Jump to content

Why No Black Python (Viper)?


53 replies to this topic

#21 FupDup

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Ace Of Spades
  • Ace Of Spades
  • 26,888 posts
  • LocationThe Keeper of Memes

Posted 11 February 2015 - 09:05 AM

View Postkapusta11, on 11 February 2015 - 08:51 AM, said:

All good points, however I can't agree that timeline advancement will bring power gap issues. If everyone were running with either reflective or Reactive or Hardened or Stealth armor, have Endo or Composite or Reinforced structure and Light Fusion of XXL fusion engine carrying something like AC20 + Heavy PPC + a bunch of SRMs loaded with Tandem-Charge missiles or just AP ammo for AC doesn't sound like a bad idea. This would also force you to pick your targets making "boating" a role, a counter to specific builds, not a way to go. Not going to happen in case of MWO though, is something like 50 "mech packs" away from now.

As for current state of the game, MWO type of "boating" needs to be addressed one way or another since it makes way more weapons/mechs/builds useless than TT tech advancement ever could.

For tech advancement, I was mostly referring to things like DHS, Endo, XL, T2 stuff, all Clan stuff, etc. 3050 seems to have had the most drastic power creep of any year, strangely enough. Stuff past that time frame wasn't usually as drastically crazy as 3050 was compared to 3025. Conspiracy theorists like me might attribute that to "learning their lesson," so to say...

In particular I liked the balance between the different gyro types (Standard/XL/Compact/Heavy Duty)...it makes me sad that MWO just shoves gyro weight into the engine, so we can never have them without rebuilding that part of the mechlab. :(


For Hardened and Stealth armors, they don't counter specific weapon types so they can still be taken down with any weapon type. I had forgotten about Reflective and Reactive however. More armor/defensive items would be nice to have, especially with our current focus on purely offensive items...

Speaking of armor...reflective armor reminds me of Re-Engineered Lasers from 3130. They were heavier and hotter than normal lasers, but with a wee bit more damage. Their main attribute was completely ignoring enemy armor types, for example they slice through Hardened, Ferro-Lamellor, and Reflective Armor just as fast as regular armor. That might make a nice counter to people trying to cram craptons of HA on them, but alas the timeline prevents any of these from being in MWO anytime soon. :\


View Postkapusta11, on 11 February 2015 - 08:51 AM, said:

Broken geometry can be addressed with quirks, you can make exception for that.

To be fair, a number of mechs can have their scaling and/or hitboxes adjusted with or without quirks used there. "55 ton mech size" is quite sad. AWS, I'm also looking at you...


View Postkapusta11, on 11 February 2015 - 08:51 AM, said:

Lights are tanking damage with speed by avoiding it, and compensate for lack of firepower with more opportinities to fire due to greatly reduced exposure time and less risk involved. It's the thing that MWO balances nicely.

I can agree on that part, MWO has actually found some specific situations for lights to be "good" at rather than mostly being cheap/disposable/spammable assets.



View PostThorn Hallis, on 11 February 2015 - 08:51 AM, said:

Most IS Omnis would be DoA, unless PGI finally realizes what makes a 'Mech XL friendly and what not.

Some IS Omnis come with SHS, as well as hardwired CASE with their XL engines. The 40 ton Strider has a STD engine. Sometimes I wonder what the mech builders who made them were smoking...

Edited by FupDup, 11 February 2015 - 09:11 AM.


#22 Saint Scarlett Johan

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Hearing Impaired
  • Hearing Impaired
  • 3,349 posts
  • LocationOn the Delta side of Vicksburg

Posted 11 February 2015 - 09:05 AM

I'd rather not see Clan Bmechs when the IS omnis are trash.

Just think. You could drop the engine to a 350 XL, slap on clan endo and ferro, and since there is no hardlocked equipment you'd have 36 tons for guns. No more need for the now totally outclassed Timberwolf.

But that really just brings to light a bigger issue in balance. Although, with all the balance changes PGI has made, they've made MWO a more balanced game than TT.

#23 Corbenik

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Fallen
  • The Fallen
  • 1,115 posts

Posted 11 February 2015 - 09:56 AM

View PostMeiSooHaityu, on 11 February 2015 - 05:17 AM, said:

Its because it isn't a Black Python, it's a Monty Python.

