136 replies to this topic

[Kiiyor]

Lefty Lucy, on 11 December 2014 - 02:38 PM, said:

welcome to fighting players who know what they're doing.

This ^^

The current meta involves an evil amalgamation of pinpoint damage and the things other mechs use to walk on.

Against mechs with decent hitboxes (like the Crow and MadCat) it's the most efficient way to bring them down.

[Lord Ikka]

Against almost all Mechs, aside from the Jenner- CT that thing, targeting legs is smarter. There is usually less armor on legs than torsos and foolish players will really shave down leg armor.

Edited by Lord Ikka, 11 December 2014 - 03:21 PM.

[Marmon Rzohr]

I think the people going "oh well it's the most effective way", "all is fair" or "it's cowardly" have grabbed the wrong end of the wrong stick.

Of course it's fair and of course it's a good tactic. You can also play around it by using ridges and cover to hide your legs if they're damaged, just like you use JJs to tank some damage with leg armor. You can usually only leg mechs that are in the open or in close, brawling range. In fact, when people try to zerg each other it's perfectly logical to leg the enemy.


That's all fine, but it might be poor design. In a game based on precision fire and component damage, the existence of a default "go to" damage location is kinda bad, IMHO. Sure, it's the way the meta has evolved, but it's a bit of an underwhelming direction, considering all the stuff that could be done with the game's mechanics.

[BlackHawk K]

pretty much anything can be a fair tactic in a war.

but, this is a game.

the legging units have been going on for quite awhile now in group matches. but, more and more units are adopting the tactic.

for myself, i dont mind shooting legs out from under a light mech or even fast mediums, and, i dont mind being legged in those mechs either. but, when you get to heavy and assault mechs, then i think it gets out of hand.

but that goes for the mass missile units, and the arty/airstrike spam. all valid but incredibly boring. so is playing against legger units. sure, these tactics can and in many cases WILL give you a win, but in the bigger scope of things it drags the game down in my opinion. it makes the game frustrating and boring. 2 things, that a game shouldn't be. i also believe because of tactics like these, it will eventually drive the player base down. in the end you will be left with only those players who either dont care or who enjoy that play style.

the reason i raise the concern of player base, is because many of the folk in my unit are just itching for some better game to come along for us to get behind. the reason is for the most part we find that play style, while valid, frustrating and very boring. the majority of us spent a fair amount of money on this game. but many of us, have stopped because of the stated reasons. i can only imagine that this isnt just within the group of people i associate with but could represent a lot of units.

at this point the only thing i can say is, as a unit i would do some hard thinking about what your goal is. if winning is your only goal and you dont care about how its done. then dont be surprised if eventually a game like this either slows down or dies or you end up playing exact same like minded units. if you want to see a game like this to continue to grow then we need to encourage enjoyment in the game and encourage new players to join the player base and help them along. unfortunately there are a few new players that i have invited to play with us who quite, because the game takes a fair amount of skill for one, and they grew frustrated and discouraged by tactics like i have listed above.

[CMDR Sunset Shimmer]

Is this Mechwarror 3? Are we actually complaining about legging?

[Lord Ikka]

It's the same strategy that happened in MW4. Legging is never going to die and you just need to learn to counter.

[SixstringSamurai]

It would be nice if I could actually get into a drop.....just saying.

[AztecD]

Flash Frame, on 11 December 2014 - 03:35 PM, said:

Is this Mechwarror 3? Are we actually complaining about legging?

Seems so

PUGS never played league matches are surprised for some reason

Edited by AztecD, 11 December 2014 - 03:40 PM.

[Diraphity]

"Legging" is a tactic as old as Battletech itself.

Welcome to the Inner Sphere "Clanner"

[Davers]

BlackHawk K, on 11 December 2014 - 03:34 PM, said:

pretty much anything can be a fair tactic in a war.

but, this is a game.

the legging units have been going on for quite awhile now in group matches. but, more and more units are adopting the tactic.

for myself, i dont mind shooting legs out from under a light mech or even fast mediums, and, i dont mind being legged in those mechs either. but, when you get to heavy and assault mechs, then i think it gets out of hand.

but that goes for the mass missile units, and the arty/airstrike spam. all valid but incredibly boring. so is playing against legger units. sure, these tactics can and in many cases WILL give you a win, but in the bigger scope of things it drags the game down in my opinion. it makes the game frustrating and boring. 2 things, that a game shouldn't be. i also believe because of tactics like these, it will eventually drive the player base down. in the end you will be left with only those players who either dont care or who enjoy that play style.

the reason i raise the concern of player base, is because many of the folk in my unit are just itching for some better game to come along for us to get behind. the reason is for the most part we find that play style, while valid, frustrating and very boring. the majority of us spent a fair amount of money on this game. but many of us, have stopped because of the stated reasons. i can only imagine that this isnt just within the group of people i associate with but could represent a lot of units.

at this point the only thing i can say is, as a unit i would do some hard thinking about what your goal is. if winning is your only goal and you dont care about how its done. then dont be surprised if eventually a game like this either slows down or dies or you end up playing exact same like minded units. if you want to see a game like this to continue to grow then we need to encourage enjoyment in the game and encourage new players to join the player base and help them along. unfortunately there are a few new players that i have invited to play with us who quite, because the game takes a fair amount of skill for one, and they grew frustrated and discouraged by tactics like i have listed above.

