20517 replies to this topic

[John MatriX82]

Bishop Steiner, on 25 December 2013 - 07:08 AM, said:

A mod of the Summoner's concept art, started by Tyberion (fixing the legs) and finished by me (making the cockpit less "bubble-y" and the arm laser less weird, and of course, proper paint)

Apologize for the slop, but the image is pretty low res, so......

You don't have to apologize, good work

I miss Hellbringer and Summoner from MW4.. I was thinking just yesterday that the above could be one of the few Clanmechs with some high-torso-mounted hardpoints.

Because considering most of the other announced clanmechs (enlight me you TT masters!) I think that probably only the Dire Wolf has some chance of high-mounted torso weaponry along with the Summoner.. the majority of the other Clanmechs all have weaponry in the arms.

So taking out that we won't be able to change armor values or core loadouts.. Oh well I was thinking that reading what PGI wants to do with the Clans, these mechs won't be so competitive as they should.
I mean, most of them have to expose entirely in order to shoot, won't have armor shifted in the front and the weapons will be "IS-ized".. a 4PPC stalker (take away ghost heat) imho will fare a better survivability than a Warhawk that has those weapons in low-mounted arms..

[Bishop Steiner]

John MatriX82, on 25 December 2013 - 12:38 PM, said:

You don't have to apologize, good work

I miss Hellbringer and Summoner from MW4.. I was thinking just yesterday that the above could be one of the few Clanmechs with some high-torso-mounted hardpoints.

Because considering most of the other announced clanmechs (enlight me you TT masters!) I think that probably only the Dire Wolf has some chance of high-mounted torso weaponry along with the Summoner.. the majority of the other Clanmechs all have weaponry in the arms.

So taking out that we won't be able to change armor values or core loadouts.. Oh well I was thinking that reading what PGI wants to do with the Clans, these mechs won't be so competitive as they should.
I mean, most of them have to expose entirely in order to shoot, won't have armor shifted in the front and the weapons will be "IS-ized".. a 4PPC stalker (take away ghost heat) imho will fare a better survivability than a Warhawk that has those weapons in low-mounted arms..

it's possible, but the Warhawk also starts with going 16 kph faster, and has a targeting computer, which even without knowing the details, you have to assume will mean something. And the fact it can actually survive using an XL engine, and it can pack in more DHS because they only take up 2 crits.

[John MatriX82]

Bishop Steiner, on 25 December 2013 - 07:13 PM, said:

it's possible, but the Warhawk also starts with going 16 kph faster, and has a targeting computer, which even without knowing the details, you have to assume will mean something. And the fact it can actually survive using an XL engine, and it can pack in more DHS because they only take up 2 crits.

As far as I've read in their intentions, you won't be able to add further DHSs than the stock ones. So the Warhawk may stay @ 20 DHS. Hopefully they'll balance the thing out making that Clan DHS cool 1.6 or 1.8x, but even there, not being able to shift or change armor values is going to cripple the Clans..

[Devil Fox]

John MatriX82, on 26 December 2013 - 03:14 AM, said:

As far as I've read in their intentions, you won't be able to add further DHSs than the stock ones. So the Warhawk may stay @ 20 DHS. Hopefully they'll balance the thing out making that Clan DHS cool 1.6 or 1.8x, but even there, not being able to shift or change armor values is going to cripple the Clans..

Actually the armour values on everything but the Thor and Kit Fox are pretty good. Their almost 95% fully armoured, the distribution is just a touch heavier on the rear then what the players have determined is optimal (20 instead of the 14-18 value range), but given their faster speeds it can and will be used to absorb damage.

The Kit Fox though is amorued as bad as a full locust, it's just pop I think, and the Thor is lacking pretty much leg and CT frontal armour that will make it extremely vulnerable to legging or coring if stock. It will be the ability to load-out the mech and equipment (if DHS are considered fixed per chassis or if we can add to the base chassis numbers) that determine the majority of clan mech's survival on the field.

[Bishop Steiner]

John MatriX82, on 26 December 2013 - 03:14 AM, said:

As far as I've read in their intentions, you won't be able to add further DHSs than the stock ones. So the Warhawk may stay @ 20 DHS. Hopefully they'll balance the thing out making that Clan DHS cool 1.6 or 1.8x, but even there, not being able to shift or change armor values is going to cripple the Clans..

Incorrect, I believe. Because all many of the omnis add them in their omni slots. Their base number (15 for the Timberwolf, for instance) will be locked, along with the armor and engine. Extras can be added though, otherwise half the configurations are invalidated. And the Warhawk has plenty of armor, as do the vast majority of clan mechs. The Kitfox? Well, it's definitely gonna be packing it's Gauss, because it won't be able to afford to get close.

[John MatriX82]

Bishop Steiner, on 26 December 2013 - 04:48 AM, said:

Incorrect, I believe. Because all many of the omnis add them in their omni slots. Their base number (15 for the Timberwolf, for instance) will be locked, along with the armor and engine. Extras can be added though, otherwise half the configurations are invalidated. And the Warhawk has plenty of armor, as do the vast majority of clan mechs. The Kitfox? Well, it's definitely gonna be packing it's Gauss, because it won't be able to afford to get close.

So you won't be able to remove stock DHSs but you can add more.. i see.

[Bishop Steiner]

John MatriX82, on 26 December 2013 - 05:11 AM, said:

So you won't be able to remove stock DHSs but you can add more.. i see.

yep. which is good, I guess, since let's face it, unless you only use Gauss you can never have enough DHS...... it's like MWO's answer to cowbell!

[Khanahar]

I'm honesty just worried about my Thor. It's my favorite Clan Mech, but its armor values leave a lot to be desired, and I don't want to blow 30 bucks on it for it to be dead in the water.

