58 replies to this topic

[Iqfish]

Rhazien, on 25 December 2014 - 04:09 PM, said:

Wait, I'm sorry... I'm having trouble digesting... ^^THIS is made with the same engine as MWO??!?
Did i mis-read, or mis-understand that? Someone please confirm for my sanity?

Its called Star Citizen and that screenshot is from 2012


This is up to date.



To be fair: CIG uses a modified version of the cryengine 3, but just to make sure physics and multiplayer works. The engine has this graphical potential, yes. But Star Citizen is planned to match 2016 high end hardware, so that is another thing.
But I don't think it would've hurt to increase the texture size of MWOs Mechs a little bit...

Edited by Iqfish, 25 December 2014 - 04:15 PM.

[Vassago Rain]

Rhazien, on 25 December 2014 - 04:09 PM, said:

Wait, I'm sorry... I'm having trouble digesting... ^^THIS is made with the same engine as MWO??!?
Did i mis-read, or mis-understand that? Someone please confirm for my sanity?

Yes.





But to be fair to both teams involved, starcitizen is being made many years after MWO, and is on a more modern version of the engine.

[GeistHrafn]

Mind = Blown.

I just watched some [REDACTED] claims crumble before my very eyes...

[Iqfish]

Vassago Rain, on 25 December 2014 - 04:14 PM, said:

But to be fair to both teams involved, starcitizen is being made many years after MWO, and is on a more modern version of the engine.

Yea and the CIG team is 6-7 times as big (is 44 on MWO still right?) and they have more money, more experience and more passion I guess.

But still, even if PGI didnt know how to write one line of HTML code, that is no reason for why they ignore community created content that much.

I even wrote Mr. Bullock on Twitter multiple times now (regarding the social pushing of fan videos -> Free Advertisement!) and even the support via e-mail. Well, no answer.
But I guess thats caused by my unpleasant past with them.

Rhazien, on 25 December 2014 - 04:22 PM, said:

Mind = Blown.

I just watched some [REDACTED] claims crumble before my very eyes...

I hope you understand the "tears" of many forum members, wether former or still active or active again (Hi Sandpit and Roadbeer! <3).
Some things PGI says just don't match the facts.

But since IGP is gone, that has improved a lot. And its understandable, since IGP always seemed like the typical dictator-publisher

Edited by Iqfish, 25 December 2014 - 04:25 PM.

[Vassago Rain]

Iqfish, on 25 December 2014 - 04:23 PM, said:

Yea and the CIG team is 6-7 times as big (is 44 on MWO still right?) and they have more money, more experience and more passion I guess.

But still, even if PGI didnt know how to write one line of HTML code, that is no reason for why they ignore community created content that much.

I even wrote Mr. Bullock on Twitter multiple times now (regarding the social pushing of fan videos -> Free Advertisement!) and even the support via e-mail. Well, no answer.
But I guess thats caused by my unpleasant past with them.



I hope you understand the "tears" of many forum members, wether former or still active or active again (Hi Sandpit and Roadbeer! <3).
Some things PGI says just don't match the facts.

But since IGP is gone, that has improved a lot. And its understandable, since IGP always seemed like the typical dictator-publisher

>unpleasant.
>one of a handful of guys still making fan creations.
>willing to give them 240 dollars for clan robots.

Yeah, unpleasant indeed.

You DARED demand that they actually incorporate support so you could play with more than 3 of your friends. Then you were quite rightfully upset during the transverse saga. The nerve!

[Iqfish]

Vassago Rain, on 25 December 2014 - 04:29 PM, said:

I love this picture, thank you.

And it's actually far over 700€, which is... more in $. So yea.
But like I said, give me a better alternative to MWO and I'll never visit this game again.

Edited by Iqfish, 25 December 2014 - 04:32 PM.

[Alienized]

the reason star citizen has evolved like this is pretty known.
if you gain billions after billions from people that wave money when they only hear who sits behind star citizen....
years before the game is actually available.... with that amount of money you can hire the best people rather easily.

now when i look at the prizes for stuff at star citizen and compare it with the packages here (apart from those stupid gold mechs) then i just shake my head. so many blind hype followers would even buy a golden pile of **** when it has *star citizen* painted on it.

not to mention that waling future robots will never be as popular than spaceships.



but community created maps would be awesome and i noticed some people can do that without effort

[Vassago Rain]

Aliisa White, on 25 December 2014 - 04:49 PM, said:

the reason star citizen has evolved like this is pretty known.
if you gain billions after billions from people that wave money when they only hear who sits behind star citizen....
years before the game is actually available.... with that amount of money you can hire the best people rather easily.

now when i look at the prizes for stuff at star citizen and compare it with the packages here (apart from those stupid gold mechs) then i just shake my head. so many blind hype followers would even buy a golden pile of **** when it has *star citizen* painted on it.

not to mention that waling future robots will never be as popular than spaceships.



but community created maps would be awesome and i noticed some people can do that without effort

Actually, MWO and SC have quite a few things in common.

