32 replies to this topic

[Alistair Winter]

Russ Bullock just wrote the following in the December road map.

Quote

IS Quirks pass update – Minor update to change or improve upon the original pass. An example was changing the Dragon 5N to UAC5 instead of AC2, also changing the Grid Iron to Gauss. So in more cases considering the stock load out. I cannot list exact changes yet as I am not sure how many of these improvements we can get in before patch time.

Released Dec 16th patch.

Well, I'd just like to point out once again that the community has shown a considerable desire to change the quirks for a few mechs in particular. The lack of PPC quirks on the CPLT-K2 was arguably on top of the list.

http://mwomercs.com/...-quirks-thread/
http://mwomercs.com/...-quirks-no-ppc/
http://mwomercs.com/...-quirk-preview/
http://mwomercs.com/...sed-the-target/
http://mwomercs.com/...is-mech-quirks/

For those of you who didn't read all that, let me summarize the opinion of the community as best I can. Many of us really want PPC quirks. Many of us really want ballistic quirks. Almost everyone would be happy if we got both. Instead of being shoe-horned into a single build (i.e. AC10+4ML), people could now potentially experiment with different combinations of PPCs and ACs. Which is fun. After all, MWO-players do love to play in the mechlab.

There's relatively little danger that the CPLT-K2 will accidentally become a Tier 1 mech, so please just throw the CPLT-K2 fans a bone on this one. We promise not to dethrone your precious Timber Wolf

TL;DR - Please give CPLT-K2 both ballistic and PPC quirks

[5th Fedcom Rat]

The other thing it desperately needs is a small buff to CT armor or structure. Lots of other mechs got that kind of buff in the last pass, but the Catapult didn't even though it has arguably the largest CT and head hitbox in the game. To say nothing of the giant arms on the missile variants.

The once feared Catapults are a joke nowdays, especially in comparison to the Timber Wolf. They could get their old torso twist numbers back and they'd still be a joke.

There's no good reason to pilot a Catapult anymore except out of nostalgia.

.

Edited by 5th Fedcom Rat, 03 December 2014 - 01:05 AM.

[EvilCow]

Please keep the ballistic quirk (maybe improve it a little bit too) but replace the mlaser quirks with robust PPC-related improvements: velocity and heat. A CT improvement would also be nice, the other catapults got that, that CT is a Gauss magnet.

K2 users would appreciate it.

[MeiSooHaityu]

It all sounds good to me.

I could see them dropping the Ballistic Quirk and going with a PPC Velocity increase to maybe 25%. Maybe 7.5 or 15% cooler too.

The CT could use some internal structure love, but if the PPC quirks are sucessful, you won't need to expose your CT to enemy fire as much with the high mounted weapons (unlike the low torso mounted ballistic weapons). It might be enough.

[Tristan Winter]

MeiSooHaityu, on 03 December 2014 - 03:11 AM, said:

The CT could use some internal structure love, but if the PPC quirks are sucessful, you won't need to expose your CT to enemy fire as much with the high mounted weapons (unlike the low torso mounted ballistic weapons). It might be enough.

Yeah. It's basically the only heavy mech with the ability to carry two PPCs / ER PPCs above its head. Which means that, unlike the Jagermech, you never really need to worry about whether the barrels are actually free from cover. If you can see it, you can shoot it. And unlike the Stalker, the CPLT-K2 with an XL315 engine can hump hills with tremendous agility, making it a lot easier to disappear before your enemies return fire.

Unfortunately, without PPC-quirks, you're just not doing enough damage to be a threat. The Gauss-jager has 50% better alpha strike than the CPLT-K2 PPC boat, with twice the projectile speed and zero heat. That's... quite significant. You won't really live long enough for the Gauss-jager to run out of ammo.

Edited by Nicolai Kabrinsky, 03 December 2014 - 02:54 PM.

