47 replies to this topic

[DaManiac]

I've played several matches of CW and simply put it sucks balls.



If you are a clan player, I don't want to hear your one sided story about how CW works, it doesn't. For a clan player it's a pure turkey shoot 95% of the time.



The community needs to see the stats of IS winning counter attacks. Because in all the CW games i have played it doesn't even come close to a half win. It's typically a 2:1 kill ratio Clan:IS.



So I want to know. How often does IS win a counter attack, if it's anything less than 30% CW, then it's broken. I'm sure the rest of the community wants to know as well. I'm sick of playing as the alien in galaxian, it's seriously not fun.

[Alistair Winter]

I sympathize, but we won't have a good idea of the actual percentages unless someone from the community tries to collect statistics based on a random sample. There are so many variables, like which factions have the best players and where they're attacking. You've got big units agreeing on peace treaties, which means all the most organized players aren't necessarily playing with the people who aren't aware of what's going on.

The best indicator of Clan vs IS success may actually be the CW map, if and when they stop the PvE matches. The timer for PvE matches is currently set to 10 minutes, I think, which does help.

[xe N on]

It is very easy.

I made a 7 days contract with Steiner. I did this, because I like the lore and I realy like playing IS mechs. However, since next to all competitive teams went Clans, currently it is quite unfun to play IS as small group or solo player.

However, as a clanner you just need 3 Stormcrows and 1 Timberwolf. I already have 3 stormcrows mastered and using the Timberwolf prime trial mech I can easily join the clanners next week.

As IS player, I can just advice to switch factions until there are no or few IS player left and CW is failing. Then we will probably have some match making option to prevent another winning team joining.

Edited by xe N on, 19 December 2014 - 12:37 AM.

[Widowmaker1981]

DaManiac, on 18 December 2014 - 10:59 PM, said:

I've played several matches of CW and simply put it sucks balls.



If you are a clan player, I don't want to hear your one sided story about how CW works, it doesn't. For a clan player it's a pure turkey shoot 95% of the time.



The community needs to see the stats of IS winning counter attacks. Because in all the CW games i have played it doesn't even come close to a half win. It's typically a 2:1 kill ratio Clan:IS.



So I want to know. How often does IS win a counter attack, if it's anything less than 30% CW, then it's broken. I'm sure the rest of the community wants to know as well. I'm sick of playing as the alien in galaxian, it's seriously not fun.

Just a question, which IS mechs are you using?

[DaManiac]

Alistair Winter, on 18 December 2014 - 11:12 PM, said:

I sympathize, but we won't have a good idea of the actual percentages unless someone from the community tries to collect statistics based on a random sample. There are so many variables, like which factions have the best players and where they're attacking. You've got big units agreeing on peace treaties, which means all the most organized players aren't necessarily playing with the people who aren't aware of what's going on.

The best indicator of Clan vs IS success may actually be the CW map, if and when they stop the PvE matches. The timer for PvE matches is currently set to 10 minutes, I think, which does help.

No, No and No. We just have to look at the BIG picture. The variables become moot when you look at the big picture, because the largest population stems from the common pug players like myself who log in and play when we feel like it.

This is simply CLAN vs IS. They log every game, they have the data already. They just aren't bothering to look at it. I guarantee you the IS win rate for defending vs the clan win rate is lower, And the IS win rate for attacking is nonexistent.

Widowmaker1981, on 19 December 2014 - 01:11 AM, said:

Just a question, which IS mechs are you using?

I use a combination, Jenner, Battlemaster, a 65 tonner (Jag/Cat/TDR), Shadowhawk.

They are all mastered, I have good K/D ratios for all of them.

Edited by DaManiac, 19 December 2014 - 07:45 AM.

[Alistair Winter]

DaManiac, on 19 December 2014 - 07:45 AM, said:

This is simply CLAN vs IS. They log every game, they have the data already. They just aren't bothering to look at it. I guarantee you the IS win rate for defending vs the clan win rate is lower, And the IS win rate for attacking is nonexistent.

Don't be ridiculous. Of course they're looking at it. They're just not doing anything about it.