During the crucial period june-august 2013, many, many games, for reasons that are known only to them, decided to enrage their core users. It wasn't a coincidence that august 2013 was when SC started growing for real.

[Alienized]

Vassago Rain, on 25 December 2014 - 04:57 PM, said:

Actually, MWO and SC have quite a few things in common.

During the crucial period june-august 2013, many, many games, for reasons that are known only to them, decided to enrage their core users. It wasn't a coincidence that august 2013 was when SC started growing for real.

yet SC and their devs had much more money to play with while MWO looks like a trip to hell moneywise since it will never have a large community no matter how good the game will be.

[Vassago Rain]

Aliisa White, on 25 December 2014 - 05:00 PM, said:

yet SC and their devs had much more money to play with while MWO looks like a trip to hell moneywise since it will never have a large community no matter how good the game will be.

MWO got 5.5 million in some 3 months sight unseen. It had a far better outlook than SC, being that it was made by

a) an already established developer, with already crewed offices and equipment.
b ) a million and one companies openly backing it. Remember the razr artemis joystick?
c) established brand.
d) mechwarrior is one of the core PC titles.
e) new, modernized F2P payment model! Pay what you want, whenever you want! Every item ever available for in-game money! We promise!
f) devlogs.

MWO has no business flopping about as hard as it has. It's kept alive by the remains of one of the most devoted fanbases of all time, and PGI is infamously poor at taking advantage of this fact.

I'll again highlight that it wasn't until The Great Betrayal of august 2013 that SC caught on. It wasn't a coincidence.

Edited by Vassago Rain, 25 December 2014 - 05:09 PM.

[Alienized]

Vassago Rain, on 25 December 2014 - 05:07 PM, said:

MWO got 5.5 million in some 3 months sight unseen. It had a far better outlook than SC, being that it was made by

a) an already established developer, with already crewed offices and equipment.
b ) a million and one companies openly backing it. Remember the razr artemis joystick?
c) established brand.
d) mechwarrior is one of the core PC titles.
e) new, modernized F2P payment model! Pay what you want, whenever you want! Every item ever available for in-game money! We promise!
f) devlogs.

MWO has no business flopping about as hard as it has. It's kept alive by the remains of one of the most devoted fanbases of all time, and PGI is infamously poor at taking advantage of this fact.

I'll again highlight that it wasn't until The Great Betrayal of august 2013 that SC caught on. It wasn't a coincidence.

given i dont know what happened there because i wasnt able to play mwo for a long time (blame my PC) but a new F2P payment model is not always a good thing....
all i see now is that PGI is doing better than ever since they dropped IGP.

Mechwarrior might be established but its not nearly as famous as Wing Commander.
maybe in the US or north america but not here in europe or the rest of the world.
ye i know what was behind MWO. all that nvidia stuff and so on.

and again i agree that the communication with the fanbase was **** but hey, it sgoing up again isnt it?

[Bill Lumbar]

Raggedyman, on 25 December 2014 - 01:39 PM, said:

Because if they give away the tools they are giving away the means for anyone to go and make another game with them. It would be incredibly bad business, and that is before you have the problems of turning the professional grade tools into something a meaningful portion of the community would be able to use to any decent level -or- the outbreak of requests for new things to be added to the tools set.

As for contact with the developers: they already have it, it's just that it isn't that one on one because there are just so many more players than developers. Trust me, they do read the comments and the forums and they look at how people are playing the game and they are always going "how can we give the community what they want as best as is realistically possible". It's just that they need to do it for the community as a whole, rather than individuals or vocal groups.

Funny you should claim that it would effect the "game" in a negative way or put at risk some one else making this game. That is what PGI has the IP locked down for no? Shadowrun Returns included a game creator for their community and it is on Steam....where all can upload their user generated content freely. Given some of the content uploaded for all to play and for free..... sorry I just can't buy what you are claiming here.

