140 replies to this topic

[salkeee]

From what I have experinced atacking quee are way much shorter that defending seems pointless.

[Cellinor]

I wish my buddy and I were in a position to raid again but we both have families with young children so no joy in Mudville for us. We have been chipping in where we can but due to the que system (not complaining mind you) we have to solo drop instead of dropping together. The wait time is just too long.

Another thing to take into consideration is the learning curve. It took me multiple matches to work out effective mech groupings and order, as well as tactics for each map and goal.

Things will get better imo.

[Rihko]

3rd Takata usually has a 10 - 12 man up and running for CW all night, but it's a 10 - 12 man. We win most of our fights, but it's not enough when the other faction has four or five twelve mans on your planet and they pull PUGs + empty match autowins.

I understand why the autowin is in the system - to keep people from securing a planet by not defending - but it does get frustrating when you do well and still lose because of numbers.

[Scoops Kerensky]

Rihko, on 16 December 2014 - 10:30 AM, said:

3rd Takata usually has a 10 - 12 man up and running for CW all night, but it's a 10 - 12 man. We win most of our fights, but it's not enough when the other faction has four or five twelve mans on your planet and they pull PUGs + empty match autowins.

I understand why the autowin is in the system - to keep people from securing a planet by not defending - but it does get frustrating when you do well and still lose because of numbers.

It's a silly system on it's face. Who's going to actively try to *not* play the game? Even if every coordinated group on one faction agrees not to fight at a thing, pugs will still queue up to defend it eventually. Ghost capping is a bad mechanic that makes player skill and contribution meaningless, only numbers matter in the big picture for this iteration of CW.

[Lyoto Machida]

Socop, on 16 December 2014 - 10:42 AM, said:

It's a silly system on it's face. Who's going to actively try to *not* play the game? Even if every coordinated group on one faction agrees not to fight at a thing, pugs will still queue up to defend it eventually. Ghost capping is a bad mechanic that makes player skill and contribution meaningless, only numbers matter in the big picture for this iteration of CW.

Make ghost capping worth 1/3rd or so of a win against actual defenders to mitigate this issue.

Kurita just doesn't seem to have enough numbers to defend all these fronts at once.

[kazlaton]

Any time we get more than 8 of our unit members together, we win about 90% of the time. We're winning the battles but loosing the war due to numbers and ghost capping.

For now, the best thing to do is not take it too seriously. PGI set up a game where the larger population wins. There's nothing we can do about that. Just continue to coordinate, and fight your individual battles with skill.

[Scoops Kerensky]

Lyoto Machida, on 16 December 2014 - 10:56 AM, said:

Make ghost capping worth 1/3rd or so of a win against actual defenders to mitigate this issue.

Kurita just doesn't seem to have enough numbers to defend all these fronts at once.

Personally I'd go even farther. Let people get the normal payout and contract rewards for a ghost drop, but don't let it have any actual effect on the CW map or shift the number of wins in either direction

[Lyoto Machida]

kazlaton, on 16 December 2014 - 11:00 AM, said:

Any time we get more than 8 of our unit members together, we win about 90% of the time. We're winning the battles but loosing the war due to numbers and ghost capping.

For now, the best thing to do is not take it too seriously. PGI set up a game where the larger population wins. There's nothing we can do about that. Just continue to coordinate, and fight your individual battles with skill.

Well, I can't even really play CW, because my framerate is in the toilet since the CW updates (even after a fresh re-install and trying different user.cfg files). The CW games I have dropped in have been fun.

Hopefully, PGI structures after game rewards with an inverse relation to how many members are in each faction. This might cause some redistribution of players among the factions to even things out.

[Rihko]

kazlaton, on 16 December 2014 - 11:00 AM, said:

For now, the best thing to do is not take it too seriously.

Mmph. Amen to that; as long as I get a drop, I am having fun. I want wins for Kurita, sure, but the matches are fun.

When they aren't full of people complaining about the game and taking it all far too seriously, anyway.

[Scoops Kerensky]

kazlaton, on 16 December 2014 - 11:00 AM, said:

Any time we get more than 8 of our unit members together, we win about 90% of the time. We're winning the battles but loosing the war due to numbers and ghost capping.

