53 replies to this topic

[Ph30nix]

Ace Selin, on 14 December 2014 - 05:46 AM, said:

Russ stated CW is for 12 man groups, so guess all US solo PUGs should leave, take our disposable income elsewhere, find a new game?

wait he actualy said one of the biggest conent updates of the game and the thing we have been waiting on for the longest time is supposed to only be for the smallest fraction of the player base?

that sucks.....

it might be okay if they ever implement a in game Voip and add in a group builder.

[Joseph Mallan]

Ace Selin, on 14 December 2014 - 05:46 AM, said:

Russ stated CW is for 12 man groups, so guess all US solo PUGs should leave, take our disposable income elsewhere, find a new game?

Or quit whining and take the beating that a Clan on Inner Sphere fight is meant to be.

[LennStar]

EgoSlayer, on 14 December 2014 - 08:31 AM, said:

It's in the stickie at the top of this very forum:

http://mwomercs.com/...e-how-it-works/

Quote

The whole concept is that the match maker and CW was definitely built primarily for Units and groups of 12.[/color][color=#959595] It still works for small groups and solo players but they can get left behind - we are working on ways to greatly improve the ability of small groups and solo players to find matches more on this at the end.

I've been on some very successful solo drops though, even against larger Units. There is enough time to develop and execute stratigies using chat, and if the players are remotely decent and realize that following a plan is the only way to win, it can happen. Although attacking does take far more well executed plans than defense.

Please note that what you quote is ONLY about the matchmaker findign groups (12:12 is preferred) - it is not about who is playing and not at all stating that PUGs should not join.

Actually a IS PUG group defending against non-zerging clans (rush with all 12 mechs, fast Med and Heavy, to the base too fast to kill) made the best games I had so far.

[ShadowbaneX]

Irish BoB, on 14 December 2014 - 08:42 AM, said:

12 Is vs 10 clan would be more fair, surely? Would also represent the superior numbers the Inner Sphere is supposed to be able to muster against the clans...

As it stands, I never go to play against the clans, there is no point

Also clan players seem like the type to play games on easy....just saying

12 vs 10 can't be implemented...well, it can, but it would take a massive amount of work. I've suggested giving the IS a 5 mech drop dec, but that just turned into the usually "are clans OP or not" debate.

As for the OP, I just had a match where it was a pug IS counter-attack vs an 11+1 GBI match. It was a slaughter, I don't think we even got 20 kills in the match.

One alteration I'd like to the counter attack game mode is that the gates & turrets shouldn't get repaired. The whole idea of a counter attack is that you're hitting the enemy who just took an objective before they can dig in and repair the defences.

[Averen]

Btw, if Community Warfare is designed with 12 premade vs 12 premade in mind, how does that explain 12 premade vs 12 pug? You're not making sense.

That said, i had actually one match where we my IS pug team attacked at stomped a 12 man team of clan defenders, that was pretty funny. xD
Lost all other matches against those kinds of team, tho.

Edited by Averen, 14 December 2014 - 09:31 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Averen, on 14 December 2014 - 09:30 AM, said:

Btw, if Community Warfare is designed with 12 premade vs 12 premade in mind, how does that explain 12 premade vs 12 pug? You're not making sense.

That said, i had actually one match where we my IS pug team attacked at stomped a 12 man team of clan defenders, that was pretty funny. xD
Lost all other matches against those kinds of team, tho.

Its simple the MM will try to match up two 12 man teams BUT if they are not chosing the same planet the Matchmaker isn't going to pull DHB from Lost to fight Murphy's Law on Londerholm. So that is why you are seeing mixed groups/PUGS v Full teams.

[Averen]

Joseph Mallan, on 14 December 2014 - 09:37 AM, said:

Its simple the MM will try to match up two 12 man teams BUT if they are not chosing the same planet the Matchmaker isn't going to pull DHB from Lost to fight Murphy's Law on Londerholm. So that is why you are seeing mixed groups/PUGS v Full teams.

Obviously, why else would that happen? My post was directed at the people who defended the matchmaking by quoting russ, which was a fallacy by itself.

[Grey Ghost]

I would just like to know in advance when I click DEFEND, whether or not I am actually defending or counterattacking.

[Lily from animove]

Reverendk, on 14 December 2014 - 09:15 AM, said:

Acolytes of the High Elo lifestyle have already accepted this drag reducing truth into their hearts, but it sounds like you're the kind of player that is incapable of the high skill 'etitive play that is required for groups that want to win. Frankly it appears you aren't even IN a group. That's not unbalanced, that's just skill. Will one into existence. It's not hard if you've got the 'etitive skill required. They might be making changes and bug fixes to the maps and game flow for smaller groups, but if you don't have the high elo mentality, eleven friends, and a love of typing the NATO phonetic alphabet in team chat, you can pound sand. This is serious business for 'etitive players on 'etitive teams.

It's also high time that all of these low elo players stop complaining about "balance" and "nerfs" and "buffs". Playing clan mechs? That's a skillful choice for people that want to win, not a balance issue.

Energy hard points? Skill.

Single shell autocannons? Skill.

Game mechanics that are in beta and subject to change? SKILL

Broken out of bounds timer? Hot. Skill.

To quote a true high elo player "if the match maker keeps giving me these garbage teams I'm going to quit early." TRUE. SKILL. Gulf Echo Tango Gulf Oscar Oscar Delta.



