104 replies to this topic

[Chagatay]

KharnZor, on 22 December 2014 - 09:34 PM, said:

Join a unit or stick with the other game modes.

I play CW almost exclusively now (still will do for freebie stuff) and I am a solo dropper. Don't listen to the doom/gloom crowd:
"OOO you can't win they have a X man"

I tell you that you can win even with no groups against those people. Sure you may not win against the better groups but you can give them a good fight. Just communicate a general plan with your team or if you don't want to at least listen for a plan of action.

[Monkey Lover]

Let me guess the clans were on the defense almost all your matches? I have a feeling clan players are only selecting planets where they play defense.

[Aresye]

Viktor Drake, on 22 December 2014 - 07:08 PM, said:

My Pug record for CW is:

11 Wins, 16 losses.

8 of my Wins were Defend, 1 win was attack against turrets only and only 2 were legitimate attack wins (one was a straight up attrition win where we killed off all the defender mechs..fun as hell and the way all battles should be in my opinion).

Of these 11 wins, all 11 were against other PUGs. Against any team with one single group of 8 or more, 100% loss rate. Most of these wins also had my team with at least one single group of 6 or more players with the rest filled out by very small groups of 2-3 or solo Pugs.

From my statistics, it is obvious having at least a large portion of your team made up of at least one coordinated group is the key to victory. Also attacking as a PUG is suicide so expect to lose if you draw an attack or counter-attack as a PUG.

As a Clan Wolf player those organized large groups were probably mostly Comstar Irregulars, who are above what I would consider an average unit. Our 12mans had a hard enough time against their 12mans.

[MikeBend]

In defence of PUGs, i have to say, not everyone has enough time to be on permanent basis with the unit, many just play ocassionaly. Correct me if im wrong, but i guess half of the CW population are sub 4 groups +solo players. All this talk about "go join the unit or stfu, this game is for 12 mans" is arrogant at least. Most solo players will not join the units, deal with it. You want them gone? Happy wait imes, with half of players gone. You want them to stay? Suggest something, to stop 12man vs random pug stomps. Again, CW is losing players because of this "supposed to be hardcore" attitude. And if 12mans want challenge, why are they so against "let solo play vs solo" thing?

[MischiefSC]

Ran 12 matches against the Clans today. Won 11 of them. About half pugs, half with my group. The only one we lost was defending on Sulfur which is bordering on pointless against a coordinated attacker.

Gotta pugboss. Coordination doesn't need teamspeak, just a willingness to put in the effort. Be consistent, lay out a plan and make sure your team knows what drop 1-4 will look like before their first mech hits the ground. This lays the foundation for them understanding how and WHY they are fighting and dying.

I'll play against Clanners all day vs IS units.

[NextGame]

riverslq, on 22 December 2014 - 12:30 PM, said:

this fun.
all drops with pugs.
0/9. yay.
I'm enjoying this pgi.
either make pugs drop against pugs, or drop a few more premades in there.
this premade 10 vs random 12s just ain't working.

I've got a better idea, make players have to join a unit before dropping in CW so that they have no reason to whine bitterly about their punishing defeats!

[Tahribator]

If you pug in CW, you're volunteering to be mowed down and farmed by an organized team. It's definitely not meant to be a casual experience.

[Joseph Mallan]

riverslq, on 22 December 2014 - 12:30 PM, said:

this fun.
all drops with pugs.
0/9. yay.
I'm enjoying this pgi.
either make pugs drop against pugs, or drop a few more premades in there.
this premade 10 vs random 12s just ain't working.

You came to CW KNOWING it was Groups>PUGs and now you want to break CW. It was stated at the Launch part it will be this way.

It's rough on ego, its not easy to win unless you use the already found win methods. And it should not be made Random player friendly.

NextGame, on 23 December 2014 - 02:02 AM, said:

I've got a better idea, make players have to join a unit before dropping in CW so that they have no reason to whine bitterly about their punishing defeats!

No... I know group players who whine bitterly for losing. All it will do is take away ONE excuse to whine bitterly.

[GeistHrafn]

ANOTHER thread about this? Really?
Whatever your stance on this issue, take the time to check the forums for it, rather than just rage posting the same thing over and over again.

Edited by Rhazien, 23 December 2014 - 03:57 AM.

[Tastian]

InspectorG, on 22 December 2014 - 01:50 PM, said:

CW is not for Pugs.

Join a decent sized, or dedicated 4man unit.

GET ON TEAMSPEAK.

Enjoy wins.

The original maps used to be the same way: mixed PUGS vs 12 mans. Then they split it up between solo and group queue. There is NO reason in the world they can't do the same for CW. NONE.

[InspectorG]

Tastian, on 23 December 2014 - 05:49 AM, said:

There is NO reason in the world they can't do the same for CW. NONE.

Server space.

Man-hours spent on creating a whole new MM system.

Plus it would change the intended idea for CW: Units organizing. part of that is recruiting, training, communication, user interaction, as well as a larger game to be played in a war-type setting.

Pug CW would just be people either farming vs bads.

Or, people treating it like solo drop with 3 extra lives: TONS of camping for 30 minutes then lots of QQ about how, 'my team sucks!'

There is NO PURPOSE for solo CW. At least not till end-game content.

[Monkey Lover]

Rhazien, on 23 December 2014 - 03:55 AM, said:

ANOTHER thread about this? Really?
Whatever your stance on this issue, take the time to check the forums for it, rather than just rage posting the same thing over and over again.

It must be a problem then? I see no reason to allow 10-12 man teams to fight teams of solo players. Both sides dont have have a good game. One gets smashed rhe other just wastes time. Should call thiw ggclose mode not hqrdmode.