Another "This game will die if people don't play the way I want them to" post.

[Barantor]

Marmon Rzohr, on 11 December 2014 - 03:22 PM, said:

I think the people going "oh well it's the most effective way", "all is fair" or "it's cowardly" have grabbed the wrong end of the wrong stick.

Of course it's fair and of course it's a good tactic. You can also play around it by using ridges and cover to hide your legs if they're damaged, just like you use JJs to tank some damage with leg armor. You can usually only leg mechs that are in the open or in close, brawling range. In fact, when people try to zerg each other it's perfectly logical to leg the enemy.


That's all fine, but it might be poor design. In a game based on precision fire and component damage, the existence of a default "go to" damage location is kinda bad, IMHO. Sure, it's the way the meta has evolved, but it's a bit of an underwhelming direction, considering all the stuff that could be done with the game's mechanics.

Cops take out the tires of the car they are chasing, they don't shoot for the engine.

Same deal, just gotta adjust your playstyle. Welcome to meta?

[BlackHawk K]

Davers, on 11 December 2014 - 03:42 PM, said:

Another "This game will die if people don't play the way I want them to" post.

speaking for myself, i dont really care one way or another at this point. but games have died over similar things in the past. the only reason i bring it up is, if game difficulty AND unit tactics keep new players away. then how is this game supposed to support its self for the long haul. i dont see the thought of this as a invalid concern. and i didnt say the WILL die. its just a possibility.

i didnt post what i did because i demand anyone to play the way i want them to. its just another view point of another player. its just an opinion and a view point. nothing more.

[Karamarka]

This is a thread really?

Elo must be really low in the pug queue if never seen aimed fire before.

[KuroNyra]

Karamarka, on 11 December 2014 - 03:59 PM, said:

This is a thread really?

Elo must be really low in the pug queue if never seen aimed fire before.

Saw aimed fire before. But for the ST or CT depending on the engine probably mounted on the mech.
I also saw legging from time to time but. Come one, 3 mech destroyed, 3 mech with only the legs hits. That should pop something in your hear.

Has I said, I fear that CW match (match yes, because this is not a war, but a GAME before everything else. Got it?) will turn in leg party only. Becoming boring, frustrating, same thing over and over again. Best way to kill a game. and ruin a gamemode.

Better having a Low Elo than a Low mental level. Sorry, but be with the legging has a "fun" and "valid" tactic or saying "IT'S WHUAAAAAAAAARRRRRR" won't make you intelligent or even credible. It is the douchebag solution by excellence.

Edited by KuroNyra, 11 December 2014 - 04:04 PM.

[C E Dwyer]

Ahh the legging has started

all those builds that skimped on leg armour are about to become very unmeta

[Davers]

BlackHawk K, on 11 December 2014 - 03:58 PM, said:

speaking for myself, i dont really care one way or another at this point. but games have died over similar things in the past. the only reason i bring it up is, if game difficulty AND unit tactics keep new players away. then how is this game supposed to support its self for the long haul. i dont see the thought of this as a invalid concern. and i didnt say the WILL die. its just a possibility.

i didnt post what i did because i demand anyone to play the way i want them to. its just another view point of another player. its just an opinion and a view point. nothing more.

So we should make legs invulnerable to damage? Why give them armour if you aren't supposed to shoot them? I guess it's not fair to shoot tanks in the treads, only the most armoured parts too.

There is still the pug and group queues (and private matches) for people who don't like players who know how to play the game.

[Necroconvict]

Legging is for twats, there are a lot of twats.

[FupDup]

In CW, the Steering Wheel Underhive at long last now clashes with the peaks of Mount Tryhard.

[Roadbeer]

I am Roadbeer
And I approve of this tactic.

<insert Git Gud meme here>

[KuroNyra]

FupDup, on 11 December 2014 - 04:12 PM, said:

In CW, the Steering Wheel Underhive at long last now clashes with the peaks of Mount Tryhard.

should place "douchebags elitits" on the peak too. Hopefully not all hardcore players are dumb.