29 replies to this topic

[Kodyn]

So with along with my STD version of the Wubshee, this is one of my all time favorite mechs. I regularly and quite effortlessly land 700+ damage games with this mech, 3x AC/5, 4x ML loadout, usually with 3-7 kills to boot.

My question for those of you that have been playing the 3E longer than me: Chain or no chain on the ACs?

Thus far, the bulk of my matches I've run with the 5's on chainfire, ML on their own group alpha, and third group is full alpha. Great suppression fire, can back nearly anything in the game off, including Dires that technically have higher firepower.

The only downside is that occasionally I get a shot where I can pop off a quick round of AC/5, and wish it had been three rounds instead for the full fifteen damage.

So I decided to try running some matches with the 3x AC on group fire, with similar damage results, only my kills got ridiculous. Now, for this weekend, this is an issue, as I want assists for the tourney, but in general, this seems like a good thing. Same 800 average damage matches, just many less assists, many more kills...like back to back to back kills.

So what's the general preference out there? Is it situation/pilot based mostly, or is there a hard-and-fast rule to live by for triple AC Banshees I missed the memo on?

(I probably won't run the 3E much this weekend, as it's too aggressive for the tourney scoring formula, but I am curious to hear how others run their BNCs.)

[Wintersdark]

I would ask:

Why would you ever chainfire them?

As a rule of thumb, it's nearly never advantageous to chainfire (not just AC5's, practically everything). The only real reason to do it is because you'll overheat if you fire all of them at once, and with AC5's that's really not a problem. That, or screen shake, but single AC5's(as with chainfire) generate very little shake. On the other hand, the reasons not to do it are serious:

You spread damage more - thus requiring higher damage output to destroy or cripple mechs, requiring in turn more ammo for the same effect and therefore costing you additional tonnage that could have been better used, and exposing yourself to more incoming fire.
You require essentially 100% Time on Target to maximize damage output and any attempts at defensive piloting result in lower damage output. Often significantly so.

So, chainfire: Lower damage output, less useful damage dealt, higher incoming damage received and more focussed incoming damage.

As AC5's are so cool as to be basically heat free, there's no need to chainfire for heat purposes.

[Kodyn]

The reason I had been chaining up til now was sheer joy at the dakka-dakka the 3E is capable of dishing out, coupled with the quirks and a lvl 5 cooldown module. I basically just started it out that way, and never switched til tonight, because it was working, and I enjoyed seeing mechs run away every time I opened up.

This was solo queue, i should clarify, so most pilots don't know whether they're being hit by an AC/2 or a 20, they just know their screen is shaking and they hear dakka, so they gtfo. I can definitely see how this would work a lot less well in my regular group queue drops however.

Also, killing an opponent with the least amount of damage is desirable, CBill-wise, correct? For the higher salvage bonus, you're right, i should probably be sticking to group fire and focusing on the kills.

See, this is why I wanted feedback, i forget these little things and let myself ride the exhilaration of all the dakka.

[Hawk819]

Kodyn, on 14 November 2014 - 09:43 PM, said:

So with along with my STD version of the Wubshee, this is one of my all time favorite mechs. I regularly and quite effortlessly land 700+ damage games with this mech, 3x AC/5, 4x ML loadout, usually with 3-7 kills to boot.

My question for those of you that have been playing the 3E longer than me: Chain or no chain on the ACs?

Thus far, the bulk of my matches I've run with the 5's on chainfire, ML on their own group alpha, and third group is full alpha. Great suppression fire, can back nearly anything in the game off, including Dires that technically have higher firepower.

The only downside is that occasionally I get a shot where I can pop off a quick round of AC/5, and wish it had been three rounds instead for the full fifteen damage.

So I decided to try running some matches with the 3x AC on group fire, with similar damage results, only my kills got ridiculous. Now, for this weekend, this is an issue, as I want assists for the tourney, but in general, this seems like a good thing. Same 800 average damage matches, just many less assists, many more kills...like back to back to back kills.

So what's the general preference out there? Is it situation/pilot based mostly, or is there a hard-and-fast rule to live by for triple AC Banshees I missed the memo on?

(I probably won't run the 3E much this weekend, as it's too aggressive for the tourney scoring formula, but I am curious to hear how others run their BNCs.)

Do not Chain fire x3 AC/5. You can if you want to, but it is better to group those babies and wallop those Daishi Clanners one at a time. Just saying.

[Jettrik Ryflix]

Yep, definitly fire them all together! I usually pair my AC5s with 2 PPCs for an even more direct punch.

If you want dakka, I would suggest the 4 AC2, 4 ML loadout. It can be quite fun.

[Kodyn]

Upon further use....yeah, I've been doing it wrong.

While again, this isn't an optimal mech for this weekend, too many kills, hard to get assists without accidental kills, etc.....it's tearing stuff up.

I've now been using the 5's grouped, with a backup group chained in case I for some reason need the suppression, but have yet to use that group...usually stuff's dead too quickly, or I'm trying to hold off fire because I realize I'm about to get a 5th kill and I need assists for the event, and whole team is healthy and on same target lol.

It's literally harder now to not kill a mech than to kill it....guess that's what a shorter range Gauss with much faster fire would be like, 15 pinpoint, over, and over, and over...

[oldradagast]

The only weapons I've seen worth chain firing are LRM's, for steady screen shake and possible better tracking against fast targets, and PPC's on mechs with more than 2 to avoid ghost heat and create a suppression fire effect. Oh, and lasers on mechs with insane number of energy hardpoints (Awesome 8Q, Hunchback 4P, etc.) for the same reason.