Its too busy delivering coconuts to King Arthur and his band of merry men.

P.S. look at it this way. If you like the looks of the mech (I do anyway), the Cougar looks ALOT like it (the statue more than the pic). The Cougar won't be here for a while though.

Muh Cougar Posted Image

#24 RedDevil

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Slayer
  • The Slayer
  • 702 posts

Posted 11 February 2015 - 10:00 AM

I think they couldn't make much money from it. Usually they design one chassis that you need to buy at least 3 of, so they triple their money per modeler job.

If they make one good clan battlemech, they'll have to charge triple the regular price for it.

Well I guess they can make the varients, but really there's only one that would be different by swapping an energy mount for a ballistic mount.

Edited by reddevil, 11 February 2015 - 10:05 AM.


#25 MeiSooHaityu

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Knight Errant
  • Knight Errant
  • 10,912 posts
  • LocationMI

Posted 11 February 2015 - 10:55 AM

View PostCorbenik, on 11 February 2015 - 09:56 AM, said:

Muh Cougar Posted Image


I feel your pain! The Cougar is so awesome!

I know it is just an upgraded Adder, but bit is 1000x cooler.

#26 Kristov Kerensky

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • FP Veteran - Beta 1
  • FP Veteran - Beta 1
  • 2,909 posts

Posted 11 February 2015 - 11:23 AM

View PostFupDup, on 11 February 2015 - 08:34 AM, said:

Lack of variants isn't really an issue anymore because PGI invented a non-canon Enforcer variant (5P) for the Resistance pack.


Actually, PGI, Russ actually, stated that player submitted Mech requests need to have 3 existing variants, so PGI deciding to add a Mech that doesn't actually meet that requirement is PGI's call to make, not ours. Technically, the Enforcer has 3 variants at the current timeline.

The Mech requested by the OP doesn't even EXIST until 3051 and only has 2 possible variants for another, what, 8 years after that date or so? It's not an OmniMech, it's a Clan BattleMech, so the possible customizations are bit wider and far more impacting. Clan toys are currently balanced by the fact that you can't customize them too much, which is straight up OmniMech rules from TT and works nicely. A Clan BattleMech however....yeah, swap the engine, add ff/es, save tonnage so you can add a LOT more weapons...right, talk about blowing balance right out of the water.

I get it, really, I do, people want UberMechs like they had in MW4. People need to accept that exceptionally unbalanced Mechs from BTech probably won't make it to MWO, and if they do, expect them to be severely neutered so they don't totally skew game balance as they did in TT.

#27 Ghogiel

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • CS 2021 Gold Champ
  • CS 2021 Gold Champ
  • 6,852 posts

Posted 11 February 2015 - 11:52 AM

View PostFupDup, on 11 February 2015 - 08:34 AM, said:

Lack of variants isn't really an issue anymore because PGI invented a non-canon Enforcer variant (5P) for the Resistance pack.

I think a bunch of hero mechs aren't really canon as well. In my mind this was going to happen with a regular variant at some point. And a good thing too. The 3 variant rule was stopping several cool mechs from making it into the game.

#28 Tahribator

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Fire
  • Fire
  • 1,565 posts

Posted 11 February 2015 - 11:59 AM

Oh god it looks hideous and out of place honestly.

#29 kapusta11

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Little Helper
  • Little Helper
  • 3,854 posts

Posted 11 February 2015 - 12:01 PM

View PostTahribator, on 11 February 2015 - 11:59 AM, said:

Oh god it looks hideous and out of place honestly.


Looks fine to me.

Posted Image

Edited by kapusta11, 11 February 2015 - 12:01 PM.


#30 Mechwarrior Buddah

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Legendary Founder
  • Legendary Founder
  • 13,459 posts
  • LocationUSA

Posted 11 February 2015 - 12:15 PM

clan battlemechs will obsolete clan omnis. IE completely backwards as it should have been lol

#31 kapusta11

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Little Helper
  • Little Helper
  • 3,854 posts

Posted 11 February 2015 - 12:17 PM

View PostMechwarrior Buddah, on 11 February 2015 - 12:15 PM, said:

clan battlemechs will obsolete clan omnis. IE completely backwards as it should have been lol


So what? IS Omnis will be DOA.