[MeiSooHaityu]

Nicolai Kabrinsky, on 03 December 2014 - 03:46 AM, said:

Yeah. It's basically the only heavy mech with the ability to carry two PPCs / ER PPCs above its head. Which means that, unlike the Jagermech, you never really need to worry about whether the barrels are actually free from cover. If you can see it, you can shoot it. And unless the Stalker, the CPLT-K2 with an XL315 engine can hump hills with tremendous agility, making it a lot easier to disappear before your enemies return fire.

Unfortunately, without PPC-quirks, you're just not doing enough damage to be a threat. The Gauss-jager has 50% better alpha strike than the CPLT-K2 PPC boat, with twice the projectile speed and zero heat. That's... quite significant. You won't really live long enough for the Gauss-jager to run out of ammo.

Kind of depends.

The K2 wouldn't be ammo dependant so you could spam PPCs all match. The room saved from not carrying ammo could be used for more DHS or a large beam followup weapon. Also, if the PPCs see a velocity increase, they might be a bit easier to use at range due to the extra projectile speed and lack of a charge mechanic. Many people are good with the gauss charge, but nothing beats point and click to fire.

Lastly, I feel the K2 will be refitted to carry an old meta. Even with removed ballistic quirks, dual PPC and an A/C10 build will become popular. I have even seen 2PPCs and 2 UA/C5 builds (although super slow).

That is a lot of firepower and the main reason I think the K2 originally did not get PPC quirks.

Still, it at least needs a good healthy PPC velocity increase. The K2 needs to be what it was born to be

[Jin Ma]

yup thats kind of a nobrainer

[Tristan Winter]

MeiSooHaityu, on 03 December 2014 - 04:00 AM, said:

Kind of depends. The K2 wouldn't be ammo dependant so you could spam PPCs all match.

You can already do this, really. But it just doesn't amount to a whole lot of damage without a second weapon like an AC10.

MeiSooHaityu, on 03 December 2014 - 04:00 AM, said:

The room saved from not carrying ammo could be used for more DHS or a large beam followup weapon. Also, if the PPCs see a velocity increase, they might be a bit easier to use at range due to the extra projectile speed and lack of a charge mechanic. Many people are good with the gauss charge, but nothing beats point and click to fire.

If you're just comparing ppc vs gauss in a sniping match, then I'd say the 50% extra alpha strike more than makes up for the charge mechanic. In a brawl, gauss is harder to use, but the total lack of heat is still pretty sweet too. Especially when you have 4 medium lasers as a backup weapon.

MeiSooHaityu, on 03 December 2014 - 04:00 AM, said:

Lastly, I feel the K2 will be refitted to carry an old meta. Even with removed ballistic quirks, dual PPC and an A/C10 build will become popular. I have even seen 2PPCs and 2 UA/C5 builds (although super slow).

I think that would be great, actually. The PPC+AC10 / AC5 builds are pretty much extinct now. You do see some PPC + Gauss builds on clan mechs, especially the TBR and DW, and frankly, the TBR with Gauss + PPC is always going to beat the CPLT-K2 with PPC+AC10.

But anyway, I think it'd be nice if there was a single Inner Sphere heavy mech that could still do relatively well with the AC+PPC combo due to quirks.

I've never seen anyone be effective with 2PPC+2AC5 or UAC5s on the CPLT-K2. Just too many big guns on a 65 ton mech. The Jager can sometimes do it, but only thanks to its high weapon mounts, which makes up for the lack of speed in a sniping match.

MeiSooHaityu, on 03 December 2014 - 04:00 AM, said:

Still, it at least needs a good healthy PPC velocity increase. The K2 needs to be what it was born to be

Maybe the ideal situation would be ballistic and PPC quirks that make the 2xPPC + single ballistic weapon deadly. For only PPCs to be effective, with the torso weapons as backups for brawling, the PPC quirks would have to be pretty damned good, IMO.

[Alistair Winter]

MeiSooHaityu, on 03 December 2014 - 03:11 AM, said:

It all sounds good to me.
I could see them dropping the Ballistic Quirk and going with a PPC Velocity increase to maybe 25%. Maybe 7.5 or 15% cooler too.