[Iqfish]

Aliisa White, on 25 December 2014 - 05:35 PM, said:

and again i agree that the communication with the fanbase was **** but hey, it sgoing up again isnt it?

This game is NOTHING without it's community.

And as long as I get ignored via Twitter and E-mail asking for a LITTLE BIT of support (eg. Posting Videos on Facebook, not 2 weeks after they got released, that's just not Youtube) for us making free advertisement for THEM i refuse to accept that "it's going up". Sorry.

(I am referring to communication, not game development, that has indeed improved since the sad, sad loss of IGP )

Edited by Iqfish, 25 December 2014 - 05:57 PM.

[Alienized]

Iqfish, on 25 December 2014 - 05:56 PM, said:

This game is NOTHING without it's community.

And as long as I get ignored via Twitter and E-mail asking for a LITTLE BIT of support (eg. Posting Videos on Facebook, not 2 weeks after they got released, that's just not Youtube) for us making free advertisement for THEM i refuse to accept that "it's going up". Sorry.

(I am referring to communication, not game development, that has indeed improved since the sad, sad loss of IGP )

yep alot of space to improve there but after they (had to?) fire(d) Niko they are looking for a new community manager and literally everything else is on CW.

i hope PGI knows where they have to focus next for us all.

[Vassago Rain]

Aliisa White, on 25 December 2014 - 05:35 PM, said:

given i dont know what happened there because i wasnt able to play mwo for a long time (blame my PC) but a new F2P payment model is not always a good thing....
all i see now is that PGI is doing better than ever since they dropped IGP.

Mechwarrior might be established but its not nearly as famous as Wing Commander.
maybe in the US or north america but not here in europe or the rest of the world.
ye i know what was behind MWO. all that nvidia stuff and so on.

and again i agree that the communication with the fanbase was **** but hey, it sgoing up again isnt it?

In general, people who played wing commander also played mechwarrior 2 and 3. Those who played freelancer played mechwarrior 4.

The old man playerbase also stretches into such games as fighting games, RTS, and western RPGs (Baldur's gate, fallout, icewind dale, etc).

During transverse, there was a huge outrcry from all these old men. It got even worse when PGI claimed they had the wing commander license. I wasn't really paying attention to MWO or PGI at the time, but my fighting game forums now sported very angry transverse threads. If you go look over RSI, practically everybody from here is also posting there.

As for things getting better, yes, they have gotten better. But in a situation like this, where it was rock bottom, 'better' isn't really all that hard to accomplish, you know? They have to keep the momentum going well into 2015, and no matter how great the game gets, people won't forget what happened here.

[Sable]

Maybe because they don't want amature crap plagueing their game. User generated content is always bad or incomplete. I would never want it as part of this game.

[Alienized]

Sable, on 25 December 2014 - 07:08 PM, said:

Maybe because they don't want amature crap plagueing their game. User generated content is always bad or incomplete. I would never want it as part of this game.

not all of it but most. people like iqfish can do alot but not everyone but once you allow user generated content everyone might feel that they have good stuff to show and go nuts if they get criticized.

can end well can be a thin line

[Iqfish]

Sable, on 25 December 2014 - 07:08 PM, said:

Maybe because they don't want amature crap plagueing their game. User generated content is always bad or incomplete. I would never want it as part of this game.

That's why I suggested a Player Council / Place where we can vote crap out before it even reaches PGI.
We all know that they have extremely limited ressources and we don't want to waste them.

[Raggedyman]

Bill Lumbar, on 25 December 2014 - 05:51 PM, said:

Funny you should claim that it would effect the "game" in a negative way or put at risk some one else making this game. That is what PGI has the IP locked down for no? Shadowrun Returns included a game creator for their community and it is on Steam....where all can upload their user generated content freely. Given some of the content uploaded for all to play and for free..... sorry I just can't buy what you are claiming here.

My observations were based on the OP suggestion of (as I read it) giving out all the raw tools and software that the developers have, which do have an intrinsic monetary value to them given the amount of time and money spent making them. That is way more than the scripting kits that ShadowRun (as I understand it, having never played the game and only briefly read up on it) give out. Plus Shadowrun is a paid for, non persistante single world, game so it's a very different business model from the off.

I know that community content can work in other games, however I can't see what is being proposed in this thread working in MWO due to the two main element Freemium business model and the persistent world environment.

Also with regards to IP lockdown: when I said "make another game with them" I meant literally 'make another game', not 'make MWO v2'.

Edited by Raggedyman, 26 December 2014 - 03:12 PM.