65 replies to this topic

[StandingCow]

So, it is pretty much impossible to balance clan mechs and items against IS stuff... so instead of trying to balance it what about making it fully destructible? As in, if your mech dies or you have a clan weapon blown off... you lose it and would to purchase a new one (With Cbills of course).

[Greyrook]

It seems like there's a few too many of these clan-tech-based threads. Clan tech isn't going to be available for a while.

[StandingCow]

Greyrook, on 26 June 2012 - 01:30 AM, said:

It seems like there's a few too many of these clan-tech-based threads. Clan tech isn't going to be available for a while.

Yea, but it is fun to speculate on how they plan to eventually do it.

[Elizander]

I'm fine with Clanners being OP as long as the matchmaking system can read BV and make some 12 IS vs 5 Clan fights. When you sign up for Clans there should be a disclaimer stating that you will now be placed in battles where you can have less players on your team unless you're fighting another clan team.

Oh, a part of the clan system should be your whole team gets bonus EXP/C-bills if one or more of your team heads back to the hangar and goes AFK for the whole fight.

Edited by Elizander, 26 June 2012 - 02:00 AM.

[MrMasakari]

Im sure they'll balance it eventually when they are added, one way or another. Whether it be by splitting clan mechs equally in MM across the teams or with long CD or less damage.

[Firelizard]

Elizander, on 26 June 2012 - 01:55 AM, said:

I'm fine with Clanners being OP as long as the matchmaking system can read BV and make some 12 IS vs 5 Clan fights. When you sign up for Clans there should be a disclaimer stating that you will now be placed in battles where you can have less players on your team unless you're fighting another clan team.

Ya know, there is actually some canon backup to that idea. IS powers, when actually presented with the choice, would only engage Clan forces with power of numbers.

Of course, there could also be even number Clav vs Inner Sphere matches with the IS forces getting bonus XP and such.

[Phasics]

Or, and lets get crazy for a second

just balance the clan mechs with IS ones by either making IS ones better or clan ones worse level playing field problem solved

[Freakiie]

Phasics, on 26 June 2012 - 04:48 AM, said:

Or, and lets get crazy for a second

just balance the clan mechs with IS ones by either making IS ones better or clan ones worse level playing field problem solved

Imagine the rage if that happened

[Fugu]

Pitting less Claners against a lot of IS players seems to be the best option.
An Atlas costs 9,626,000 C-bills while a Dire Wolf costs 29,350,000 C-bills. So, a balancing system based on the cost of 'Mechs would work just fine, possibly. Three Atlas at once can surely destroy a Dire Wolf.
It would work pretty much the same way as Warhammer 40k TT. A Spacemarine is superior to pretty much every other regular infantry unit but costs accordingly.
I assume it's the same for Battletech TT.

Edit: Fixed some typos.

Edited by Fugu, 26 June 2012 - 05:39 AM.

[Elwood Blues]

In tabletop, you would have bidding. IS forces were more or less defined from the start and the player who bid the least amount of clan forces took the field. I'm just not sure how it can be easily balanced in MWO.

Edited by Elwood Blues, 26 June 2012 - 06:46 AM.

[Phasics]

Freakiie, on 26 June 2012 - 05:21 AM, said:

Imagine the rage if that happened

Oddly enough they would flame for a week ...maybe a month and then they'd be over it after they realised its for the best

I mean what would you rather play ? a true to TT MWO where everyone uses clan mechs because they're better and you only see newbs in IS mechs and its WoT tier problems all over again
Or
All mechs are artificially balanced to use and people use what they like not whats the "best" and we maintain variety and diversity of mechs on the field.

[Reoh]

I want them to have better tech, so I can take it from them. The canonical batchall mechanic makes sense, although actually bidding is probably better off streamlined as a matchmaking ratio to be determined by testing. Not sure if they match based off BattleValue currently, but if not there's always pilot ratios.

[Kittygrinder]

StandingCow, on 26 June 2012 - 01:28 AM, said:

So, it is pretty much impossible to balance clan mechs and items against IS stuff... so instead of trying to balance it what about making it fully destructible? As in, if your mech dies or you have a clan weapon blown off... you lose it and would to purchase a new one (With Cbills of course).

This, no offense, is a terrible idea.

The only way to balance a clan vs IS fight will be to place less clan mechs than IS. Or if equal numbers, lighter clanners.

And to be honest, i dont like the idea (im IS through and through btw) but i dont see how else you could balance it other than making clan mechs and weapons just as bad as IS stuff, which would take the fun out of being a clanner.

