74 replies to this topic

[Aidan]

I have been asked politely by Rebel Roshak to take my grievances to the MWO forums instead of Twitter. [Redacted]
So let us start the discussion with a specific comparison of Clan weaponry and IS weapons.

For example, Clan ER-PPC vs IS ER-PPC. Below is a screen from the Smurfy website which I believe is accurate as of the current MWO patch. Cast your view to the two tabular entries for the Clan ER-PPC and the IS ER-PPC. Can someone please tell me how these 2 weapon systems differ?

Well lets see:

1. Clan does more damage - Check
2. Clan also does splash damage, does the IS weapon?
3. Clan has the same cooldown rate as the IS weapon. Why is this so?
4. Clan ER-PPC generates the same HEAT!!! How can this advanced technology NOT generate more heat?
5. Clan ER-PPC costs the same, in C-bills, as the IS weapon? Geee I guess advanced weaponry doesn't cost as much as we thought.

Because the parameters of heat generation and weaponry cool down is the same as Inner Sphere BUT the damage is more, this results in a damage per second per ton or DPS/T of 0.63. This is almost twice the 0.36 DPS/T for an IS ER-PPC. Oh and BTW the Clan weapon is 1 Ton lighter!! It really is quite amazing how brilliant those Clan scientists are!!! *Read with MUCH sarcasm*

Fellow MWO pilots I have said in the past and I reiterate here again, the Free to Play business model PGI has adopted will cause distortions in this game for the purpose of selling game items to perpetuate the PGI revenue stream. When these distortions become so grievous they dramatically effect game play, then these issues must be presented to the MWO gaming community at large.

As time permits, I will continue to raise issues with this game. [Redacted]

Edited by John Wolf, 07 January 2015 - 06:54 PM.
Attacks against ANYONE are not permitted. Focus on the content please.

[FupDup]

The Inner Sphere ERPPC is a bad weapon outside of super-quirked variants. The Clan ERPPC is less bad.

[Joseph Mallan]

Aidan, on 07 January 2015 - 09:47 AM, said:

I have been asked politely by Rebel Roshak to take my grievances to the MWO forums instead of Twitter. [Redacted]

So let us start the discussion with a specific comparison of Clan weaponry and IS weapons.

For example, Clan ER-PPC vs IS ER-PPC. Below is a screen from the Smurfy website which I believe is accurate as of the current MWO patch. Cast your view to the two tabular entries for the Clan ER-PPC and the IS ER-PPC. Can someone please tell me how these 2 weapon systems differ?

Well lets see:

1. Clan does more damage - Check
2. Clan also does splash damage, does the IS weapon?
3. Clan has the same cooldown rate as the IS weapon. Why is this so?
4. Clan ER-PPC generates the same HEAT!!! How can this advanced technology NOT generate more heat?
5. Clan ER-PPC costs the same, in C-bills, as the IS weapon? Geee I guess advanced weaponry doesn't cost as much as we thought.

1. Correct
2. Not a fan of this but the whine over ruled the Clans having 2 15 point damage weapons.
3. See 4
4. There is no reason for the Clan ER PPC to do less heat as it does do more damage than a Inner Sphere ER PPC. Even though it is a splash of damage it is doing more for the same amount of heat. I am OK with this thinking, Not a fan of it but can accept it.
5. Yes and no... You are getting the advanced Tech with lower overhead costs since Clan Labor Caste are not paid as much as Inner Sphere workers who are likely unionized and being paid top Kroner for the work they do.

Edited by John Wolf, 07 January 2015 - 06:33 PM.
Moderated Quote

[Mcgral18]

Aidan, on 07 January 2015 - 09:47 AM, said:

1. Clan does more damage - Check
2. Clan also does splash damage, does the IS weapon?

Let's make the IS ERPPC do splash damage!

Hurray!

[Bidetlol]

6- IS have quirks

[Antagonist]

First off, your right of free speech doesn't apply to a private forum.

Secondly, the C-ER PPC is an evolution of existing IS technology while the latter was busy bombing itself back to the stone age in four wars and an organization actively taking steps toward the destruction of technology and science.

The main differences ingame are the lower weight, less bulk and the additional nigh useless splash damage, totaling 15 points of total damage.

While we're talking about more heat and stuff...you'll be surprised to know lots of electrical equipment nowadays will do more with less. And the clans had almost 300 years to advance their technology.

[Ultimax]

FupDup, on 07 January 2015 - 09:51 AM, said:

The Inner Sphere ERPPC is a bad weapon outside of super-quirked variants. The Clan ERPPC is less bad.

BINGO.


If you want to analyze something you need to look at all of the points, not just the points you want to see.


The IS also has access to a lower heat variant, there is no option like this for clan mechs. (and also they have more pinpoint ballistic options to synergize with, reducing overall heat load on the build)



The CERPPC has more damage, but it is splash damage. You make "splash" sound like a benefit, it is not a benefit.