Edited by Monkey Lover, 23 December 2014 - 09:02 AM.

[DEMAX51]

Monkey Lover, on 23 December 2014 - 09:01 AM, said:

It must be a problem then? I see no reason to allow 10-12 man teams to fight teams of solo players. Both sides dont have have a good game. One gets smashed rhe other just wastes time. Should call thiw ggclose mode not hqrdmode.

I see a reason. Segregating the CW queue to solo/group like they did the Public queue would split the playerbase even more, and make it nearly impossible to launch CW matches in any sort of timeframe that would be acceptable.

We were told about a year ago that the CW queue was going to be like this. It shouldn't be a surprise to you.

[Monkey Lover]

DEMAX51, on 23 December 2014 - 09:30 AM, said:

I see a reason. Segregating the CW queue to solo/group like they did the Public queue would split the playerbase even more, and make it nearly impossible to launch CW matches in any sort of timeframe that would be acceptable.

We were told about a year ago that the CW queue was going to be like this. It shouldn't be a surprise to you.

year ago? Lol over the last year they changed the outlook of CW over and over.

So really your only reason is a solo smashing is still good enough game for you? For me lining up to fight a 12 man with solo people in trial mechs is not a game. It doesn't matter how fast it started.

As i post im sitting here with 12 people ready to fight a match but no one is showing up to fight us. Finding games is a system issue. Tell me where there is 12 other players ready to fight and i will go there. At the same time if you showed me what 12 people were waiting to fight me, i could skip fighting the 12 man teams too. Then the few people who wanted to fight them could.

Edited by Monkey Lover, 23 December 2014 - 09:40 AM.

[warner2]

The problem isn't Clans it's PUGs.

CW is for teams but at the same time it needs to be open to solo players. PGI is not going to ban solo players from part of the game. CW was always sold as solo players filling in the gaps to make up a full 12 whereas what seems to be happening is that a full, ready to go 12 man is jumping straight into a match against whoever is queueing even if it's a full PUG.

This swings both ways. Solo players need to group up to be more effective but in order to facilitate that PGI can't add the ability to group up with fellow faction players, not just unit players, soon enough. Also the match-maker needs to be pickier and it should be trying to put large groups against large groups.

Ultimately the onus is on the players to group up because it's a team game. I will not drop solo on a Clan border because I just end up wasting my time counter-attacking against a Clan 10 or 12 man, but that is OK because in reality in order to stand a chance in such a match I need to be in a group.

[Tastian]

DEMAX51, on 23 December 2014 - 09:30 AM, said:

I see a reason. Segregating the CW queue to solo/group like they did the Public queue would split the playerbase even more, and make it nearly impossible to launch CW matches in any sort of timeframe that would be acceptable.

We were told about a year ago that the CW queue was going to be like this. It shouldn't be a surprise to you.

So many people on the forums are saying that CW isn't for solo players. So, either the solo players play themselves or they don't play in CW? I don't understand the harm in letting them play themselves. It won't affect the group players. Either way, 12 mans stomping solos will just drive more solos away from MWO.

[DEMAX51]

Dude - I just explained the harm in the post you quoted - it would cause significantly longer wait-times to find a match, for everyone.

And I'm not saying "join a group or don't play." I'm saying "join a group, OR, do whatever you can to organize your PUGs, OR, get used to the results you've been seeing."

[ztac]

CW is not hard mode or any other mode really unless you consider fudged up as a mode. People say there is no population problem yet in the queue today there were maybe 50 players total in the morning,

The fact is that PGI still have a long way to go , but first they must realise the problems and fix them , unopposed games sould really only count as a fraction to a win , and they really need to sort out light rushes (not sure how these promote brawling which is something someone in PGI said they would like to promote in CW). Maybe they need to increase the lower mech tonnage yet again!

Maybe the problem lies with lights themselves as for too long they have got away with a sizeable amount of armour and hitpoints for something with small hitboxes and speed and the ability to fit large weapons, maybe the objectives need a light divider so that if a light mech hits them the damage is substancially reduced?

A lot of this I imagine is an inferiority complex that has grown among IS pilots despite all the tweaks on the IS side and nerfs on the clans... maybe if they just make clans paper then IS players will be happy!

[Monkey Lover]

warner2, on 23 December 2014 - 09:39 AM, said:

The problem isn't Clans it's PUGs.

CW is for teams but at the same time it needs to be open to solo players. PGI is not going to ban solo players from part of the game. CW was always sold as solo players filling in the gaps to make up a full 12 whereas what seems to be happening is that a full, ready to go 12 man is jumping straight into a match against whoever is queueing even if it's a full PUG.

This swings both ways. Solo players need to group up to be more effective but in order to facilitate that PGI can't add the ability to group up with fellow faction players, not just unit players, soon enough. Also the match-maker needs to be pickier and it should be trying to put large groups against large groups.

Ultimately the onus is on the players to group up because it's a team game. I will not drop solo on a Clan border because I just end up wasting my time counter-attacking against a Clan 10 or 12 man, but that is OK because in reality in order to stand a chance in such a match I need to be in a group.

Solo people can group all they want its rare to see any good mechs on the solo player sides. If they dont bring thunderbolts to fight off the timbers they're not goign to win.

Even IS v IS you get solo players with commandos and awesomes fighting 12 man teams with firestarters ,battle masters. Before they even started they are on the losing side.

Not even counting these solo player are still xping and saving up for modules lol

[warner2]

No, those are bad players. Don't confuse bad players with solo players.