They could increase velocity by 50% and cooling by 50%, it probably wouldn't make a big difference.

[LordMelvin]

I feel like people are still scared of the old Gausscat, Boomcats, and Splatcats of yore. I'd say that the Catapult is one of the few mechs that actually functions within it's desired role. It's a great long range support mech but if something gets in close it has a hard time brawling without back-up. And considering how the meta has shifted and all of the new chassis we have I don't think giving the Catapult back some of its old strengths would destabilize the game (more).

[Brody319]

I don't want PPC quirks specifically. I think it would benefit from a removal of most of the ballistic quirks making it :7.5% ballistic range. Then have some great generic energy quirks, just to help all builds on it rather than favoring one or two builds. Like having -25% heat generation on energy, and 20% energy cooldown, would be better than 12.5% energy heat generation and 12.5 PPC heat generation.

[MATRAKA14]

What about strong velocity/heat quirks + LA RA strength and the return of the old PPC barrels, that makes sense to me. Just a random idea
I also like the ballistic quirks but I can understand the priority of ppc quirks.

I would like to return to my old 2 er ppc + gauss with a fast engine it was fun to play, now i use 2 ac 10 + 4 ml + xl300 and it's also fun.

If the quirks stay like now the CT buf would be needed.

Edited by MATRAKA14, 03 December 2014 - 12:48 PM.

[JediPanther]

I'd be all for ppc and er ppc quirks on the k2. I miss when they were worth having from closed beta. The k2's energy arms are nothing more than 40 armor dead weaights now. I've been rolling the ac20 k2 so long my ppcs have rusted.

[Windsaw]

Flamers for the Firestarter!

[Alistair Winter]

MATRAKA14, on 03 December 2014 - 12:47 PM, said:

return of the old PPC barrels

Yes!

Windsaw, on 03 December 2014 - 01:46 PM, said:

Flamers for the Firestarter!

YES!

Also, fixing the flamers for all mechs. I don't dare to use the flamer on my Adder, for fear of being ridiculed.

[occusoj]

Please give the K2 some (ER)PPC quirks. Id like to see some substantial speed increase and a bit less heat.
If some quirks have to go in exchange, please take the ML ones and not ballistics.

Lots of mechs, TW for example, will be still much stronger, theres little danger of creating an OP death machine by giving generous PPC quirks to the K2.

And while you are at fixing some other mechs CT, well,... wouldnt that be a good time to help the walking CT with ears, also called Catapult, a bit?

Edited by occusoj, 03 December 2014 - 02:11 PM.

[STEF_]

What about giving robust MG and MPL quirks to Arrow?
(50% cooldown, 50% range?).
It should be its role: sweeper mech.
ac20 can be mounted by any other BJ with ballistic.....

and what about changing the LL quirks for CDA-3M to ER-LL quirks?

and what about to exchange ac quirks that CTF-1x and CTF-2x have? SInce CTF-1X has only one ballistic can mount ac20, while CTF-2X has TWO ballistic hardpoints and can mount 2 ac/10 easily..... (so why does pgi fail to see this)?

and what about gauss quirks to Grid Iron?

and what about AC20 Quirks to On1-K, and everybody likes the little Altas, instead of that uac5 quirk?


Edit: Aloha , out thread, but.... because.

Edited by Stefka Kerensky, 03 December 2014 - 02:31 PM.

[Alistair Winter]

Stefka Kerensky, on 03 December 2014 - 02:29 PM, said:

and what about to exchange ac quirks that CTF-1x and CTF-2x have? SInce CTF-1X has only one ballistic can mount ac20, while CTF-2X has TWO ballistic hardpoints and can mount 2 ac/10 easily..... (so why does pgi fail to see this)?

wut?

[Malleus011]

The K2 needs PPC & ERPPC quirks.

[MauttyKoray]

Firestarter needs SPL nerf apparently.