1123 replies to this topic

[Zerstorer Stallin]

pinpoint damage, until fixed will breed this meta. PPC need to be a beam, all AC weapons need to be a stream like the clans. Ditch the mechlab and give only variants to IS and yes I play IS. its been this way since day one.

[LordKnightFandragon]

Zerstorer Stallin, on 04 January 2015 - 09:24 AM, said:

pinpoint damage, until fixed will breed this meta. PPC need to be a beam, all AC weapons need to be a stream like the clans. Ditch the mechlab and give only variants to IS and yes I play IS. its been this way since day one.

We need a lessser heat scale, that will force people to use less pinpoint all at once. While we are walkin around with 60-100pt heat scales, the massive lolphas will never end.

[InspectorG]

KuroNyra, on 04 January 2015 - 09:19 AM, said:

Ok, I made a little match with my Thunderbolt.
4 kill for 649 damage. And 5 assist.

I managed to get 4 freaking kill with that thing and remain intact...
Killed an entire Lance.

And it was not damaged target, heck no. 2 Dire Wolf, a JaeggerMech and another Thunderbolt 9S.
And with bonus a heat friendly map. I could litterraly spam my ER PPC with no problem...

Funniest match I ever had since a long time. Not in my Timber Wolf I would have that kind of fun.


edit: I found 2 little music that could go well for each mech.


Boss Theme "ThunderBolt"

(Big Vardha theme PSO2)






Boss Theme "Timber Wolf"

(Dragon EX theme PSO2)

PSO2, shame about that 'DDOS'.

Vardha(?) sucks up close,my Gunner was all Matrix on his matallic azz.
I do miss my old PSO friends...

[kapusta11]

LordKnightFandragon, on 04 January 2015 - 09:27 AM, said:

We need a lessser heat scale, that will force people to use less pinpoint all at once. While we are walkin around with 60-100pt heat scales, the massive lolphas will never end.

Heat was never meant to stop high pinpoint alphas, pinpoint alphas were never a problem in TT (unless you were using targeting computer but that decreased accuracy by a lot on its own). All it's supposed to do is make energy weapons equal to ballistic ones in weight and crit space by forcing you to equip "enough" heatsinks.

Edited by kapusta11, 04 January 2015 - 09:39 AM.

[LordKnightFandragon]

kapusta11, on 04 January 2015 - 09:31 AM, said:

Heat was never meant to stop high pinpoint alphas, pinpoint alphas were never a problem in TT (unless you were using targeting computer which decreased accuracy by a lot on its own). All it's supposed to do is make energy weapons equal to ballistic ones in weight and crit space by forcing you to equip "enough" heatsinks.

Wont stop you from doing it, but I know TT has alot of nasty effects that quickly degrades your performance if you stay hot. And those penalties start real early on in the heat scale.

In MWO, the Heat scale should not increase as we add heat sinks, rather it should be a flat like 50, and all adding heatsinks does it increase our dissipation rate. If we had less heat threshold+Ghost heat and some worthwhile heat effects in game, people wouldnt be so apt to just go hog wild firing all those PP lolphas.

The WHK with 27 DHS, elite and all, it can fire like 11 salvos before neeing to cool off. It has a 109 heat threshold. Cut that in half, give it the 27DHS worth of dissipation, but only a 60pt threshold. That would reduce the salvos down to a more realistic 5 maybe...

On a lighter mech that doesnt even get a 60 heat threshold, they wouldnt even be firing their small lasers that often...

Edited by LordKnightFandragon, 04 January 2015 - 09:39 AM.

[MauttyKoray]

Marcel Bekker, on 04 January 2015 - 02:59 AM, said:

Yes, definately. I would hate to see this mech go down the flavor of the month drain.
The summoner is perfectly fine with its current quirks, only the JJs feel a bit too sluggish.

This, right here. My entire issue with the Summoner isn't its loadout, tonnage, or firepower, ITS THE FREAKING JJs being absolutely USELESS when its the iconic features of the mech. Those buildings on Crimson Straight/River City? It should basically be jumping those in a single bound. JJ Quirks are what the summoner needs!

[kapusta11]

LordKnightFandragon, on 04 January 2015 - 09:37 AM, said:

Wont stop you from doing it, but I know TT has alot of nasty effects that quickly degrades your performance if you stay hot. And those penalties start real early on in the heat scale.

In MWO, the Heat scale should not increase as we add heat sinks, rather it should be a flat like 50, and all adding heatsinks does it increase our dissipation rate. If we had less heat threshold+Ghost heat and some worthwhile heat effects in game, people wouldnt be so apt to just go hog wild firing all those PP lolphas.

The WHK with 27 DHS, elite and all, it can fire like 11 salvos before neeing to cool off. It has a 109 heat threshold. Cut that in half, give it the 27DHS worth of dissipation, but only a 60pt threshold. That would reduce the salvos down to a more realistic 5 maybe...