[Koda Shy]

maybe they don't want us to see it, I imagine that it is pretty bad.....and considering a lot of matches didn't have defenders at all in them. .... ok now saying that..........

it all about what you bring and what your team brings to the party. and really there is only one strat that will win attacking and one strat that will win defending......now keep that in mind and hear this....if you are fighting a decent group...and all your team does is stand there and defend omega you will lose. its ******* asinine ... really is. ive been in pugs solo against IS when that was the plan. and it never worked.

[pinsndneedles]

Can't speak for the Clan border, but fighting in the IS is always going hot. I've only seen a handful of turret stomps in the last few days. If you're not having fun on the Clan border then re-contract and hit a great house.

[Almond Brown]

Alistair Winter, on 19 December 2014 - 07:59 AM, said:

Don't be ridiculous. Of course they're looking at it. They're just not doing anything about it.

After launching only 7 days ago which included 1 major update, wtf should/could they be doing about it?

[Panzerbjorn]

So far in my experience, winning or losing is 100% about coordination and having good players in your team. When I do CW with my CGBI comp team we almost never lose - attack or defense. When I drop as a solo in a PUG-filled group, we almost always lose - I mean 98% of the time. When I drop with random trothkin in a "casual group" the result completely depends on the make-up of the other team - if they are organized we have a roughly 50/50 chance to win, if they are a PUG it's more like 66/33. I have seen nothing to indicate that Clan vs IS has any indication or impact on win/loss chances. Keep in mind that several of the better comp teams have contracted with the Clans, at least for now.

[Angel of Annihilation]

xe N on, on 19 December 2014 - 12:36 AM, said:

It is very easy.

I made a 7 days contract with Steiner. I did this, because I like the lore and I realy like playing IS mechs. However, since next to all competitive teams went Clans, currently it is quite unfun to play IS as small group or solo player.

However, as a clanner you just need 3 Stormcrows and 1 Timberwolf. I already have 3 stormcrows mastered and using the Timberwolf prime trial mech I can easily join the clanners next week.

As IS player, I can just advice to switch factions until there are no or few IS player left and CW is failing. Then we will probably have some match making option to prevent another winning team joining.

I think you hit the nail on the head with your first paragraph, most of the competitive Units went Clan. This is what I am seeing as a Clanner anyway.

What I have seen so far is that there is very few good IS units with the key words being "very few". As for the rest of the IS units, they are a bunch of casuals grouping for fun. However when you do run into those strong IS units, it isn't a walk in the park for the Clan, in fact on many occasions it was like walking into a brick wall.

However, this is causing alot of IS players to wrongly believe there is a tech imbalance going on when it is actually mostly unit quality that is winning battles.

Don't believe me, seriously just go check out the Clan Wolf section of the Faction Forums and look at the Tourman threads. We have 4-5 Galaxies (Units) based on Lore running about 100+ members each plus another 3-4 Galaxies losely based on lore or not quite time line specific. The leadership of each of these Galaxies also communicate and coordinate with each other fairly consistently in order to work toward a common goal. Also all the major units in the Clan keep a sort of council in order to keep focused and moving forward. Honestly I just don't see this sort of coordination coming from the IS side and they also seem to be broken into a million and one relatively small and generally ineffective (in the grand scheme) units. Also while the Clans are mostly focused on working together (mostly because there is a bit of infighting but not alot), you have Davion out there trying to gobble up Liao instead of dropping defensively in FRR,Kurita and Steiner space.

So seriously don't blame the technology when a very large portion of Clan success is due to its strong and dedicated community.

[Triordinant]

Almond Brown, on 19 December 2014 - 10:39 AM, said:

After launching only 7 days ago which included 1 major update, wtf should/could they be doing about it?

This is why I'm not playing CW until it's out of Beta. Beta is when they find out what needs fixing and I don't need the hassle of being a guinea pig while they take the weeks or months to figure it out and fix it. Let's see what it looks like after they end Beta and reset everything.

[Grendel408]

Davion units are working together... at least a coalition of us merc units loyal/contracted to Davion.

Not all the Comp Teams went Clan... most did because they love meta... have elitism mentalities... and are honestly some of the rudest players I've met yet in MWO. That being said...