[Odanan]

Khanahar, on 27 December 2013 - 10:17 AM, said:

I'm honesty just worried about my Thor. It's my favorite Clan Mech, but its armor values leave a lot to be desired, and I don't want to blow 30 bucks on it for it to be dead in the water.

I will wait until the Clan mechs are playable to consider bying an A La Carte (Timber Wolf, Warhawk or Direwolf). Of course, depending on how much PGI will destroy this game with the Clan implementation, I won't buy it at all.

For me, nerfing the Clan weapons is a terrible solution. IS flamers, LRMs, SRMs, pulse lasers... if they can't balance these, I can't imagine how bad they will do with Clan tech.

My proposal would be keep the Clan tech as it is and make 10 Clanners vs. 16 IS battles.

[FireSlade]

Odanan, on 27 December 2013 - 10:51 AM, said:

My proposal would be keep the Clan tech as it is and make 10 Clanners vs. 16 IS battles.

What happens if the IS forces use clan mechs and vice versa?

[Odanan]

FireSlade, on 27 December 2013 - 11:27 AM, said:

What happens if the IS forces use clan mechs and vice versa?

IS won't use Clan mechs for several years to come, and even so, only a very few exclusive mechwarriors have these mechs (like Ohiro Kurita, Victor Steiner Davion).

Clans don't use IS tech.

Why should the game allow IS player to play with Clan mechs and vice versa?

[Odanan]

Anyway, for non CW playing, they could just make the matches of Clans mechs vs. IS mechs, no matter the pilots.

[Khanahar]

Yeah. Puretech with numerical difference seems to me like it would be a lot better. I actually had a whole idea for the implementation a while ago (linked in my sig) with a model to have expert pilots be able to Clan as much as they want, and everybody getting some chance to play them.

My preference would actually be for 5 v 12s with superior Clan tonnage-per-mech or 10 v 12s with single respawn for IS.

The superior Clan tonnage-per-mech thing I still feel... Clan heavies are dramatically more iconic and popular than other weight classes (assaults in second). I did a (sorta) poll of this at one point, with the expected results: all 4 of the original Clan heavies are really, really popular.

Though the Loki is gonna be sadly DoA in MWO if you can't change armor. And who even knows what the A-Pod solution is gonna be...

[FireSlade]

Odanan, on 27 December 2013 - 11:45 AM, said:

IS won't use Clan mechs for several years to come, and even so, only a very few exclusive mechwarriors have these mechs (like Ohiro Kurita, Victor Steiner Davion).

Clans don't use IS tech.

Why should the game allow IS player to play with Clan mechs and vice versa?

I am for any way to balance the clans with the IS but I highly doubt PGI will put a hard lock to IS forces using clan tech and vice versa when that could cost them sales. 3rd person basically told us that when it comes to potential sales > hardcore fan base. I see them nerfing the clans into the ground and adding some complicated and little mentioned rules like ghost heat to balance them without addressing key concerns that heat will basically neuter them because IS mechs will run cooler allowing for greater DPS. So only the best players will be able to do anything with them while the lesser players will stick with IS tech for easier kills. After all this drops how much that you want to bet that the only ones using clan tech are the hardcore clanners, like me? Look at all the fear from XL engines and armor distributions that are popping up all over and yet we still have no clue how things are going to turn out. Watch that this is all a part of PGI's plan to keep IS tech from becoming obsolete.

[Phoenix Branson]

Odanan, on 27 December 2013 - 10:51 AM, said:

My proposal would be keep the Clan tech as it is and make 10 Clanners vs. 16 IS battles.

I like this solution...

Inner Sphere vs. Inner Sphere: 12 vs. 12 (3 Lances vs. 3 Lances) = 24 BattleMechs

Inner Sphere vs. Clan: 16 vs. 10 (4 Lances vs. 2 Stars) = 26 BattleMechs

Clan vs. Clan: 10 vs. 10 (2 Stars vs. 2 Stars) = 20 BattleMechs

Edited by Maverick01, 27 December 2013 - 01:10 PM.

[SgtMagor]

if there is no ghost heat and weapon nerfs to kill the Clan mechs off, then I like the 4 lance vs 2 star idea.

[Odanan]

Khanahar, on 27 December 2013 - 12:10 PM, said:

Yeah. Puretech with numerical difference seems to me like it would be a lot better. I actually had a whole idea for the implementation a while ago (linked in my sig) with a model to have expert pilots be able to Clan as much as they want, and everybody getting some chance to play them.

My preference would actually be for 5 v 12s with superior Clan tonnage-per-mech or 10 v 12s with single respawn for IS.

The superior Clan tonnage-per-mech thing I still feel... Clan heavies are dramatically more iconic and popular than other weight classes (assaults in second). I did a (sorta) poll of this at one point, with the expected results: all 4 of the original Clan heavies are really, really popular.

Though the Loki is gonna be sadly DoA in MWO if you can't change armor. And who even knows what the A-Pod solution is gonna be...

A-Pod = more armor? (hopefully)

EDIT: or a pair of DHS in the legs.

Edited by Odanan, 27 December 2013 - 06:06 PM.

[SgtMagor]

Banshee for Baby New year Hero

BNC-5S Vandergriff A custom BNC-5S piloted by Solaris VII duelist Victor Vandergriff during the Solaris riots. The weapon loadout is similar to a standard BNC-5S. Two ER PPCs are the main armaments, one mounted in the left arm and the other in the right torso. A LB-10X sits in the left torso. The two medium lasers of the original are retained in the left arm. The right arm contains a small SRM-4. Finally, four jump jets are added for increased mobility. BV (2.0) = 1,853^[26]

[Odanan]

Banshee will probably be added only in April or May...

[SgtMagor]

doh!, I need a reason to use my 128 days of prime time. A Banshee would be a good reason heh!