24 replies to this topic

[Fastred]

Any word on how ammo magazine explosions are being handled.
Assume ammo magazines explode here are my questions:

• If ammo is hit or if the location containing it is destroyed will it explode and cause additional damage?
  
• Is magazine explosion damage still based on how many rounds you have in the magazine multiplied by the damage generated by each round? I.E. is having a full ton of mg ammo cooking off in your left torso still a death sentence?
  
• Does over heating a mech come with the risk of causing the ammo in your mechs magazine to have a chance of detonating?
  
• Does an exploding mech be it a case of exploding ammo or collapsing fusion bottle do splash damage?

Anyway I tried to search the subject and either there is nothing on the subject or I am suffering from a chair keyboard interface issue. Either way any word on this would be, Greatly Appriciated


Regards,
Red

[Kumakichi]

Just guessing...

Yes
Who knows until finished product
Maybe
I hope so

[Nexus Trimean]

The people who know either cannot or will not say.

So the answer to all your questions is Probably. The Dev's have so far attempted to stick to the table top, so i would guess all those things will be likely to be included.

[REDIII]

oi im red

[GeneralPacman]

I would imagine it would depend on the rounds. Mg ammo maybe not as they are afaik inert projectiles like a rifle bullet, unless of course the rounds are powerful enough to penetrate your internal structure when set off, you may have them entering the torso from the side for example, or even leaving your mech and hitting someone else.
Missiles and cannon rounds however, i would think so as they are charged with explosives.

In MWLL when your mech overheats it shuts down automatically to prevent that sort of thing, so overheating may cause ammo to detonate but i think it would mainly be caused by impact or explosive force from being hit.

Splash damage from detonation i would think yes also.

Edited by GeneralPacman, 29 June 2012 - 10:08 AM.

[WardenWolf]

Fastred, on 29 June 2012 - 09:49 AM, said:

• If ammo is hit or if the location containing it is destroyed will it explode and cause additional damage?
  
• Is magazine explosion damage still based on how many rounds you have in the magazine multiplied by the damage generated by each round? I.E. is having a full ton of mg ammo cooking off in your left torso still a death sentence?
  
• Does over heating a mech come with the risk of causing the ammo in your mechs magazine to have a chance of detonating?
  
• Does an exploding mech be it a case of exploding ammo or collapsing fusion bottle do splash damage?

Not in the beta, nor a dev, but this is what I would want to see if I were involved in the design process:

1) Yes
2) No - that never made any sense; I would have it relate to some multiplier of the damage potential of each round multiplied by the number of rounds - and with missiles being worse than ballistic rounds.
3) I would hope so, but only if you pushed past the automatic shutdown point. That would be a risk of using the 'override' option.
4) I would home not, at least not normally. You would need a heck of an ammo cook-off to do much splash damage, and fusion engines don't go 'critical' under any normal situation. The one exception I would make is that if all three crits to an engine came from the same shot (so happened at exactly the same instant) then there would be a small and random chance that it cored the engine fast enough that the fusion process inside the reactor bleeds out. It wouldn't be a nuclear explosion by any means, but it would be an instant flame-out that would cause some damage to anything standing right near the mech (in melee range, if there were such a thing in the game).

Edited by WardenWolf, 29 June 2012 - 10:23 AM.

[Voyager I]

MG ammo was insanely volatile in the TT, whether or not that makes sense in the context of reality.

Given the attention they're paying to TT rules and the fact that they've mentioned CASE as part of the available period technology that they plan to include in the game, I would expect that ammo (and potentially gauss rifle) explosions will be included, although I'm not ready to place bets on the details.

Edited by Voyager I, 29 June 2012 - 10:15 AM.

[Project_Mercy]

Voyager I, on 29 June 2012 - 10:15 AM, said:

Given the attention they're paying to TT rules and the fact that they've mentioned CASE as part of the available period technology that they plan to include in the game, I would expect that ammo (and potentially gauss rifle) explosions will be included, although I'm not ready to place bets on the details.

This. There's no reason to bring up CASE unless you have ammo explosions.