[Tekkiller]

Elizander, on 26 June 2012 - 01:55 AM, said:

I'm fine with Clanners being OP as long as the matchmaking system can read BV and make some 12 IS vs 5 Clan fights. When you sign up for Clans there should be a disclaimer stating that you will now be placed in battles where you can have less players on your team unless you're fighting another clan team.

Oh, a part of the clan system should be your whole team gets bonus EXP/C-bills if one or more of your team heads back to the hangar and goes AFK for the whole fight.

Except no one likes to be cannon fodder and everyone likes to be superior. So everyone chooses Clan Tech and Matchmaker is stuck with having more Clanners than IS.

Not going to work. Let's worry about Clan tech a year from now when the game has stabilized and PG is strting to think about an expansion/major content patch.

[BigMo5]

Tekkiller, on 26 June 2012 - 08:50 AM, said:

Except no one likes to be cannon fodder and everyone likes to be superior. So everyone chooses Clan Tech and Matchmaker is stuck with having more Clanners than IS.

Not going to work. Let's worry about Clan tech a year from now when the game has stabilized and PG is strting to think about an expansion/major content patch.

If players were forced to play how the CLANs Honor system required then the CLAN TECH would be ok. Since most gamer's want all the advantages but don't have a clue what honor means adding clan tech will basically end up like many have said.

It would be something like this:
1 Heavy Clan vs 1 Medium + 1 heavy IS
1 Medium Clan vs 2 Light IS( 1 med + 1 light)

This is hoping they leave those Test Tube warriors out for a while...

[Future Perfect]

Clan mechs are superior.

Clan weaponry are superior.

How are you going to balance that?

[grimzod]

StandingCow, on 26 June 2012 - 01:28 AM, said:

So, it is pretty much impossible to balance clan mechs and items against IS stuff... so instead of trying to balance it what about making it fully destructible? As in, if your mech dies or you have a clan weapon blown off... you lose it and would to purchase a new one (With Cbills of course).

Screw clan tech just get over the fac tthat its not here and wont be for more than a year.

[Firelizard]

Elwood Blues, on 26 June 2012 - 06:45 AM, said:

In tabletop, you would have bidding. IS forces were more or less defined from the start and the player who bid the least amount of clan forces took the field. I'm just not sure how it can be easily balanced in MWO.

Now THAT is an idea!

Maybe make the bidding system be per player, based on the mech's BV. Clanner goes into his hangar, picks out a certain mech, and queues up with everyone else. The lowest BV pilots get selected. Then clanners that werent picked get a chance to bid lower, or bow out. You end up with natural balancing as people bid lower and lower on the Clan side to get into the match, while the IS pilots field their 'Sunday Best' as it where.

[Wolv e]

My idea to balance the clans out is have a player run clan bid against a NPC clan for the right to fight. With the criteria set by the devs the player run clan should win most times unless they are unwilling to bid low enough to keep the fight fair against the inner sphere.

[xxx WreckinBallRaj xxx]

*Pasted from another thread as I deem fit to say the exact same thing in this one.*
I do not think they should or logically can put Clan Tech in our game. Clan Tech was better than any Non Clan Tech. Their Mechs could carry more at the same weight, and their weapons weighed less while doing equal or better damage. Simply put, in any game that had Clan Tech, there was no reason to ever use Non Clan Tech except as last resort filler. What I am saying is that putting Clan Tech in this type of game would destroy any and all value or point to use Non Clan Tech Mechs or weapons. Why save up for an IS Mech instead of a Clan one? IS Tech would be worthless. The solution would be to balance them out... but I don't see how that is possible from a lore standpoint. Their technology was simply better, in almost every way. There wasn't a contest. The best solution is to just keep Clan Tech out of the hands of the players. If the stuff ever does come available, it better cost 2x or 3x the price over IS stuff so IS stuff actually retains some value. But even that would probably fail as I bet EVERY player would still just save up for Clan stuff and forget IS entirely.

grimzod, on 26 June 2012 - 09:35 AM, said:

Screw clan tech just get over the fac tthat its not here and wont be for more than a year.

I'll be glad it's not here. There's a lot of Mechs and weapons in MechWarrior, and by having Clan Tech on the menu... you make everything else worthless since it is flat out inferior technology. The logic here that we will ALL have the "lesser" Mechs/technology, thus we are on even ground and get to enjoy any Mech in the rooster without being unfairly better or weaker due to it being IS or Clan.

Future Perfect, on 26 June 2012 - 09:07 AM, said:

Clan mechs are superior.

Clan weaponry are superior.

How are you going to balance that?

They'd either have to destroy the lore and water down the technology... or jack up the price to insanity. I don't see either as an ideal solution. I'd rather just keep Clan Tech off the table.