Cheers
RK
ANSLDYTJMSYAOTG (Ain't no shame, ladies do your thing, just make sure you ahead of the game, if this hasn't all come together yet)
High Elo Low Drag Collective Gaming Group for the Family Friendly Playing of High Intensity E-Games No Profanity Clan clan

just make unit crossing groups possible, skilled players then can find groups with other skilled players. Because right now, CW will either make these people leave or soon dissovle into only a very very few big sized units.

Edited by Lily from animove, 14 December 2014 - 03:49 PM.

[Squally160]

Exodus001, on 14 December 2014 - 08:37 AM, said:

I would like to see the end of 12 man organised teams (I know this opinion won't be popular but..). It would be easier for small units like mine with a woping total of 5 players to fight competitively if all units could only field 1 lance per game. 3 separate but coordinated lances vs. 3 separate but coordinated lances would be more interesting than piles of random junk vs. perfected 12 man kill machines.

Should I tell my other 8 friends to piss off then?

[Davers]

If players don't like the possibility of playing against teams, then there is the solo queue. It's still there for casual gamers. Just like 40 person dungeons in WoW, CW is not for everyone.

But as we have seen in this very thread, pugs can beat 12 man teams. It is after all a game about skill.

[Adamski]

**** that, how about CW can be for people who want to enjoy roleplaying and being immersed in the BattleTech universe, and the Skill based Try Hard Non Casual can play in the premade group queue death match to truly show off their skills.

That makes about as much sense as saying that CW is not for the casuals and solo's.

[Brandarr Gunnarson]

CW and the MM, as they stand now, need something to make it work better/more fairly.

Se my post here:

http://mwomercs.com/...s/page__st__100

[Alistair Winter]

As someone who has spent the last 2 years mostly in the solo queue, I think it's wonderful to finally face pre-made groups and play alongside them.

There's no denying that the solo queue has been the target of some ridicule from players who mostly resided in the group queue, and I relish the opportunity to finally face the people who have eluded me by only playing in the group queue. Playing in the solo queue teaches you a different kind of teamwork, I think. It's like being blind and having your other senses heightened. Without teamspeak, you rely far more on the minimap and improvising without orders.

I've had the opportunity to face a lot of people who I would never face before CW. To a certain degree, it's been nice to confirm that group queue players are not the master race. On the other hand, it's also quite impressive to see the level of teamwork that some of the best units bring to the table.

[Saiphas Cain]

The biggest problem with CW being designed for 12 person drops is the number of contracts on offer at any one time makes it difficult to get matches in a timely fashion if anyone not in a 12 person drop didn't play it. How many 12 person teams are really on at any one time? This is more of a queueing issue, and the fact that "defending" contracts are so often counterattacks. "Oh, you thought you'd try defending? NOPELOL! HAHA! You're really attacking,.". Unless you accept exclusively defense contracts you're going to be really attacking most of the time and attacking on the best of days is hard. Disorganized teams trying to attack is asking for trouble whereas defending disorganized teams isn't so bad.

[Glamdring]

Ace Selin, on 14 December 2014 - 05:46 AM, said:

Russ stated CW is for 12 man groups, so guess all US solo PUGs should leave, take our disposable income elsewhere, find a new game?

I doubt very much that that was his meaning as I'm sure you know perfectly well. Stop trying so hard to be a victim, and think about what you're saying. What do you want pgi to do, make grouping up with your friends and coordinating your efforts impossible? Should they make skilled players randomly self destruct? You're not only demanding the impossible from pgi, but you're doing so with a snotty little whining attitude. Teamwork will always be op dude. There's nothing pgi can do to stop it without destroying the game. It's a competitive multiplayer game man, people who have been playing longer than you, and who are working together with their friends are going to beat players who have less skill, and or are on a "team" of 12 individuals who aren't communicating. That's going to be true no matter where you and your disposable income go.

Edited by Glamdring, 14 December 2014 - 10:43 PM.

[Adamski]

A good first step would have been NOT disabling pick up groups and limiting CW to Merc Unit groups only. Thankfully they are rolling that decision back.

A second step would be showing who is queued for a planet prior to a match being made, so they can begin to organize and communicate, thankfully they are also working on this.

[hybrid black]

Ace Selin, on 14 December 2014 - 05:46 AM, said:

Russ stated CW is for 12 man groups, so guess all US solo PUGs should leave, take our disposable income elsewhere, find a new game?

or join a unit...
why do people think they deserve everything in life... like dam you cant have everything you want and not everything an be for you i'm in one of the Strongest units in the game and i can solo drop and still win an attack... lots of 12 mans out there are just as bad as pugs or worse if you have a bad commander

[MischiefSC]

On my 4th successful match against Clanners while helping defend on the Steiner front. 3 were counter-attacks, one a defend. All 3 conter-attack victories were against 2 or 3 4man+ premade units while we were almost exclusively pugs and a 2man.

We dropped the hammer on them, hard and heavy. One ended wave 2, other two ended wave 3, all with Omega up in flames.

Each match we played against some well known (in some cases very well known) groups of premades and still beat them, IS vs Clans on counter-attacks.

This is the fundamental difference between pug/premade tactics and CW tactics. If you're having a lot of trouble here then pug your houses IS vs IS border and try to drop with some group house units, ask questions on the tactics and do your best to play to the leaders direction. You'll learn exactly what wins and what doesn't. Then apply that on the Clan front, adjusted for Clans lack of fast lights and heavy use of LRMs.

[volon12]

there are two types of pugs.
1. organizes quickly attacks and wins.
2. tries to organize rushes and balks at the mechs falls apart and loses.
voip will go along way to fixing this but then we also have to deal with trolls. with number 2 i just resort to farming for money.