[Fastred]

Voyager I, on 29 June 2012 - 10:15 AM, said:

MG ammo was insanely volatile in the TT, whether or not that makes sense in the context of reality.

Given the attention they're paying to TT rules and the fact that they've mentioned CASE as part of the available period technology that they plan to include in the game, I would expect that ammo (and potentially gauss rifle) explosions will be included, although I'm not ready to place bets on the details.

Thanks for the info all I appriciate it.

Red

[Fire and Salt]

It really has to be weapon specific though... not based on damage of the weapon necessarily...


Gauss rounds should never explode... all they are is pieces if metal... no gunpowder etc.

[Death Mallet]

Might not be as lethal though since I don't think they have the damage transfer mechanic going on. (Nor should they since you can shoot at specific parts of a mech.

[Voyager I]

Gauss ammo is inert.

Unfortunately, the weapons themselves are prone to catastrophic failures when damaged.


I would also expect damage transfer to be part of the game, as they've already mentioned CASE for inclusion, and as has been said, CASE is pointless if your ammunition can't blow up take your mech with it.

Edited by Voyager I, 29 June 2012 - 11:16 AM.

[Project_Mercy]

Fire and Salt, on 29 June 2012 - 11:07 AM, said:

Gauss rounds should never explode... all they are is pieces if metal... no gunpowder etc.

In TT, the rounds don't explode, but the rifle itself will.

[Death Mallet]

Voyager I, on 29 June 2012 - 11:15 AM, said:

I would also expect damage transfer to be part of the game, as they've already mentioned CASE for inclusion, and as has been said, CASE is pointless if your ammunition can't blow up take your mech with it.

That's a good point. But they could just adjust case so that it doesn't still destroy the entire section the way it does in the TT game, and instead works more like the blow-out panels on an M1 Abrams, where the compartment is protected.

There should be no damage transfer mechanic though.

The point of a damage transfer mechanic is on the table top game where damage is randomly assigned it keeps valid hits from being rendered useless. Which is a good game design feature.

In the online game, where you can specifically target portions of the enemy, you shouldn't be able to shoot the same destroyed arm over and over again until you eventually destroy the torso.

Just one of the many differences that needs to exist between TT and online play.

Edited by Death Mallet, 29 June 2012 - 11:31 AM.

[Thaygood]

As long as it looks good, sounds good, feels good, and the physics are right from the point of the explosion then I will be happy.

[Sychodemus]

Actually, the Abrams uses a system more closely related to CASE II, since it doesn't automatically destroy the location (i.e. turret), but that is BT for you. (Which puts all ammo in the hull anyway.)

Ammo explosions in BT have always been way, way, WAY off the mark. This, of course, means that they will be included in MWO in one form or another.

[Fastred]

Fire and Salt, on 29 June 2012 - 11:07 AM, said:

It really has to be weapon specific though... not based on damage of the weapon necessarily...


Gauss rounds should never explode... all they are is pieces if metal... no gunpowder etc.

I believe the rules were apended specifically for the innert guass rifle ammo.

[skamage]

Death Mallet, on 29 June 2012 - 11:31 AM, said:

That's a good point. But they could just adjust case so that it doesn't still destroy the entire section the way it does in the TT game, and instead works more like the blow-out panels on an M1 Abrams, where the compartment is protected.

There should be no damage transfer mechanic though.

The point of a damage transfer mechanic is on the table top game where damage is randomly assigned it keeps valid hits from being rendered useless. Which is a good game design feature.

In the online game, where you can specifically target portions of the enemy, you shouldn't be able to shoot the same destroyed arm over and over again until you eventually destroy the torso.

Just one of the many differences that needs to exist between TT and online play.

Exactly, should have to aim but I think maybe their point is if the ammo explodes and does more damage than that part of the body will it roll over to the next interior part?

[Xandre Blackheart]

Damage that goes over the number of internals doesn't transfer.

Hits transfer.

So if you take 120 damage on your left torso and have 3 internal left it is destroyed and that's that.

The next hit on the left torso takes armor off the center torso.

At least that's how I recall "damage transfer" working...

[Pacoua]

I wish this could be answered by the Beta testers, but I'm not sure if that is specified within the silence contracted they have to sign before participating.