Ballistics generally make no sense to chain fire since there's rarely a large enough heat penalty to matter and you want all the shots to hit home. I have a Banshee with the exact weapon load as in the OP, and that's my experience - drilling them with 15 points of pinpoint damage over and over is very effective.

[InspectorG]

Usually, group the 3AC5, 15 damage every second is so nice.

But...

You CAN chain fire to suppress and force others to back down.

Conditions need to be met: You cant be the target of aggro. Chain fire costs too much face time.

Stay next to a bigger target: Atlas, Whales/etc.
You can spare teammates aggro if you start laying a stream of constant hurt at their aggressor.

if 2 Whales are in a shootout and you can get an angle and want the enemy whale to back down, chain fire his face. MAY cause him to rattle and miss your team's Whale.

Same as if 2-3 enemies are ganging up on a teammate, chain fire if fast enough to give them all some love but you trade this for face time and damage. Your choice.

All in all, grouped is better but chain fire has its uses.

[Alienized]

since i use a different tactic for the banshee anyway i have my 2 ac/2 on chainfire to lead my lbx10 shot. also i tend to push hard against enemies instead of staying back with it.
that constant dakka from the 2 ac/2 with that large hit of the lbx drives most enemies backwards or they start torsotwisting which makes it harder for them to hit properly.
opens some doors for your team.

[Kodyn]

While I'm currently very much enjoying the 3x AC/5 loadout, I'd be interested to see what you pack in yours Aliisa. I'm a fan of LBs in general, and I like odd combinations of weapons, so I'd like to see how you worked that all together, might try it at some point.

[Jettrik Ryflix]

Kodyn, on 15 November 2014 - 12:14 AM, said:

While again, this isn't an optimal mech for this weekend, too many kills, hard to get assists without accidental kills, etc.....it's tearing stuff up.

So true. I started the weekend with a 6 kill match in my BNC-3E... that was before I read the rules.
Needless to say, my poor 3E stayed in the garage for the rest of the weekend.

[That Dawg]

Wintersdark, on 14 November 2014 - 10:01 PM, said:

Why would you ever chainfire them?

So, chainfire: Lower damage output, less useful damage dealt, higher incoming damage received and more focussed incoming damage.

We only chainfire. I ONLY chainfire AC's and lasers in this build. (raven only chains the AC's)
We push back rushes, we alter flanks, we change outcomes. I know it sounds bragardly, but...half the battles in pugs or our duo drop ( you know- just target drone fillers for the 8 man drops) I usually am in the top for damage, whether we win lose or draw.
I dont back down, its stand and deliver be it a light, a scarecrow, a dire.
KNOW your enemies hit box and profit.
Its the only mech I broke 1000 damage in 3 times. I suck, I get that, my elo puts me into groups that make stupid mistakes. But the KtD keeps climbing, and I keep seeing better players.

your mileage may vary, your .02 may differ, but- for me- MY results? Chain fire. No other way. I do die a lot- but if you can kill cripple or push back, and your team is paying attention, doesn't matter. winning!

The last match, on the last day, of last weekends tournament.

[T0rmented]

Personally i have 2 groups for my banshees ac5's the first group being all 3 ac5's the second group being only the highest mounted ac5. I rarely use the lone ac5 group but its handy for shooting over obstacles.
Long story short, I only group fire
heres a link with some of my high damage banshee games:
http://imgur.com/W4e...Ps3u7IC,DX2Q4yJ

[CimaGarahau]

... I'm not a Banshee pilot but in my opinion it depends on the situation. If you like/prefer close combats I would use LBX canons.
I'm not that standart AC user. Definately not a Ultra AC user, because of jamming issues. Give me some LBX guns and I'm satisfied.

[Soulscour]

Group fire. Chain fire is so unnecessary.

[Santiago Macario]

Run same loadout, only play pug games
weapon groups go like this

1- the 3 ac5s on group fire
2- 4 medium lasers on chainfire
3- medium lasers on group fire
4,5,6- each one with only one ac5 on it

The 4,5,6 groups, when pressed in order and held allow you to make a constant fire against other mechs at the cost of some mobility, because your left hand abandons the w-a-s-d keys to fire. You can also use the single ac groups to avoid wasting too many shells on lights.

It is a fire technique only viable in some specific situations in matches, but is one aditional resource for your ac boat

[Dawnstealer]

I prefer not to chain....MY DUAL LB10Xs!! BOOM!!!!!!!!!![insert more exclamation points here as needed]

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...b178c42d2577dcc

I ran the 3 AC5 build for a long time, but this is more fun.

[Jerry Beard]

Running mine with 3 AC5 and 1 LG Laser. 360 std engine and no additional heat sinks. Max armor and I am having fun! Heat management is a breeze whether chain firing or group firing the AC5s. I have them set up both ways and use them according to situation. This has been my fav Mech since I bought the table top game in 85. Still needs a tweek or 2 but I am enjoying this build very much. My damage has gone way up and I am getting better all the time, now I just have to temper the overly aggressive instinct and I will survive a bit longer..LMAO!

[Joey Tankblaster]

Triple AC5, Quadruple ML, ST325 + AC5 and ML quirks and the Banshee rocks. 1 on 1 against Dashi is doable.Sometimes I run out of ammo or a skilled opponent takes out my left ST.

No chain for the ACs

Edited by Joey Tankblaster, 25 November 2014 - 04:08 AM.

[Moonlander]

I use 3xAC5 and 4xMPL and I consistently pull 1k matches with multiple kills. I have so many videos in this mech and screenshots. I absolutely love the 3E.

Also, I always group fire the AC5s... no real reason not to. Manage your heat from your lasers and you'll be A-OK. It's like an AC15 that fires almost like an AC2... just absolutely rips mechs apart!