20517 replies to this topic

[Odanan]

OK, starting in the end of the next week we will have the announcement of the next IS mech. What one it will be? Shoot!


PS: my guess is Longbow or Wasp.

[Steinar Bergstol]

Putting my money on Crusader since PGI has had a light-mech-phobia for a while now, and for most people the CRD is better known and trades more on nostalgia value than the Longbow.

[xVLFBERHxT]

I go for the charger PLUS hatamoto for the kuritas out there . If an assault is not possible, i buy a dervish or an assasin. I quote sarna for bishob here : "The Assassin is a BattleMech that began life because of corporate ambitions and successful lobbyists."

Edited by TrapJaw80, 25 August 2016 - 03:49 AM.

[Odanan]

TrapJaw80, on 25 August 2016 - 03:48 AM, said:

I go for the charger PLUS hatamoto for the kuritas out there . If an assault is not possible, i buy a dervish or an assasin. I quote sarna for bishob here : "The Assassin is a BattleMech that began life because of corporate ambitions and successful lobbyists."

Charger or Assassin would be extremely cool...

[Bishop Steiner]

Odanan, on 25 August 2016 - 02:55 AM, said:

OK, starting in the end of the next week we will have the announcement of the next IS mech. What one it will be? Shoot!


PS: my guess is Longbow or Wasp.

ASSASSIN

Ok, that's the fanboi in me talking.

Reality? I'd say Crusader, as they have an easier time selling Heavies and Assaults, due to "perceived value" than Lights, and possibly low end mediums.

I think the Longbow is an example of a small but vocal contingent, as I never recall it really being a "fan favorite".

Crusader though was a "staple" mech, so that is most likely.

But I would be very happy with Charger, Thug, Crusader, Assassin, Vulcan or a Stinger/Wasp two pack. (Two pack which won't happen because it takes just as much time and effort to model a Light as an Assault)

Only other pre 3055 mech that might interest me would be the Mongoose, but it's basically just another Death Snail, realistically. Now on the off chance they aren't concerned with HBS model sharing anymore, then one could toss in the Jackal or a few others.

[Metus regem]

The only problem for narrowing it down, is Russ used the term "fan favorite", now depending on the target demographic he is using for "fan favorite", mean it could be a lot of different mechs...

Wasp
Stinger
Valkyrie
Assassin
Bushwacker
Uziel
Crusader
Thug
Charger
Hammerhands
Hatamoto
Longbow
Nightstar
Thunderhawk
Annihilator
Devastator


These have all been mechs that have been mentioned numerous times over many threads, so with out knowing his criteria, it's hard to speculate. Now I have my preferences, being Stinger/Wasp, Bushwacker, Crusader and Devastator. Now if I had to pick just one (for MWO only) I'd go with the Bushwacker, but for model sharing with HBS, I'd go with Stinger/Wasp, as they share a lot of assets with the Phoenix Hawk.

[Bishop Steiner]

Metus regem, on 25 August 2016 - 08:17 AM, said:

Assassin
Bushwacker
Crusader
Charger
Nightstar
Annihilator
Devastator

pretty sure (for sundry reasons) that we can narrow it down to something in that part of your list. And they'd have to be even more tone deaf to the community than usual to go for an Assault, IMO. (And much as I love annihilators, I just don't see them being good in MWO)

[Metus regem]

Bishop Steiner, on 25 August 2016 - 08:28 AM, said:

pretty sure (for sundry reasons) that we can narrow it down to something in that part of your list. And they'd have to be even more tone deaf to the community than usual to go for an Assault, IMO. (And much as I love annihilators, I just don't see them being good in MWO)

Well if we prune the list down to knock out lights, and low end mediums, as well as bad assaults, and lets use 1.2 for engine cap for all mechs that 'stand a chance'...

Bushwacker (likely 330 engine cap)
Crusader (likely 310/315 engine cap)
Charger (likely 380/385 - 400 engine cap)
Nightstar (likely 340 or 345 engine cap)
Devastator (likely 360 engine cap)

So with engine caps out of the way, it will all come down to what PGI thinks they can milk for the most... now there is a large bit of nostalgia attached to the Bushwacker, from MW3, MW4, MC and MC2, while the Crusader pulls from the TT crowed, that I think a lot of them have left MWO by now... how ever the Crusader does have the advantage of another source of revenue in the form of HBS battletech, it is a mech that would be found in that era of the game.

So my refined list is narrowed down to:

Bushwacker
Crusader

[Bishop Steiner]

Metus regem, on 25 August 2016 - 08:51 AM, said:

Well if we prune the list down to knock out lights, and low end mediums, as well as bad assaults, and lets use 1.2 for engine cap for all mechs that 'stand a chance'...

