

[Suggestion] Camping Drop Zone
#1
Posted 02 January 2015 - 11:20 PM
#2
Posted 02 January 2015 - 11:25 PM
Who'd have thunk it?
What we need are maps that aren't prone to spawn camping and zergrushes like it's 2003.
#3
Posted 02 January 2015 - 11:27 PM
Coordination alone can defend off from LZ camping.
#4
Posted 02 January 2015 - 11:40 PM
The only thing that prevents this is for the rest of the defending team to...idk....DEFEND omg DEFEND!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Seriously, your beef isn't with the game mode, its with what random people do. Join....A....Team....Or deal with random thought process.....
#5
Posted 03 January 2015 - 12:59 AM
ZenFool, on 02 January 2015 - 11:40 PM, said:
To make this even more horrid, once you are camping the alpha-dropoint, you can shoot the omega-gen from certain positions. Once that happens, the game is over. No chance of defending against that.
#6
Posted 03 January 2015 - 01:19 AM
Death Drow, on 02 January 2015 - 11:27 PM, said:
Coordination alone can defend off from LZ camping.
So is changing your landing zone which we can't do... so spawn camping is an exploit.
#7
Posted 03 January 2015 - 01:22 AM
Alik Kerensky, on 03 January 2015 - 01:19 AM, said:
Wrong. Changing an lz is correct, the claiming it's an exploit is wrong. Unless you consider every single military strategy an exploit (in which you wouldn't exactly be wrong).
Simple solution/answer: Don't go to dropship one at a time. Wait to do so until you have the rest of the team or atleast 1/2 of the team to do so at once.
#8
Posted 03 January 2015 - 01:37 AM
Death Drow, on 03 January 2015 - 01:22 AM, said:
Wrong. Changing an lz is correct, the claiming it's an exploit is wrong. Unless you consider every single military strategy an exploit (in which you wouldn't exactly be wrong).
Simple solution/answer: Don't go to dropship one at a time. Wait to do so until you have the rest of the team or atleast 1/2 of the team to do so at once.
Dropped with four people and ended up lasting about 12 seconds in a stalker before I was back in the dropship. Defenders really shouldn't be able to get out before the gates are down.
#9
Posted 03 January 2015 - 01:55 AM
This isn't a map design issue it's a tactical issue. That team camping Alpha? They can shuffle a bit closer to the ogen location and blow the Omega for you when they get bored. If you're letting them stay there it's because you're making bad choices and going to lose anyway.
If it's IS mechs you push in the narrow approach on your right as you face alpha gate, hustle through and behind them. Then you shuffle your left side folks right up behind the buildings there and pinch from both sides. This largely removes their access to cover up high; to get cover they have to jump down into the trenches where they will get in each others way.
If it's Clanners you bum-rush them. The most common stupid mistake on Sulfur people make against Clanners is giving them time. Time = cooling and Clan builds are hot. The moment you see a concentrated group of Clanners start to set up shop you pull everyone into cover, call a clock time and you bull-rush them. Most will have 2 alphas and then hit their heat cap. Now their DPS just dropped by 90%. The key is swamping *all of them at once*. You don't 'focus fire them down one at a time', again that gives the rest time to shoot, cool, shoot. You bull rush almost all of them at once and stomp them when they overheat. They are there to attrition you out. Deny them that and do it quickly. The other problem is people waiting too long to do this so by the time they burn the Clanners out of the point they've lost 6 more mechs than they should. A defender trading 11 for 12 is winning. 13 for 12 is losing. The attacker can trade 13 for 12 so long as he's nailing objectives. You see a Clan group on wave 2 going for attrition and you burn them out early they now have only 2 waves to nail all the objectives to win.
Make sense? This is a problem of poor tactics and timidity on the part of the defenders, not a map design issue. Spawncamping defenders means the attackers have arrived, in force, pretty much at the Omega. If you can't push them out here then the spawn camping is not your issue.