For now, the best thing to do is not take it too seriously. PGI set up a game where the larger population wins. There's nothing we can do about that. Just continue to coordinate, and fight your individual battles with skill.

Yeah, this is the way to go for now. It's important to for anyone Kurita to keep in mind that we're in the beta period at the moment and we should use the time before new mechanics are introduced or balanced out to build out of game infrastructure for our playerbase as a whole to integrate into without a lot of trouble.

People will be more likely to join Kurita if we become the place to be if you're new to the game or need a lot of accommodations while you learn the basic ins and outs of the game. Maybe we can set up a newbie unit just for holding anyone who wants people to hang out and queue up with that has a lot of older players to teach basic skills and teamwork.

[pwnface]

Framerate in the toilet as well but still somewhat stable enough to snipe stuff.

I think that ghost capping should be worth less than an actual win 1/3 or 1/4 of a point seems okay but the attacking team should not need to enter the actual match and run through to kill the turrets. They should be able to requeu after they wait 15 minutes to try to get another ghost cap win or a real match. Running through a map with no enemies is boring and pointless.

[Rush Maguin]

A Kurita player wants 228 to LEAVE Kurita space?

228 is one of the most competent and effective teams in the game and their contributions to Kurita interests has been second to none. My unit fears and respects them.

OP is, to use an old phrase, "Cutting his own throat." Kurita will be easy prey without 228.

[Sky Hunter]

pwnface, on 15 December 2014 - 02:06 PM, said:

Shredhead, I completely understand where you are coming from but you should try to not take CW so seriously while it is in the beta phase. Having a 24 hour map update but 4-5 hour attack phases makes no sense at all. Our unit has stayed up late together capturing planets only to wake up the next morning to see that euro/asian players retook the planet while we were all asleep. If I recall correctly, the map updates at 8:30 AM PST every day. This means that anything we accomplish the night before can easily be reversed while the majority of our faction is offline.

When PGI figures out how to make CW work in a way that makes sense, we can actually focus more together to get stuff done. For now, we've made a lot of progress in terms of infrastructure including a new website and teamspeak and a massive influx of players interested in group play. Let's not worry too much about who controls what until PGI gets their **** together.

How to Conquer a Planet
There are some new advancements here to make conquering a planet easy to understand and dynamic on a daily basis. First off, planets will transition ownership every 24-hours.

Added is the new aspect of having to hold X number of wins on a planet for the duration of the day's combat phases to successfully conquer a planet.

If the attacking Clan team wins the match, they will win a token.

If the defending IS team wins the match, they will have sucessfully defended the planet from that one attack. No token is awarded.

Now assume that the Clan team did win this match. The Clan Force now owns 1/X tokens for that planet. (for now, let's say X=11)

Here is where the planet conquests rules start to apply. The Clan Force needs to get 11 tokens to successfully take the planet from the IS Forces and the FRR.

When the Clan Force (or any attacking Force/Faction for any contested planet) takes the first token, the opportunity for the IS Force to do a counter attack begins.

The next match after the token is taken, is considered a counter attack. In this case, if the Clan team wins the match, they keep their token. If the IS team wins the match, the token is taken away from the Clan Force. If the IS team wins the match, the next match to take place on the planet is another Clan attack match. This creates a push/pull mechanic for the planet's tokens but wait, there are 4 or 5 attack phases per day, each of these attack phases had tokens given to or taken away from the invaders.

If we assume 5 5 hour attack phases, that is a potential of 55 win tokens, how many tokens were won over the course of the day by the invaders, how many tokens did the defenders retain?... but this is just the point, the defenders may have denied the attackers enough tokens to deny the 11 tokens needed.

What if the Clans get 15 tokens in attack phase 4? The answer is that the IS Forces will have to successfully counter attack 6 times to push the token count back down below 10 to keep the planet.

If your team wants to keep the planet, your team needs more groups attacking and holding at the same time.

Are there 44 or 55 tokens for a day? Is each phase adding up tokens? The answer is no and no (at least to my knowledge) but it seems you do not have to have all 11 in a single phase to win the planet either. Having the majority of the tokens of most of the phases seems to be enough as I watched 3 worlds change to ghost bear who had 7 to 8 at the end of most phases and no more than 6 to 8 when midnight came.