Bushwacker (likely 330 engine cap)
Crusader (likely 310/315 engine cap)
Charger (likely 380/385 - 400 engine cap)
Nightstar (likely 340 or 345 engine cap)
Devastator (likely 360 engine cap)

So with engine caps out of the way, it will all come down to what PGI thinks they can milk for the most... now there is a large bit of nostalgia attached to the Bushwacker, from MW3, MW4, MC and MC2, while the Crusader pulls from the TT crowed, that I think a lot of them have left MWO by now... how ever the Crusader does have the advantage of another source of revenue in the form of HBS battletech, it is a mech that would be found in that era of the game.

So my refined list is narrowed down to:

Bushwacker
Crusader

Yup. And I'd probably lean on the Crusader because of the HBS connection, the TT connection, overall prevalence of heavies and the HG Unseen connection.

With PGI making up variants willy nilly, the Bushwacker is not out of the running like it once was, but I don't think it has as much going for it. Uziel would be more enticing if single missile hardpoints were remotely worth anything, but even with inflation at best you get what, 2x SRM4? Big whoop. Charger, Assassin I think are both example of vocal minority choices, etc.

So yeah, my money would still be on Crusader.

Of course, I always sucked at the Lotto, so my money probably don't mean much.

[Metus regem]

Bishop Steiner, on 25 August 2016 - 09:20 AM, said:

Yup. And I'd probably lean on the Crusader because of the HBS connection, the TT connection, overall prevalence of heavies and the HG Unseen connection.

With PGI making up variants willy nilly, the Bushwacker is not out of the running like it once was, but I don't think it has as much going for it. Uziel would be more enticing if single missile hardpoints were remotely worth anything, but even with inflation at best you get what, 2x SRM4? Big whoop. Charger, Assassin I think are both example of vocal minority choices, etc.

So yeah, my money would still be on Crusader.

Of course, I always sucked at the Lotto, so my money probably don't mean much.

The Uziel in stock config is under armoured, mounting a LB-2x, LPL, ERML, 2 x ERSL, SRM6, 300xl, endo steel, 6 JJ's and 1 extra DHS, this leaves it with 7-8t of standard armour depending on how much ammo it's packing, of an efficent maximum of 10.5t

So for me, the Uziel is a complete dead end for PGI, as they would have to invent all the variants, since they all use tech not in game, mind you it would be an excuse for them to just devlop entirely custom mechs from the ground up...

At least with the Bushwacker it has three variants that use current tech.... Not to mention she would have a very narrow CT, if done right, yes making it hard to use an XL in it, but super tanky for a medium if running a standard.

For fun, let's hypothesize the hard point count on a Bushwacker, with a reasonable level of inflation...


Stock Hardpoints:

LA: 1M
LT: 1M 1B
CT: 1E
RT: 1B
RA: 1B

Reasonable inflation hard points:

LA: 2M
LT: 2M 2B
CT: 2E
RT: 2B
RA: 2B

[Bishop Steiner]

Metus regem, on 25 August 2016 - 09:41 AM, said:

The Uziel in stock config is under armoured, mounting a LB-2x, LPL, ERML, 2 x ERSL, SRM6, 300xl, endo steel, 6 JJ's and 1 extra DHS, this leaves it with 7-8t of standard armour depending on how much ammo it's packing, of an efficent maximum of 10.5t

So for me, the Uziel is a complete dead end for PGI, as they would have to invent all the variants, since they all use tech not in game, mind you it would be an excuse for them to just devlop entirely custom mechs from the ground up...

At least with the Bushwacker it has three variants that use current tech.... Not to mention she would have a very narrow CT, if done right, yes making it hard to use an XL in it, but super tanky for a medium if running a standard.

For fun, let's hypothesize the hard point count on a Bushwacker, with a reasonable level of inflation...


Stock Hardpoints:

LA: 1M
LT: 1M 1B
CT: 1E
RT: 1B
RA: 1B

Reasonable inflation hard points:

LA: 2M
LT: 2M 2B
CT: 2E
RT: 2B
RA: 2B

Well, TBH, the "stock" uziel, for me will always be the MW4 verison not the really stupidly designed one that was later canonized in the TRO 3067. the 2S is actually a ton of fun.... in MW4. But in MW4 a single SSRM6 was a nice shortrange punch to have. In MWO it's a spitwad launcher.

but 97 kph, max jumpy, 2 PPC, SRM6 and 2 MG Uziel IMO gives more interesting variety... though the ballistics only really shine if you have RAC2s... which, of course, we don't. But I do miss my clan teched up, 2x C-ERPPC, 1x SSRM6 Uziel.

Looked great, fought better. Was my Medium of choice in all MW4 titles. Sadly, as I noted (and you concur) in MWO it would be far less impressive.

