60 replies to this topic

[Mystere]

Sandpit, on 22 November 2014 - 04:00 PM, said:

negative good sir, you must CONTINUE to participate. There's plenty of threads that have addressed this over the years. It's illegal and reportable so just do it!

I've been there, done that (while being hunted as last player on team), and received confirmation from the mods that it was legit.

[Master Pain]

you know the challenge is working as intended when you have to report a few teammates every match because they are hiding...

[Mystere]

Master Pain, on 22 November 2014 - 04:08 PM, said:

you know the challenge is working as intended when you have to report a few teammates every match because they are hiding...

And reporting them will be an exercise in futility. See my 2 posts before yours.

[Sandpit]

Mystere, on 22 November 2014 - 04:07 PM, said:

I've been there, done that (while being hunted as last player on team), and received confirmation from the mods that it was legit.

if you shut down and hide that's not participating. I've received confirmation from mods that that IS reportable

Mystere, on 22 November 2014 - 04:10 PM, said:

And reporting them will be an exercise in futility. See my 2 posts before yours.

and see mine
feel free to start a thread and ask

[Kirkland Langue]

Win = 3 points
Survive = 1 point
Kill = 1 point
Assist = 1 point
Damage - 10xTeamDamage = .005 points

There ya go.

[Sandpit]

Kirkland Langue, on 22 November 2014 - 04:24 PM, said:

Win = 3 points
Survive = 1 point
Kill = 1 point
Assist = 1 point
Damage - 10xTeamDamage = .005 points

There ya go.

great except surviving means you can't just run headlong into the enemy force, alpha a few times, die, leave your team shorthanded like a whiny little dbag who cares nothing about nor has any regard for the 11 other people stuck carrying him now, return to hangar, repeat to exploit the system and spirit of the rules

[Kirkland Langue]

Sandpit, on 22 November 2014 - 04:28 PM, said:

great except surviving means you can't just run headlong into the enemy force, alpha a few times, die, leave your team shorthanded like a whiny little dbag who cares nothing about nor has any regard for the 11 other people stuck carrying him now, return to hangar, repeat to exploit the system and spirit of the rules

umm.. Are you saying that giving points for survival is a bad thing because then you can't just suicide rush?
I'm confused.

[Mystere]

Sandpit, on 22 November 2014 - 04:14 PM, said:

if you shut down and hide that's not participating. I've received confirmation from mods that that IS reportable

Well, all I can say then is that the left hand does not know what the right hand is doing.

Or someone got off easy.

[Sandpit]

Kirkland Langue, on 22 November 2014 - 04:30 PM, said:

umm.. Are you saying that giving points for survival is a bad thing because then you can't just suicide rush?
I'm confused.

No, I said surviving is the best part of the event. It ensures that little dbags who have exploited past events by just running in, shooting a few enemies, then returning to hangar and repeating can't do that now.

Mystere, on 22 November 2014 - 04:33 PM, said:

Well, all I can say then is that the left hand does not know what the right hand is doing.

Or someone got off easy.

I'll see if I can dig up a few of those threads. They're beyond archived now though so they can be a pain to find

[MadLibrarian]

Sandpit, on 22 November 2014 - 04:00 PM, said:

Except for many it does.

Teamamte get a kill and run off to hide?
Just plop down right next to them and continue fighting.
Teammate moves?
Repeat process
Teammate gets mad and starts being belligerent because you won't let them game the system or exploit or screw their team over?
screenshot and report

Problem solved


negative good sir, you must CONTINUE to participate. There's plenty of threads that have addressed this over the years. It's illegal and reportable so just do it!

Your workarounds might annoy the exploiter and prevent them from succeeding in their agenda, but it doesn't change the effects of the scoring system. It's just a disincentive in a single match.

People are always going to try and game the system, that's the basis of strategy. The important thing about challenge scoring needs to be allowing people to game the system in ways that are more inline with good tactics. This challenge doesn't do that because it has high requirements and promotes even more gaming of the system due to the frustration factor.

[Sandpit]

MadLibrarian, on 22 November 2014 - 04:42 PM, said:

Your workarounds might annoy the exploiter and prevent them from succeeding in their agenda, but it doesn't change the effects of the scoring system. It's just a disincentive in a single match.

People are always going to try and game the system, that's the basis of strategy. The important thing about challenge scoring needs to be allowing people to game the system in ways that are more inline with good tactics. This challenge doesn't do that because it has high requirements and promotes even more gaming of the system due to the frustration factor.

sorry, itpromotes teamwork and playing smart.
period.
It promotes the idea that "hey, sometimes thigns are HARD and not everyone always wins something"
This community could use about a thousand more doses of that.

[The Boz]

You can't just respond to a well-reasoned argument pointing out that you are wrong with an "no, I'm not."

[Sandpit]

The Boz, on 22 November 2014 - 05:09 PM, said:

You can't just respond to a well-reasoned argument pointing out that you are wrong with an "no, I'm not."

you can't make your opinion fact with "because I said so"

[The Boz]

Oh, so you can't, eh?

[MadLibrarian]

Sandpit, on 22 November 2014 - 04:49 PM, said:

sorry, itpromotes teamwork and playing smart.
period.
It promotes the idea that "hey, sometimes thigns are HARD and not everyone always wins something"
This community could use about a thousand more doses of that.

