353 replies to this topic

[SirLANsalot]

Seems like PGI is going to be bullheaded about this one.

4 mech requirement. Seems like the awesome epic and really cool CW I was looking forward to, will not be played by any Clanner worth there salt. Reason I say this? One Direwolf, and 3 mechs that, as an assault pilot, I (or anyone else) have any interest in running or are very good in. Assault pilots are getting the shaft in CW, and I am fine with that. For the cost of being able to bring everything, I only get to have 2 of these things and must be careful with them. Heavy pilots are almost in the same boat, but they can at least have 3, maybe 4 (of the lighter ones). However this only applies to IS mechs, so for being a CLAN player AND an Assault player, I am getting hit twice by this double negative?
I would love to run my BEST mech, and be able to run a PAIR of them like the Inner Sphere will be able to with there Atlas and King Crab.

That is, unless things change.......

Like raise the tonnage (if you must force people to take mechs they do not want to) for clan mechs. Up to 250 or even 260 tons would allow clanners to take there best mechs and a pair of lights so as to satisfy the idiotic 4 mech requirement.

Alternatively.....

Remove the 4 mech requirement. Make a minimum Drop wight limit (its 140 now which sounds fine) and allow PLAYERS to choose if they want to respawn one more time, or three more times. This also means players would be running in there best mechs, and it would be UP TO THEM to decide if they want to bring another non "insert best class here".





I love being a clanner, its fun to run these beautiful mechs, and the god among them is amazing. However Clans DO NOT have the tonnage options that IS do, and as such, the drop deck MUST BE ADJUSTED to account for this. Either remove the 4 mech requirement, or raise the deck by 10-20 tons to account for the fact that CLANS DO NOT HAVE A 20 TON MECH (yet)!

[Hillbillycrow]

Props for obscure Skyrim semi-quote header.

[Walluh]

Why would you even take a Dire to CW? The firepower is nice, but the lovely thing about a pure clan team is that it's a 81kph+ deathball. Taking dires ruins that.

[Joe Mallad]

IMO its fine as is. We should not see mass amounts of full Assault lances. They are not supposed to be this common anyway.

However, a good Assault mech pilot (not all) but most should not have many issues being able to field only 2 in CW. Most good Assault pilots (if they load out right) and know their mechs, should be able to stay in the fight for some time and most times, not have to go into their 3rd or 4th picked mechs.

As for IS and or Clan pure heavy lances... it can be done but only by bringing 4-60 ton heavies. So for the Clans, that would be X4 Mad Dogs (vultures) for the moment. And for IS that would be X4 Dragons.

Edited by Yoseful Mallad, 06 December 2014 - 07:19 AM.

[Yosharian]

Come on man, really? You can't pilot anything but an assault?

Come on man....

[Nik Reaper]

So the best "heavy-sh" lance a clanner can bring is a DWolf a Twolf and 2 kitfoxes topping at 235 or one kit and one adder.

Edited by Nik Reaper, 06 December 2014 - 07:26 AM.

[Molossian Dog]

So you poor people will be restricted to Timberderp, Stormcrow, Stormcrow, Stormcrow?

Hm...I got to say I find it rather difficult to feel compassion.

Edited by Molossian Dog, 06 December 2014 - 07:35 AM.

[Triordinant]

The reason it's 240 tons is the lightest possible tonnage is 20 and the highest is 100, making the average 60. 4 x 60 = 240.

[Walluh]

I would love some more clan mediums, because man, I really, really do not like the Stormcrow.

[Siegegun]

Nobody is "taking it to the knee" because they can't bring 4 assaults. There is a very good reason they have tonnage limits which restrict your choices a bit. There is no 3/3/3/3 in CW. So they have to restrict it some how. If they did not CW would quickly turn into what we had a one and two years ago in the combined ques. All assaults and heavies with a token medium and a light even rarer here and there.

What would you rather have? Tonnage limits which gives the most choice or 1/1/1/1 which is what it was before. Notice they both restrict you. You assault pilots can play an "inferior" weight class. I KNOW you have it in you. I believe in you guys!

The only way the clans ARE being restricted in a way is the lack of more mechs with more varied weight tonnage. This is slowly being solved with the introduction of more clan mechs. However, considering clans have access to the Timber Wolf and the Storm Crow which most consider to be the top tier mechs, as well as the Dire Wolf also considered one of the top mechs, I think you will be fine until more varied tonnage mechs are injected.

Edited by Siegegun, 06 December 2014 - 07:40 AM.

[Joe Mallad]

Walluh, on 06 December 2014 - 07:37 AM, said:

I would love some more clan mediums, because man, I really, really do not like the Stormcrow.

what about the Nova? Dont like it either?

[Pale Jackal]

Given that lighter mechs pack more punch ton for ton than heavier mechs you are gimping your team by taking less mechs.

[Vassago Rain]

Yoseful Mallad, on 06 December 2014 - 07:40 AM, said:

what about the Nova? Dont like it either?

It's worthless.

[Walluh]

i like the concept of the Nova, but with the heat of clan weapons and it's awful hitboxes, not really an option in CW. Ice ferrets are alright, just take some getting used to.