[Metus regem]

Bishop Steiner, on 25 August 2016 - 10:02 AM, said:

Well, TBH, the "stock" uziel, for me will always be the MW4 verison not the really stupidly designed one that was later canonized in the TRO 3067. the 2S is actually a ton of fun.... in MW4. But in MW4 a single SSRM6 was a nice shortrange punch to have. In MWO it's a spitwad launcher.

but 97 kph, max jumpy, 2 PPC, SRM6 and 2 MG Uziel IMO gives more interesting variety... though the ballistics only really shine if you have RAC2s... which, of course, we don't. But I do miss my clan teched up, 2x C-ERPPC, 1x SSRM6 Uziel.

Looked great, fought better. Was my Medium of choice in all MW4 titles. Sadly, as I noted (and you concur) in MWO it would be far less impressive.

Well the Uziel wouldn't be Phoenix Hawk / Vindicator levels of suck (by the perception of the vast majority of MWO), but it is a limited platform to take advantage of Guass, AC/10, AC/5 or UAC/5, this is mostly due to the weights of those pieces of equipment... one would be hard pressed to cram those into a Uziel with out some major concessions and compromises.

If the UZL-2S was put into MWO, the hard points might look like this, if I had to guess:

LA: 2E
LT: 2B
CT: 2M
RT: 2B
RA: 2E

Now taking to something that might be useable in MWO:

LA: 2 MLas
LT: 1 DHS
CT: 2 JJ
RT: 1 UAC/5, 3t UAC/5 ammo
RA: 2 MLas
LL: 2JJ
RL: 2JJ

13 DHS

This is of-course keeping the stock 300XL engine, Endo and up armoring it to 10t of standard armour... But you can already mimic that load out with the GRAY DEATH... AC/2 ammo for the extra JJ's.

So in closeing, it might be okay, not a fantastic game changer, and depending on ones attachment to the Uziel, perhaps not even a fantastic money maker.... but it does have one advantage, it does have a named Hero mech, that uses tech not in game...

[Bishop Steiner]

Metus regem, on 25 August 2016 - 10:40 AM, said:

Well the Uziel wouldn't be Phoenix Hawk / Vindicator levels of suck (by the perception of the vast majority of MWO), but it is a limited platform to take advantage of Guass, AC/10, AC/5 or UAC/5, this is mostly due to the weights of those pieces of equipment... one would be hard pressed to cram those into a Uziel with out some major concessions and compromises.

If the UZL-2S was put into MWO, the hard points might look like this, if I had to guess:

LA: 2E
LT: 2B
CT: 2M
RT: 2B
RA: 2E

Now taking to something that might be useable in MWO:

LA: 2 MLas
LT: 1 DHS
CT: 2 JJ
RT: 1 UAC/5, 3t UAC/5 ammo
RA: 2 MLas
LL: 2JJ
RL: 2JJ

13 DHS

This is of-course keeping the stock 300XL engine, Endo and up armoring it to 10t of standard armour... But you can already mimic that load out with the GRAY DEATH... AC/2 ammo for the extra JJ's.

So in closeing, it might be okay, not a fantastic game changer, and depending on ones attachment to the Uziel, perhaps not even a fantastic money maker.... but it does have one advantage, it does have a named Hero mech, that uses tech not in game...

Eh, as I said...good mech in MW4. Not a game changer in MWO.


LA: 2E
LT: 1B
CT: 2M
RT: 1B
RA: 2E

I think would be more the realistic hardpoints... though MWO being MWO they might very well give it single E points in each arm, and the double hardpoints in the MGs.... *SMH*

But 10 hardpoints of mixed seems unlikely, though not impossible.

Regardless, I don't think the Bushwacker has a chance to be what the fanbois dream of, either.
LA: 2E
LT: 1B
CT: 2M
RT: 1B
RA: 2E

[Metus regem]

Bishop Steiner, on 25 August 2016 - 11:05 AM, said:

Regardless, I don't think the Bushwacker has a chance to be what the fanbois dream of, either.

I'd be fine with it, with just the basic non hard point inflation of the Bushwacker:

LA: 1M
LT: 1M 1B
CT: 1E
RT: 1B
RA: 1B

Those torso hard points would all be just under the cockpit.. I'd mount in it:

1 x AC/10 + 2t ammo (RT)
2 x SRM4 + 1t ammo(LA, LT)
1 x MLas (CT)
275 standard, Endo Max armour

I think it'd be a tough little brawler.....

[Bishop Steiner]

Metus regem, on 25 August 2016 - 11:22 AM, said:

I'd be fine with it, with just the basic non hard point inflation of the Bushwacker:

LA: 1M
LT: 1M 1B
CT: 1E
RT: 1B
RA: 1B

Those torso hard points would all be just under the cockpit.. I'd mount in it:

1 x AC/10 + 2t ammo (RT)
2 x SRM4 + 1t ammo(LA, LT)
1 x MLas (CT)
275 standard, Endo Max armour

I think it'd be a tough little brawler.....

it's the tough part I have my doubts on.