On a lighter mech that doesnt even get a 60 heat threshold, they wouldnt even be firing their small lasers that often...

If everything were done according to TT WHK with 27 heat sinks would dissipete 54 pts of heat per 4 seconds enough to fire 4 ERPPCs at once and hit only -1 movement penalty. Heat is not meant to do a shіt.

And what are you going to do with Dual Gauss (30 long range PPFLD damage for 2 pts of heat), Dual Heavy Gauss (50 short range PPFLD damage for 4 pts of heat) and Dual Improved Heavy Gauss (44 long range PPFLD damage for 4 pts of heat)?

Edited by kapusta11, 04 January 2015 - 09:51 AM.

[LordKnightFandragon]

kapusta11, on 04 January 2015 - 09:50 AM, said:

If everything were done according to TT WHK with 27 heat sinks would dissipete 54 pts of heat per 4 seconds enough to fire 4 ERPPCs at once and hit only -1 movement penalty. Heat is not meant to do a shіt.

And what are you going to do with Dual Gauss (30 long range PPFLD damage for 2 pts of heat), Dual Heavy Gauss (50 short range PPFLD damage for 4 pts of heat) and Dual Improved Heavy Gauss (44 long range PPFLD damage for 4 pts of heat)?

How does that translate to MWO? 50pt heat scale with 27 true DHS, how does this game even figure out the heat loss per second? In the heat sim, my mech has like a 6.67 heat loss per second.

How would this game play out if everything stayed the same, and the only thing that changed was a universal, fixed heat scale of the TT's 30? Between Ghost heat and slow heat loss, would you want to group fire those PPCs? Currently firing 2 CERPPCs puts my mech at like 50%, that is like 50 some points of heat, and on a 30pt heat scale that would put you at like 150% heat, your mech would be cooking like a turkey...



Dont those Gauss only have a few rounds per ton? Ofc, we can add the current MWO thing where Gauss cant charge more then 2, except change it to only can charge 1.

Edited by LordKnightFandragon, 04 January 2015 - 09:56 AM.

[Zerberus]

Techorse, on 02 January 2015 - 07:09 AM, said:

...
With all due respect, no. The primary function of games is to enjoy them, and if you only get enjoyment by playing meta and winning, something's up.

With all due respect, who made it up to you to decide what other people view as fun and what they don`t? See how sharp that sword is on the back edge, now?

Especially with regards to CW, you have people who`s interpretation of fun is to pretend they are part of the actual lore faction, who`s intent was either to conquer Terra or to defend the Inner Sphere. You do not gain ground by losing battles, and the ultimate goal of domination warrants any means necessary. This is war, and war is not pretty, or fair, or predictable, period.

Their fun is achieving progress towards that ultimate goal. A win is progress towards that goal. Therefore a win is fun. The means necessary to achieve it are irrelevant.

However, the same holds true for the PUG queue. Some people see fun in acquiring the funds to upgrade their mech /buy a new mech. Losing is not progress towards that goal, therefore losing is not fun.

Not to mention the basic truth that winning is generally more satisfying than losing in and of itself, all other factors the same. I.e. more fun.

And of course some people just want to smash stompy robits.... they don`t care about winning or losing, just that they made something go boom.

And then there`s another faction entirely, one that doesn`t like mechwarrior online at all.

So maybe we shouldn`t be acting like we`re the only intelligent ones and defining what others should and should not consider to be fun based purely on our own experiences and desires, but get our heads out of our asses and accept that most of the 6 billion other people on earth are NOT exactly like us?

Edited by Zerberus, 04 January 2015 - 10:00 AM.

[Y E O N N E]

KuroNyra, on 04 January 2015 - 09:19 AM, said:

Ok, I made a little match with my Thunderbolt.
4 kill for 649 damage. And 5 assist.

I managed to get 4 freaking kill with that thing and remain intact...
Killed an entire Lance.

And it was not damaged target, heck no. 2 Dire Wolf, a JaeggerMech and another Thunderbolt 9S.
And with bonus a heat friendly map. I could litterraly spam my ER PPC with no problem...

Funniest match I ever had since a long time. Not in my Timber Wolf I would have that kind of fun.

Is it spam when any other weapon system gets fired repeatedly? AC spam. Laser spam. LRM spam. It's not spam to be shooting your guns at the target. It only becomes spam when you have a whole bunch of players in a match using the gun, and that's not something that generally happens in solo matches.

tl;dr: you can't solo-spam a gun.

[kapusta11]

LordKnightFandragon, on 04 January 2015 - 09:54 AM, said:

How does that translate to MWO? 50pt heat scale with 27 true DHS, how does this game even figure out the heat loss per second? In the heat sim, my mech has like a 6.67 heat loss per second.