#10
Posted 03 January 2015 - 03:56 AM
Heketon, on 03 January 2015 - 01:37 AM, said:
A sensible solution would be to:
1) Allow people to pick their drop zone
2) Provide a way for defenders to capture the enemy LZ to win the game (obviously with slightly different mechanics than current capture points). Granted, people will still farm for C-Bills, but that's going to happen no matter what you do. Teams trying to maximize their drops however will just take the DZ, and as a bonus it prevents the "go find an obscure corner of the map to tie the other team up" strategy.
#12
Posted 03 January 2015 - 07:57 AM
#13
Posted 03 January 2015 - 09:42 AM
A warfare game should not be about solving puzzles -- like how to get down a gate or how to disable a generator.
Edited by nehebkau, 03 January 2015 - 09:42 AM.
#14
Posted 03 January 2015 - 09:52 AM
MischiefSC, on 03 January 2015 - 01:55 AM, said:
This isn't a map design issue it's a tactical issue. That team camping Alpha? They can shuffle a bit closer to the ogen location and blow the Omega for you when they get bored. If you're letting them stay there it's because you're making bad choices and going to lose anyway.
This, a thousand times this. Players are too afraid to get their Mech's paint scratched and just let their team mates get slaughtered.
Defense also involves defending your team mates!
Edited by Mystere, 03 January 2015 - 09:52 AM.
#15
Posted 03 January 2015 - 09:59 AM
nehebkau, on 03 January 2015 - 09:42 AM, said:
A warfare game should not be about solving puzzles -- like how to get down a gate or how to disable a generator.
#16
Posted 03 January 2015 - 10:15 AM
Yoseful Mallad, on 03 January 2015 - 09:59 AM, said:
Defenses like the Maginot Line? How about the fortified defenses in Iraq during the first US invasion? In the old days, fortifications were important -- castle walls made kings. In modern, mobile warfare you don't design 'castles' with walls to be breached. You specially don't attack fortified locations without substantial artillery / air / orbital bombardment to eliminate the major defenses (like big hulking walls) and likewise you don't build them because you know they are just going to be blown to bits from a distance. The CW maps just don't make sense to me specially if your sole mission is to destroy the only thing of value in the base (the giant cannon)
Edited by nehebkau, 03 January 2015 - 10:16 AM.
#17
Posted 03 January 2015 - 10:41 AM
I like the idea of waiting for the four mech lance to fill the ship, then drop them into a random location, or one of several designated locations. The defenders cannot camp them all.
Besides, if all of the defenders are out of the base, could not a dropship pilot just drop the mechs right onto the base? Certainly right beside the entrance?
As this CW concept expands, we are going to be needing MUCH larger maps, with longer match times as well.
#18
Posted 03 January 2015 - 10:57 AM
crustydog, on 03 January 2015 - 10:41 AM, said:
I like the idea of waiting for the four mech lance to fill the ship, then drop them into a random location, or one of several designated locations. The defenders cannot camp them all.
Besides, if all of the defenders are out of the base, could not a dropship pilot just drop the mechs right onto the base? Certainly right beside the entrance?
As this CW concept expands, we are going to be needing MUCH larger maps, with longer match times as well.
Bigger maps with multiple drop locations and you can pick which location you drop at and when you drop-- is that what you are getting at? That would be cool!
Edited by nehebkau, 03 January 2015 - 10:58 AM.
#19
Posted 03 January 2015 - 11:22 AM
If - and only if - someone landing wishes to, they can drop smoke a second or two prior to landing that significantly impedes visibility, including heat vision. This fades over five seconds or so, similar to what is used to mark arty / airstrikes
This doesn't stop the poor ******* surrounded by the opposition from dying, but it gives them the opportunity to at least move a bit, and maybe alpha someone on the way out.
You don't want to use it all the time, because it's going to help attackers who are going for the gens/omega by slowing the reaction time of reinforcements.
#20
Posted 03 January 2015 - 11:35 AM
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