#32 Metus regem

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Sureshot
  • The Sureshot
  • 10,282 posts
  • LocationNAIS College of Military Science OCS courses

Posted 11 February 2015 - 01:45 PM

View Postkapusta11, on 11 February 2015 - 12:17 PM, said:


So what? IS Omnis will be DOA.


Honestly, they should re-design the system, to let omni's have just pod space, a set armour / internals type, heat sink type, engine size and some locked equipment...

Battlemechs should have hard points, locked equipment and engine sizes, locked internal type, the rest could be variable though.

#33 topgun505

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Ace Of Spades
  • Ace Of Spades
  • 1,625 posts
  • Facebook: Link
  • LocationOhio

Posted 11 February 2015 - 01:46 PM

The Supernova 4 is a naughty machine. ;)

#34 Metus regem

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Sureshot
  • The Sureshot
  • 10,282 posts
  • LocationNAIS College of Military Science OCS courses

Posted 11 February 2015 - 01:49 PM

View Posttopgun505, on 11 February 2015 - 01:46 PM, said:

The Supernova 4 is a naughty machine. ;)


One word,

Kodiak

8 cERML
2 cSSRM 6
1 cERLL
1 cUAC 20

Clan 400XL....

#35 FupDup

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Ace Of Spades
  • Ace Of Spades
  • 26,888 posts
  • LocationThe Keeper of Memes

Posted 11 February 2015 - 01:52 PM

My old favorite is the Hellstar. 95 ton 4 CERPPC boat with XL385 and 30 DHS. In a turn-based land it would be heat neutral and could just bombard forever and ever, but in MWO it would explode even on chainfire mode. :\

But at least I could make it into a Wubstar instead with LPL...

Edited by FupDup, 11 February 2015 - 01:52 PM.


#36 Kristov Kerensky

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • FP Veteran - Beta 1
  • FP Veteran - Beta 1
  • 2,909 posts

Posted 11 February 2015 - 02:22 PM

View PostMetus regem, on 11 February 2015 - 01:45 PM, said:


Honestly, they should re-design the system, to let omni's have just pod space, a set armour / internals type, heat sink type, engine size and some locked equipment...

Battlemechs should have hard points, locked equipment and engine sizes, locked internal type, the rest could be variable though.


Well, you kinda got in the park with how they should do Mechs...sorta?

You want MW4, which did mostly what you want.

#37 Metus regem

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • The Sureshot
  • The Sureshot
  • 10,282 posts
  • LocationNAIS College of Military Science OCS courses

Posted 11 February 2015 - 02:52 PM

View PostKristov Kerensky, on 11 February 2015 - 02:22 PM, said:


Well, you kinda got in the park with how they should do Mechs...sorta?

You want MW4, which did mostly what you want.


No... MW4 was garbage.

What I want is more akin to TT, than the current genaric mech shooter online with battletech skins we have now.

#38 DaZur

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Elite Founder
  • Elite Founder
  • 7,511 posts
  • LocationWisconsin

Posted 11 February 2015 - 02:57 PM

Posted Image

I'm not even sure Alex or Bish could fix this monstrosity... :blink:

#39 FupDup

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Ace Of Spades
  • Ace Of Spades
  • 26,888 posts
  • LocationThe Keeper of Memes

Posted 11 February 2015 - 02:59 PM

View PostDaZur, on 11 February 2015 - 02:57 PM, said:

Posted Image

I'm not even sure Alex or Bish could fix this monstrosity... :blink:

One of the TT miniatures made it presentable:

Posted Image

I think Alex could make it even betterer.

#40 DaZur

    Member

  • PipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPipPip
  • Elite Founder
  • Elite Founder
  • 7,511 posts
  • LocationWisconsin

Posted 11 February 2015 - 03:11 PM

View PostFupDup, on 11 February 2015 - 02:59 PM, said:

One of the TT miniatures made it presentable:

Posted Image

I think Alex could make it even betterer.

Better... But still looks like it's pretending to be an airplane. At least it lost the "twiggy" legs.

Must be doing heavy squats. :P





4 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 4 guests, 0 anonymous users