35 replies to this topic

[Shiroi Tsuki]

Wait, wait, FFS I SAID WAAAAAAIIIIIITTTTT!!!!!!!!!!
Before y'all throw in your caps at me, lemme explain k?

The ECM and the AMS are like the anti-Lurm equipment right? But I barely see AMS any more now that we have this sniping trend.

The light Mechs have like 6 ECM Mechs, which is like 66% of all ECM capable Mechs in game.
We buff the LRMs a bit, we should be seeing a couple ECM, AMS and craploads of "nerf the LRMs" topics in the forums. This should encourage people to start using Light Mechs again. The average % I see in Light Mechs is around 9, and I've seen it go down all the way down to 0 a couple times.
I'm not saying buff the LRMs too much, just a little

TL;DR: Buffed Lurms = More ECM lights

[BourbonFaucet]

What we need is a nerf to indirect fire and a buff to direct fire.

[Shiroi Tsuki]

But aren't LRMs supposed to be indirect fire?

[Monkey Lover]

Lrms were bad before the 9% nerf now they're almost worthless. They need to.go back to 1.1 dmg

Edited by Monkey Lover, 10 January 2015 - 02:18 PM.

[Eboli]

Lrms are in a good spot now. There are something to be aware of to ensure that you don't expose yourself for too long in the open but they won't devastate you in case a few volleys find you. They keep you on your toes.

Snipers have always been in the game since the beginning and there are a number of ways to counter them apart from Lrms. Maybe ERPPC spam has been a little bit more lately which has led to this post.

Lrms have always been a support weapon and like all other game tactics there should always be a counter, of which ams and ECM does. I don't think you want to really want to add more ECM to the battlefield do you?

@ MonkeyLover - I never really use LRMs so there may be a bias towards my post but I see some players hit huge damage numbers when they boat them, including the very tactical use of multiple Lrms 5s, thus my reasoning. I respect your point though.

Cheers
Eboli

Edited by Eboli, 10 January 2015 - 02:21 PM.

[Pjwned]

ECM just needs to be less ridiculous and that will fix plenty of things, including LRMs.

[Latorque]

Hmmm. No; never buff LRMs. People tend to play this game in an extremely static way even without OPed LRMs. Should LRMs get more powerful i would suggest the optional removal of engines - an external generator allows torso twist and you can load up all the weapons you want to be a mighty defense turret:

http://mwo.smurfy-ne...811b5a4fe167f59

LRMs are okay now as long as your opponent has the (very pricey) RDM. Otherwise; bleargh.

[Mirumoto Izanami]

Shiroi Tsuki, on 10 January 2015 - 02:11 PM, said:

But aren't LRMs supposed to be indirect fire?

Common misconception. LRMs are direct fire weapons with indirect fire capabilities when partnered with a spotter. Both in TT and with this game.

[YokiLin]

Shiroi Tsuki, on 10 January 2015 - 02:00 PM, said:

Wait, wait, FFS I SAID WAAAAAAIIIIIITTTTT!!!!!!!!!! Before y'all throw in your caps at me, lemme explain k? The ECM and the AMS are like the anti-Lurm equipment right? But I barely see AMS any more now that we have this sniping trend. The light Mechs have like 6 ECM Mechs, which is like 66% of all ECM capable Mechs in game. We buff the LRMs a bit, we should be seeing a couple ECM, AMS and craploads of "nerf the LRMs" topics in the forums. This should encourage people to start using Light Mechs again. The average % I see in Light Mechs is around 9, and I've seen it go down all the way down to 0 a couple times. I'm not saying buff the LRMs too much, just a little TL;DR: Buffed Lurms = More ECM lights

I can tell that you are not a light pilot. You do know that LRMs discourage light pilots the most, especially the new ones? No matter how fast lights run we can't outrun the speed and range of the lrm missiles which are freaking locked on to us by a PGI aimbot. The very situation you talked about where only 10% players play lights started around the last time PGI buffed LRMs.

The Jenners, Firestarters, etc, (basically all the ones without ECM) are the best of the lights because they have enough firepower to make a difference. The lights with ECM are either fairly weak (Pirate's Bane), have too little firepower (Spider-5D), or is too damn slow (Kit Fox). I mean, Kit Foxes can do their job, but they don't allow you to undergo hit and run adventures full of action behind enemy lines and can be frustratingly hard to get away if caught alone far away from your team, though if you are not a little far from your team, what's the point of a light? Pirate's Bane is too easy to die (well in my opinion anyways), and while I can cause some havoc with a Spider-5D the TTK (time to kill) is horrible and it's too likely that my target called his friends or LRMs over before I can kill him (plus if it's a light vs light both of us could get bombed to death by LRM before doing anything).

Besides, ECM lights are kind of screwed these days since if they try to go assassinate some LRM boats, the LRM boats might have BAP, and with it's recent buff which increased it's ECM countering range to 280m... ECM is just pointless. So instead of the lights being the counter to LRM boats, it's the other way around. Not to mention that low signal thing which warn enemies of nearby unfriendly ECM.

SO, now that I talked about why ECM lights sucked, I would like to point how that if LRMs are buffed even more, any lights that engage an enemy mech, in a place without cover from LRM (which is 90% of a map), and got spotted which just be annihilated. Not that right now LRM isn't a problem for lights, but at least we can still get a chance to run to safety once spotted, with maybe a lrm hit or two if unlucky, which usually won't be enough to kill you.