Period?

It can certainly be looked at like that, and it might be the Intent, but it's obviously not all that it promotes. It also promotes hiding after kills or as soon as crit, crazy kill chases with lots of blocking and team damage, and of course LRMs (as always). The challenge scoring promotes all these things by rewarding the results of them without a counter balance. Duration of time powered down, connection status at match end, and team damage/kills for example.

It also promotes a lot of whining on the forums from both sides of the argument, as evidenced by this, and similar, threads.

Do you only play in groups? Perhaps your ELO is just too high for the solo queue crazies?


Since I like to stay on topic, I'm gonna throw out another possible 'good challenge'. Get x amount wins in a weekend with disconnects disqualifying the match.

[Sandpit]

MadLibrarian, on 22 November 2014 - 05:16 PM, said:

Period?

It can certainly be looked at like that, and it might be the Intent, but it's obviously not all that it promotes. It also promotes hiding after kills or as soon as crit, crazy kill chases with lots of blocking and team damage, and of course LRMs (as always). The challenge scoring promotes all these things by rewarding the results of them without a counter balance. Duration of time powered down, connection status at match end, and team damage/kills for example.

It also promotes a lot of whining on the forums from both sides of the argument, as evidenced by this, and similar, threads.

Do you only play in groups? Perhaps your ELO is just too high for the solo queue crazies?


Since I like to stay on topic, I'm gonna throw out another possible 'good challenge'. Get x amount wins in a weekend with disconnects disqualifying the match.

those that are hiding after kills are playing stupid. No other way to say it. They're not the ones who are going to win the event. By hiding they're depriving their team of a mech, which then means their team has less chance of winning. Those players? Those are the same players that would rambo in and die leaving their team shorthanded, except now they can't do that and they refuse to accept that this is a TEAM BASED game.

I've already given workarounds on how to combat that style AND when and how to report it if they're hiding in a corner and shutting down while not participating.

This event isn't "encouraging" that, people's selfish dbag mentalities are promoting that and no event will ever change those people who can't grasp that this isn't a single player game and there's a team of 12 to consider.

Those same people eplxoited and gamed every other event. This event doesn't "encourage" any of that.

[Kirkland Langue]

Sandpit, on 22 November 2014 - 04:49 PM, said:

sorry, itpromotes teamwork and playing smart.
period.
It promotes the idea that "hey, sometimes thigns are HARD and not everyone always wins something"
This community could use about a thousand more doses of that.

Well I think that survival should be rewarded - but the survival requirement pretty much killed the event for me. I'm almost always on the front line in battle, and therefore almost always killed at some point.

[Sandpit]

Kirkland Langue, on 22 November 2014 - 05:25 PM, said:

Well I think that survival should be rewarded - but the survival requirement pretty much killed the event for me. I'm almost always on the front line in battle, and therefore almost always killed at some point.

There's tactics to help mitigate and prevent that. I use them myself as an assault pilot

You've got to find that "sweet spot" when it's good to be on the front line and drawing "aggro" and then you've got to know when it's smart to pull back and let someone else pull that attention for a few so that you can reposition, commence firing again, etc.

If you're the target of focus fire, hide. (if anyone complains about that, ignore them) Wait a few seconds until they've had time to find new targets. If your team is shooting at them they can't stand there and wait for you to pop out again for very long. Then you pop back into the battle and wait to repeat the process. That's how you help spread damage.

That's the difference between 800 damage and 1 kill 10 assists
and
800 damage 3 kills 4 assists.

Same in reverse if you're trying to survive.

Now by hide I don't mean hide in a corner until the end of the match, I mean hide long enough for their attention to be diverted, then you can use your firepower to help focus one of their mechs. Trust me, doing little things like that will help you immensely.

[MadLibrarian]

Sandpit, on 22 November 2014 - 05:24 PM, said:

Spoiler

those that are hiding after kills are playing stupid. No other way to say it. They're not the ones who are going to win the event. By hiding they're depriving their team of a mech, which then means their team has less chance of winning. Those players? Those are the same players that would rambo in and die leaving their team shorthanded, except now they can't do that and they refuse to accept that this is a TEAM BASED game.<br></p><p><br></p><p>I've already given workarounds on how to combat that style AND when and how to report it if they're hiding in a corner and shutting down while not participating.</p><p><br></p><p>This event isn't "encouraging" that, people's selfish dbag mentalities are promoting that and no event will ever change those people who can't grasp that this isn't a single player game and there's a team of 12 to consider.</p><p><br></p><p>Those same people eplxoited and gamed every other event. This event doesn't "encourage" any of that.

I mostly agree with you in general but I don't think that's entirely accurate and you're generally misrepresenting the players. You don't have to be stupid or evil to do lame stuff. There's nothing wrong with exploiting the system, it's the basis of strategy. It is to be expected in all games, as it is practically the definition.

The fact that it isn't compensated for is where the problem lies.

[Sandpit]

MadLibrarian, on 22 November 2014 - 07:22 PM, said:

There's nothing wrong with exploiting the system, it's the basis of strategy. It is to be expected in all games, as it is practically the definition.
.

you heard it here folks
smh