ft of water.

Well, yeah, but PGI doesnt have water modeled well......fast mechs have to move slow and slow mechs even slower, its no different then a human trying to walk into the water.....its impossible to run as fast as you did on land when the water is only at your ankles.....

But PGI doesnt like properly modeled terrain and stuff......the same would go for the trees on maps....they would block shots and be very hard to move through.....maybe you can knock them aside or something......but yeah..

[TimePeriod]

LordKnightFandragon, on 08 November 2014 - 04:01 PM, said:

Yeah, water does nothing for ya....I have submerged my mechs up to thier knees with the DHS in the legs and notice no change in heat dissipation.

You can't fit a DHS in the legs - 3 slots vs 2 slots :<

[LordKnightFandragon]

TimePeriod, on 09 November 2014 - 11:19 AM, said:

You can't fit a DHS in the legs - 3 slots vs 2 slots :<

I dont drive IS =D And my mech has locked DHS in it's legs.