[Metus regem]

Bishop Steiner, on 25 August 2016 - 12:10 PM, said:

it's the tough part I have my doubts on.

Still 55t, one could shift the AC/10 to the LT, then use the entire RT and RA as a shield, due to the shape of the mech, I'd expect it to be Crab / Marauder / Stalker like for hit boxes, with it being only a little larger than the Crab by about 10% total more volume. What I mean by that is, at 55t it can only take so much of a beating, but I think it could take a fare beating all things concidered.

[TheArisen]

Metus regem, on 25 August 2016 - 08:17 AM, said:

The only problem for narrowing it down, is Russ used the term "fan favorite", now depending on the target demographic he is using for "fan favorite", mean it could be a lot of different mechs...

Wasp
Stinger
Valkyrie
Assassin
Bushwacker
Uziel
Crusader
Thug
Charger
Hammerhands
Hatamoto
Longbow
Nightstar
Thunderhawk
Annihilator
Devastator


These have all been mechs that have been mentioned numerous times over many threads, so with out knowing his criteria, it's hard to speculate. Now I have my preferences, being Stinger/Wasp, Bushwacker, Crusader and Devastator. Now if I had to pick just one (for MWO only) I'd go with the Bushwacker, but for model sharing with HBS, I'd go with Stinger/Wasp, as they share a lot of assets with the Phoenix Hawk.

You could add a couple mechs to your list such as the Javelin & Pillager but as you mention in a later post PGI isn't keen on light mechs. (I think they could offset the perceived value by releasing an extra variant or two)

If I put aside my own desires I'd guess we'll be getting the Crusader because it's a top tier unseen. The Bushwhacker is also a strong contender but I think they'll favour a mech that can be used in HBS's game.

Metus regem, on 25 August 2016 - 12:42 PM, said:

Still 55t, one could shift the AC/10 to the LT, then use the entire RT and RA as a shield, due to the shape of the mech, I'd expect it to be Crab / Marauder / Stalker like for hit boxes, with it being only a little larger than the Crab by about 10% total more volume. What I mean by that is, at 55t it can only take so much of a beating, but I think it could take a fare beating all things concidered.

For the Bwhacker to be successful it'd need to be.

[C E Dwyer]

Well if it's another Unseen I will be at varying levels of yay to Wow, even knowing that some will suck in the game,unless it's the LongBow, which will be a meh moment.

Outside of that

Assassin would be a big yay
Vulcan I would also like, though the 3D team seem very reluctant to put curves on mechs, and without its sphere head, it for me at least makes the addition of it pointless.

Whitworth, a really average mech, I'd like, but falls well outside a 'fan favourite' as does the clint, we have a mech with bear cub ears , why not hang dog ears.

Lights if they ever do another and it isn't the Wasp, the Javelin I'd push out money.

Charger, well if it looks good I'd spend money but with the addition of the Cyc, i'm glutted with I.S assaults and don't see the point in it.

That pretty much ends my list of mechs I would buy, unless Alex and the design team make a stunner, as i'm not a fan of cultural mechs and power ranger types

The cringing part of me is wondering if this 'fan favourite' will be the Annilator low engine cap making it next to useless, even in pug quick play or Madcat 2 as it was sold to both, and depending on which fluff you believe The I.S had it first

Edited by Cathy, 25 August 2016 - 02:05 PM.

[FLG 01]

Cathy, on 25 August 2016 - 01:56 PM, said:

Charger, well if it looks good I'd spend money but with the addition of the Cyc, i'm glutted with I.S assaults and don't see the point in it.

For me it's the Speed. I would love to have an 80 ton Mech with XL400.

Cathy, on 25 August 2016 - 01:56 PM, said:

Madcat 2 as it was sold to both, and depending on which fluff you believe The I.S had it first

Well, what matters in MWO is the techbase not the faction availability. The Daishi (Dire Wolf) e.g. was produced in the Inner Sphere since the late 3040ies and made available to IS powers in 3051, albeit in tiny numbers. Yet noone would add the Daishi to the IS in MWO... (rightly so).

[jss78]

Probably the "wrong" reasons, but I'm kind of indifferent as long as it's one of the 3025-era staples. Nostalgia, and because of HBS's current work being in that time frame.

I don't even care that much which 3025-era 'mech. Crusader I'd love, also Stinger/Wasp. Dervish, Javelin both nice, and ANY of the several missing 40-tonners from 3025 I'd like. Charger I agree would be fun, and reasonably different as far as assaults go. And there's a macabre interest because you KNOW some lorehound will be running the base variant in the stock loadout.