Why are there several phases in a day, simple, peak player times.
What are the peak player count times?
We are currently looking at 6-8PM PDT for West Coast, 3-5PM PDT for East Coast (6-8PM EDT), and 11AM-1PM PDT for UTC (6-8pm UTC). Thats 5 times, dividing a 24 hour day into 5 times? or 4, does not matter, this just allows the players in those peak times to make a difference and not just be cleaning up the mess the players before them created.

Thus it is my belief the "tokens" are divided by the number of phases and require a total 6 or more to win a planet at the end.

Alas, I leave you with this, most of this post is copied from elsewhere, adjusted slightly and may be entirely WRONG because of me and or before my input, but I think my analysis is correct.

[Ezazel]

Socop, on 16 December 2014 - 11:03 AM, said:

Personally I'd go even farther. Let people get the normal payout and contract rewards for a ghost drop, but don't let it have any actual effect on the CW map or shift the number of wins in either direction

If that was the case then the best defense would be to not defend at all. That would actually mean that no planets could ever be conquered again. Defenders would just do the old good no show trick and keep their planet.

[Shredhead]

Rush Maguin, on 16 December 2014 - 11:42 AM, said:

A Kurita player wants 228 to LEAVE Kurita space?

228 is one of the most competent and effective teams in the game and their contributions to Kurita interests has been second to none. My unit fears and respects them.

OP is, to use an old phrase, "Cutting his own throat." Kurita will be easy prey without 228.

I'm a member of the 228th.

[Scoops Kerensky]

Ezazel, on 16 December 2014 - 01:22 PM, said:

If that was the case then the best defense would be to not defend at all. That would actually mean that no planets could ever be conquered again. Defenders would just do the old good no show trick and keep their planet.

There is absolutely no way people in a faction will collectively stop fighting or defending a planet. It is unenforcable and pugs will always sign up for whatever they see available. Its why you see steiner and davion trading blows 24/7 at their borders despite repeated attempts at ceasefires by the organized teams on both ends, ditto for the FRR/Kurita, and why the clans are at each others throats as much as they are at the IS.

Show me a mass of players organized enough to not pick the option when it's there and I'll believe you have a point, otherwise I think all evidence we have says the opposite of what your point is here.

Edited by Socop, 16 December 2014 - 02:08 PM.

[Prophetic]

Shredhead, on 15 December 2014 - 01:08 PM, said:

We are about to lose 5 (!) planets today because you guys are unable and unwilling to coordinate defenses!
Before CW we regarded Mariks as the weakest faction. It turns out you're even worse. I will ask the leadership of 228th to take contracts with another faction once our current contract runs out.

Well I wish you luck and I hope your low opinion of us is not shared by your whole unit. We have personally worked with 228th to help attack and defend planets.

If easy mode is what you are looking for then by all means join clans or a faction with a lot less fronts.
Fact is Kurita will always be getting smashed on multiple sides.
We will always be in a fight.

The numbers game has nothing to do with Organization.

[Amro One]

How about your people stop defending FRR space . .. . . . . . Btw, Steiner lost that amount on the first day of fighting.

[pwnface]

We attack/defended turtle bay 11-12 times in a row but still are losing tokens. Until PGI fixes autowin drops awarding a full token, superior numbers is the only thing that matters. Having 100 terrible players is better than having 12 of the most elite.

[Shredhead]

Prophetic, on 16 December 2014 - 02:16 PM, said:

Well I wish you luck and I hope your low opinion of us is not shared by your whole unit. We have personally worked with 228th to help attack and defend planets.

My low opinion about the coordination of that faction has nothing to do with my opinion about you.

Quote

If easy mode is what you are looking for then by all means join clans or a faction with a lot less fronts.
Fact is Kurita will always be getting smashed on multiple sides.
We will always be in a fight.

As mercs we'll go where the money is. Most definitely not easy mode.

Quote

The numbers game has nothing to do with Organization.

Yes, it totally has. If we can't defend all planets, pick a few and stick with it. Or choose to not defend at all, instead attack some planets. As is, Kurita forces are split and don't get anything done.