Arctic Wolf, though, plsgive

[Angel of Annihilation]

Clans kind of get the shaft due to the very obvious lack of mechs to choose from. 13 total chassis verses the IS which I think is topping 40 different models now. Basically we need more Clan mechs and fast.

However, another problem arises with Clan mechs. The construction rules in place in MWO really limit the roles they can play unlike IS mechs. For example, not to long ago I went on a quest to find a 55 ton Clan Omnimech that stock mounts jump jets and there isn't one. The reason it obvious, JJs are bolt on devices for Clan Omnimechs per TT rules so if you need JJs on a 55 tonner, you just add them to a Stormcrow, simple as that. However, unless PGI comes up with special Omnipods that allow JJs, the Clans will never have a 55 ton jump capable omnimech.

Now I am not claiming Clan mechs are underpowered, but the do suffer fairly harsh limitations.

As to the 240 ton drop limit, I do understand the OPs position however right now we are already functioning in a very Top Heavy game with heavies and assaults making up roughly 60-70% of the que. With a 240 ton limit, a person who wants to bring mechs in the upper limits of weight will have to make significant sacrifices to do so and this is a good thing. This will force weights down to more reasonable and realistic levels and return medium mechs to the workhorses lore portrays them as. This should also force TTK down as well as the amount of firepower in each match up will be reduced significantly. Also skill will start becoming more important as your not going to be able to rely on extreme alphas for your success.

Also a 240 ton drop weight will insure more diversity in Clan Wars. It will insure we have all weights and classes partitioning and open up to a much more strategic game. For example, does your unit focus on each one of you bringing one large assault and 3 much lighter mechs, or you do you middle of the road and mostly choose 40-70 ton mechs. These sorts of strategic decisions will be critical for overall success.

[Joe Mallad]

Vassago Rain, on 06 December 2014 - 07:43 AM, said:

It's worthless.

really? I guess it has to be preference. I love the Novas. I have better success in them than i do any other Clan mech.

[Lexx]

If you have to bring the whale, you can take a Dire Wolf, 2 Storm Crows and a Kit Fox.

You can bring 2 Timber Wolves, a Storm Crow and an Adder (or smaller)

You can bring 1 Timber Wolf and 3 Storm Crows.

The only thing that will be difficult is fitting both and Dire Wolf and a Timber Wolf in your drop deck because that means you have to take 2 lights, but it can be done.

Raising the tonnage would be bad, I like it at 240. I don't think you should be able to bring the top 3 clan mechs in the same drop in CW.

Edited by Lexx, 06 December 2014 - 08:01 AM.

[Levi Porphyrogenitus]

I'd be happy with a slight bump in drop weight limit, accompanied with a large c-bill reward for low drop weight. This was the system used in MechCommander, and it was great.

Imagine a 250t limit with 4 mandatory slots. A Clan player could roll with a pair of Daishis, but then he'd have to bring along a couple Koshis. An IS player could roll with that Atlas duo, but would need to bring along a pair of Locusts or Commandos.

Now throw in the bonus for low drop weight at, say, 1k per ton under. Rather than taking the full 250ts, an IS player decides to roll with just 240ts (2x Atlas, 2x Locust). He'd get a bonus payout of 10k c-bills. If he wanted to boost his c-bill gains further, he'd need to drop one of the Atlases to something smaller. If a Clan pilot wanted to earn some bonus c-bills he'd have to limit himself to a single Daishi while dropping the other to a Masakari or Mad Cat or something.

[BigJim]

How is saying Assault pilots are getting the shaft, any different from Light pilots saying the same?
Yeah, I could take 4x 35 tonners, but then I'm wasting 100t of my team's drop-weight.

I'd rather be "forced" (aw..) into a mech I'm not optimal at piloting than waste 100t.

We're all going to have to make compromises in order to run the specific mechs we really want.

As an aside tbh it' not like clanners suffer in terms of what tonnages to take, they/we (I much prefer clan mechs overall, even if my favourite class is totally dominated by the IS) don't have a full spectrum of choices at just about every tonnage level.

I can think of much better 240 combos I'd rather take on the clan side than on the IS.

[Angel of Annihilation]

Yoseful Mallad, on 06 December 2014 - 07:40 AM, said:

what about the Nova? Dont like it either?

Nova is Tier 4. Absolutely not a competitive medium for the most part. I say for the most part because I am sure their are some pilots that are death incarnate in them but that is the exception, not the rule.

Ice Ferret also isn't an option because it is more of a gimmick mech. Don't get me wrong, it can be very effective but its role is more of a light mech hunter/killer than anything else. Honestly the best way to describe it is "overspecialized" which limits its flexibility in a tightly controlled competitive environment.

The Clans are going to need medium mechs like the Grendel, Shadow Cat, Nobori-Nin and Pouncer to offer a competitive medium line up and they are going to need them fast. Until then, Stormcrow is going to be the go to clan medium. Luckily aside from not having JJs, which is its own issue when you consider the lack of Clan mediums, it is one of the top mediums in the game.