I think that you can get why I have no idea where did you come up with the notion that better LRMs means more lights. Even a little more of a buff can screw lights over much harder since even a little buff can have a large impact as we have to run into cover in a matter of seconds and we cannot afford the hits on our light armor.

If anything I support nerfing LRM since the level of skill LRM boats require can be more or less achieved by a simple AI (follow team, lock on stuff by hovering over it, right click unless no clear line of sight, don't show up on the front lines in major battles, repeat) while lights perform the unsung duties of spotting, scouting, assassination, enemy division, and distraction. Not many people even realize how important distracting and splitting up the enemy is. On the other hand, any hits LRM boats achieve depended on if the other side remembers to stay near cover and not on the skill of the LRM boat.

After a year with this game I can tell you that the only thing worth sticking around for any long period of time is the lights and most definitely not the LRM boats.

Edited by YokiLin, 11 January 2015 - 04:39 PM.

[Mcgral18]

Monkey Lover, on 10 January 2015 - 02:14 PM, said:

Lrms were bad before the 9% nerf now they're almost worthless. They need to.go back to 1.1 dmg

Why stop at that?

Return them to their 1.8 damage values. Perhaps they would be worth taking.

Oh, the whining that would cause.


I can't stand the weapon system; far to ineffective. I guess it's better than their low of 0.7 damage.

[Deathlike]

Mcgral18, on 11 January 2015 - 02:09 PM, said:

I can't stand the weapon system; far to ineffective. I guess it's better than their low of 0.7 damage.

Arguably, LRMs have been the only weapon system that has been nerfed and buffed like a yoyo.

Maybe that's the toy the man that shall not be named is using instead of "darts" vs the board of random balance changes.

[El Bandito]

Mcgral18, on 11 January 2015 - 02:09 PM, said:

Why stop at that?

Return them to their 1.8 damage values. Perhaps they would be worth taking.

Oh, the whining that would cause.


I can't stand the weapon system; far to ineffective. I guess it's better than their low of 0.7 damage.

Better yet, give back the LRM splash damage. And not just the puny splash we had before its removal. I meant the 2012 sized splash radius.

[Mcgral18]

El Bandito, on 11 January 2015 - 02:13 PM, said:

Better yet, give back the LRM splash damage. And not just the puny splash we had before its removal. I meant the 2012 sized splash radius.

15 damage per Short Range Missile/90 per SRM6?

10 damage per Long Range Missile?

Hitting every hitbox on small mechs?


The forums would be flooded.

[John80sk]

LRM's are great against the bottom 50% of the player base, terrible against the top 50%. Unfortunately this is how it has to be with the current mechanics for the weapon system.

I would suggest making it so that LRM's cannot lock indirectly unless a narc or tag is in play. Your crosshairs must be on the mech instead of just in the vicinity of the mech in order to get a lock. Additionally locks would need to be regained every time you fired, but the time needed to lock would be reduced.

Then I would say lower the cooldown and tighten the spread on LRM 15's and 20's (greatly for the 20's).

[Fate 6]

No. No no no. Do not buff LRMs to bring back lights. You think we want to be forced to waste harpoints (mist lynx, kit fox) or tonnage, or just be straight up forced into a variant (IS ECM mechs)? Hell no.

ECM (ignoring the info warfare aspects) exists (or should I say is currently used) to stop indirect fire LRMs. Direct fire LRMs can be stopped by breaking line of sight. So, buff direct fire and nerf indirect fire a tiny bit. LRMs need a redirection of power, a fix, not a buff.

Edited by Fate 6, 11 January 2015 - 02:32 PM.

[Hotthedd]

Increase their speed, decrease their arc, increase their damage to 1.0, no splash damage, and must have either LOS, TAG, or NARC. (none of which are affected by ECM)
LRMs are way to easymode right now, being long range Streaks. Add a layer of skill to them.

[occusoj]

Quote

LRMs are way to easymode right now

For the other team. They have to fight against one mech less.

If they are just long ranged streaks, look at how many people actually use streaks. Except some rare SSRM30+ lolboats, no one does so.
And thats because they are flat out BAD. As are lurms once the enemy knows how to avoid them.

Edited by occusoj, 11 January 2015 - 02:47 PM.

[Iron Riding Cowboy]

LRMs need an nerf \ buff as in the closer you are the better the damage the farther out you are the less accurate they become. And thy get even better with line of sight. This will add skills to LRMs and both nerf and buff them

[Lily from animove]

Techorse, on 10 January 2015 - 02:02 PM, said:

What we need is a nerf to indirect fire and a buff to direct fire.

well lrms should be able to track if fired unlocked but receive a lock while in the air. this way youc an make a line of sight fire, and lock to make them track. it is strange when my lrms have a lock, I fire, they lsoe and regain lock, they can track, but they don't do this when fired without lock then getting a lock. would really like to see that.

right now lrms would need changes at all, they re Op amongst newbies and lower skilled players, and nearly pointless amongst higher skill ranks.

[wanderer]

Add a second to cooldown times for LRMs, restore the missile damage to 1.2 per.

Voila. You now have a weapon with a firing rate slower than a Gauss rifle (OK, equal to it for an LRM -5-) that hits respectably harder and cuts down on the number of shots in the air at one time.