CW is about tactics and teamwork... if one team can pull that off while the other runs around like a PUG match... well, guess who's gonna win that round? CW is creating a new meta for people to learn... new balance in defense objectives, and the like. CW is end-game serious **** and if some don't understand that and play for fun... expect some disappointment along the way.

[Scoops Kerensky]

I think the meta of 'best' mechs will have to shift before you see a shift in competitive teams leaving clans.

Timber wolves and Stormcrows are considered far and away the best of their class in the heavy and medium departments. Light IS mechs are considered better than clanner lights, but the medium/heavy combo, and that heavy is the most played/versatile weight class I think has tilted things in favor of clans.

I'm not sure what the answer is to that, but I believe that's the closest answer you'll get at the moment for why so many of the more competitive groups have shifted clanner.

[LordKnightFandragon]

Almond Brown, on 19 December 2014 - 10:39 AM, said:

After launching only 7 days ago which included 1 major update, wtf should/could they be doing about it?

Expand the avenues of attack beyond 2 doors? Boreal Vault, ive gone to it twice, small amount, I know, but still....it was a horrid ass whipping on the part of the poor FRR guys who attacked us...48-20some and 48-17...It kinda stems from the fact that there is only 2 spots to get in the base.

You know the scenes in Stalingrad movies where the Russians charge the enemy line with thier own commisars behind them? Yeah, its basically that in CW on attack....1 avenue of approach, into fixed guns.......and you wonder why you lose? lol....

Its less to do with clans and more to do with map design. Any idiot can sit and shoot one door......

When I went on Sulpher, we were kicking the **** out of clanners we were facing, we had them like 40-20some, but in the end, they were able to kill our guns. The gun is closer,there is better cover into the base and there is 3 gates that are spread out that the defense needs to pay attention to.

I would be curious to see the W/L on Boreal Attack vs Sulpher Attack and the Defense on both as well.

Borreal is prolly an overwhelming Defensive win while Sulpher is likely alot closer....

Edited by LordKnightFandragon, 19 December 2014 - 11:45 AM.

[Scoops Kerensky]

Morritse Messorem Kotare, on 19 December 2014 - 11:43 AM, said:

NOT TRUE. I play in a unit which switches between clan and IS. if any side has the advantage, it's IS. The lights mechs are so far superior and are game changers. The right quirked out IS mechs, (thunderbolts awesomes cicadas dragons trebuchets) are far superior to clan mechs. More range, more firepower, more DPS, and run cooler.

The only reason Clan might win most of the time is because those who are more dedicated (better) to the game are more likely to play clan.

You're right that the thunderbolt ER PPC and gauss jaegers are catching on, I think that's still filtering through to everyone at the moment though.

[100mile]

Tactics Tactics Tactics....Yes it is hard on the Clan border's...Units are shifting to other Factions to try and stem the tide...The thing is kills are not what you should be looking at....If you are attacking or counter attacking you need to worry less about taking a mech down and more about dropping turrets and Generators...

[Artifact]

Please.

The IS quirks are hugely imbalancing. Try facing a gun line of 12 Thunderbolts with rapid fire ERPPCs. It sucks.

[Master Pain]

Morritse Messorem Kotare, on 19 December 2014 - 11:43 AM, said:

NOT TRUE. I play in a unit which switches between clan and IS. if any side has the advantage, it's IS. The lights mechs are so far superior and are game changers. The right quirked out IS mechs, (thunderbolts awesomes cicadas dragons trebuchets) are far superior to clan mechs. More range, more firepower, more DPS, and run cooler.

The only reason Clan might win most of the time is because those who are more dedicated (better) to the game are more likely to play clan.

I don't know what game you are playing, but it's not the same one I am. In the game I'm playing, clan mechs are smashing the crap out of IS mechs. I doesn't matter if it's pug v pug, group v group, or group v pug. Every match clan vs IS that I have been in has ended with the clan team over running us in 10 minutes or spawn camping us till the last mech was destroyed. Its not even close to balanced.

[Master Pain]

I have been winning about 66% of my matches IS vs IS. I havent won a single IS vs clan match yet. Not one of the matches was even close.