How would this game play out if everything stayed the same, and the only thing that changed was a universal, fixed heat scale of the TT's 30? Between Ghost heat and slow heat loss, would you want to group fire those PPCs? Currently firing 2 CERPPCs puts my mech at like 50%, that is like 50 some points of heat, and on a 30pt heat scale that would put you at like 150% heat, your mech would be cooking like a turkey...



Dont those Gauss only have a few rounds per ton? Ofc, we can add the current MWO thing where Gauss cant charge more then 2, except change it to only can charge 1.

In TT heat cap is dynamic, it depends on the amount of heat sinks you have, first you generate heat (by walking, running, jumping, firing weapons etc.) THEN you substract the amount of heat your heat sinks dissipate, the rest goes to heatscale and you get penalized, or you don't. How to implement this in MWO? Easy: buff dissipation (obvious), cap is calculated as number of heatsinks*0.5(dissipation per each one)*firing interval (4 sec), anything that goes 5 pts above that (according to heat scale table) applies "-1 movement" penalty which in MWO may reduce acceleration/deceleration/torso twist rates.

PP alphas is an issue that is not related to heat at all, it is caused by of lack of heat allocation (dice roll), of cource no one in a sane mind will roll a dice in FPS game but some mechanic that replace it should have a place, preferably the one that does not affect any other variables (like HEAT) other than raw maximum damage per alpha. I suggested in a couple of threads to cap apla damage, not to NERF something but to FIX the values we have right now. For example you can't charge more than 2 Gauss rifles at once, firing more than 3 PPCs/ERPPCs is way too hot, basically we already have PPFLD weapons caped at 30 pts of damage.

Edited by kapusta11, 04 January 2015 - 10:13 AM.

[Vandul]

38 pages later and the clanners are still moaning. This is pretty good.


Popcorn anyone?

[Slater01]

Vandul, on 04 January 2015 - 10:17 AM, said:

38 pages later and the clanners are still moaning. This is pretty good.


Popcorn anyone?

Yes please,
The Holidays are a great time of year to sit back and watch the smack talk. I for one think that all mechs should have erppc quirks, jump jets and ecm. That will level the playing field and bring back my days of playing halo.

[Night Fury76]

If I can kill you with a 30 plus 30 alpha my clanner friend at long range, you are standing still and not in cover.

Don't stand still you scrub.
I can not and in any IS mech do not live very long in front of a direwolf.
Do I come here an ***** that direwolfs are OP'd?
No, I stay the fark out of their LOS.

If I get caught in front of one I expect to die.
Its all part of the challenge of the game.

PGI please don't remove the challenge in this game because these big wet blankets.

Cheers

[Koniks]

KuroNyra, on 04 January 2015 - 03:58 AM, said:

Stuff

So your argument boils down to the Clans have it harder than the Inner Sphere? And you only asked what makes the Timber Wolf OP so you could make that point. OK then.

Edited by Mizeur, 04 January 2015 - 11:52 AM.

[KuroNyra]

Yeonne Greene, on 04 January 2015 - 10:07 AM, said:

Is it spam when any other weapon system gets fired repeatedly? AC spam. Laser spam. LRM spam. It's not spam to be shooting your guns at the target. It only becomes spam when you have a whole bunch of players in a match using the gun, and that's not something that generally happens in solo matches. tl;dr: you can't solo-spam a gun.

When you see a full squad of pugs not related to each others all using Thunderbolt 9S, and you see another groupe like this using the same mech.
There is something strange.

Evern wonder why you see so much of them in pugs match?

[EvilCow]

KuroNyra, on 04 January 2015 - 01:40 PM, said:

When you see a full squad of pugs not related to each others all using Thunderbolt 9S, and you see another groupe like this using the same mech.
There is something strange.

Evern wonder why you see so much of them in pugs match?

Any evidence? a screenshot maybe? I never seen more than 3-4 of them at the same time in all PUG teams I played in. A single screenshot and you will have convinced me.

I don't ask 12 of them like you claimed, I will settle for half of that.

[Brody319]

Been seeing less Twolves and more Thunderbolts in pugs. Almost like people have been grinding to buy them with c-bills...but nah, that would make sense and explain why people have been using timberwolves constantly despite the fact that this thing is so broken its unfair to both sides.

[Devil Fox]

Brody319, on 04 January 2015 - 02:12 PM, said:

Been seeing less Twolves and more Thunderbolts in pugs. Almost like people have been grinding to buy them with c-bills...but nah, that would make sense and explain why people have been using timberwolves constantly despite the fact that this thing is so broken its unfair to both sides.

If their IS... their probably grinding experience fr the machine for CW use... afterall whilst in pug queue we have the Timber Wolf we don't have it in CW (where is our salvage >.<).

[Brody319]

Apostal Sinclair, on 04 January 2015 - 02:36 PM, said:

If their IS... their probably grinding experience fr the machine for CW use... afterall whilst in pug queue we have the Timber Wolf we don't have it in CW (where is our salvage >.<).

Just saying in my ELO pug games I see just as many 9S as I do Timberwolves.