10 damage + 2.5 & 2.5 damage for 15 heat on a 6 ton weapon that has a higher aiming requirement than hitscan lasers is still not a very efficient weapon.


That being said, I'd like for them to go back and reduce IS ER PPCs down to 12 heat (and maybe 9 for standard PPC), and adjust all ER PPC quirks to counter balance the change.

Then the CERPPC could be 15 heat for 15 pinpoint.

Edited by Ultimatum X, 07 January 2015 - 09:59 AM.

[FupDup]

Ultimatum X, on 07 January 2015 - 09:58 AM, said:

...
Then the CERPPC could be 15 heat for 15 pinpoint.

My (B)Adder's reaction:







...Although if we were to reduce the heat on the IS PPC and ERPPC, I think that the normal PPC's min range should be switched back to linear damage reduction instead of instantly going down to zero.




...But to be fair, having a 6 ton gun with infinite ammo have the same upfront damage as the 12-15 ton Gauss Rifle that explodes and runs out of ammo might be excessive? But my (B)Adder doesn't care. MOAR lightning bolts!

Edited by FupDup, 07 January 2015 - 10:12 AM.

[PurpleNinja]

What's the point?

[kapusta11]

Clan ERPPC is the ONLY PPC clans have it should be OP (15 FLD damage), IS (should) have acces to Normal one, ER, Heavy, Light, Snub-Nose and can link Capacitors to any of them to increase damage and heat output by 5 pts.

Edited by kapusta11, 07 January 2015 - 10:09 AM.

[Dagnome]

This thread is going places.

[Fate 6]

I've never felt like the C-ERPPC was too strong. In fact, I feel it is either balanced or UP because of the splash damage which makes it just more heat for less point damage than the ERLL and LPL. With quirks and normal PPCs and pinpoint ballistics taken into account, the IS probably comes out on top.

[Vanguard836]

OP, I'd take the message of the ban from twitter to maybe stop calling out devs and name calling as per the CoC...just a thought, might help you to not get banned and get a warmer response to your discussions on their part.

[MarineTech]

PurpleNinja, on 07 January 2015 - 10:01 AM, said:

What's the point?

Yeah... I'm really kinda in the same boat here...

What the heck is the point the OP is trying to make here?

Other to whine... I'm thinking this is another genuine certified case of:

[DONTOR]

Aidan, on 07 January 2015 - 09:47 AM, said:

1. Clan does more damage - Check
2. Clan also does splash damage, does the IS weapon?
3. Clan has the same cooldown rate as the IS weapon. Why is this so?
4. Clan ER-PPC generates the same HEAT!!! How can this advanced technology NOT generate more heat?
5. Clan ER-PPC costs the same, in C-bills, as the IS weapon? Geee I guess advanced weaponry doesn't cost as much as we thought.

First off LOL.
1. CERPPC does same Pinpoint damage
2. CERPPC does more damage becasue of splash (which is a direct nerf to the CERPPC off the bat)
3. Because as you mentioned its advanced, so that was easy.
4. What you meant to say was WHY WOULD ADVANCED TECHNOLOGY GENERATE MORE HEAT!?
5. Cost... Who cares

Edited by DONTOR, 07 January 2015 - 10:18 AM.

[Ultimax]

FupDup, on 07 January 2015 - 10:01 AM, said:

...Although if we were to reduce the heat on the IS PPC and ERPPC, I think that the normal PPC's min range should be switched back to linear damage reduction instead of instantly going down to zero.

Agreed, that tech is in place for Clan LRMs, I see no reason the PPC shouldn't have something similar.

FupDup, on 07 January 2015 - 10:01 AM, said:

...But to be fair, having a 6 ton gun with infinite ammo have the same upfront damage as the 12-15 ton Gauss Rifle that explodes and runs out of ammo might be excessive?

Gauss is basically zero heat, with 2000m/s projectile and borders on hitscan.

It is the only weapon in the game that still has a max range = to 3x optimal range (which means you lose less damage when firing out just a touch beyond optimal, not that you want to shoot things at 1500m).


So I think it would be fine, personally.

Edited by Ultimatum X, 07 January 2015 - 10:18 AM.

[KuroNyra]

Ultimatum X, on 07 January 2015 - 09:58 AM, said:

BINGO.


If you want to analyze something you need to look at all of the points, not just the points you want to see.

And that's how you have some people convinced that the Thunderbolt 9S, the Timber Wolf and the StormCrow have no need of change in them.

[o0Marduk0o]

What is the point of this thread?

[FupDup]

o0Marduk0o, on 07 January 2015 - 10:22 AM, said:

What is the point of this thread?

It might have something to do with cute and furry animals, methinks.

[Wintersdark]

IS has quirks. 70 is mechs have erppc's that outrange the cerppc. Many have heat reduction, etc,etc. In actual play, the is erppc vastly outperforms the cerppc.

And outside those quirks, ALL erppc's are awful.