138 replies to this topic

[Ghogiel]

Fenrisulvyn, on 19 February 2015 - 06:15 AM, said:

Funny how the NPPs are back on the "hide & shutdown to preserve KD ratios" strawman again, in a thread that's about Team Treason while the last man is trying to fight to the end.

Why, its almost as if they are being dishonest.

I only replied since my name was invoked. I'm not interested in the OP or any other tangent in this discussion.

Fenrisulvyn, on 19 February 2015 - 06:19 AM, said:

Ghogiel: "The way your teeth are gnashing you probably are a griefer, so I'll take that as a yes."

I asked if you report before the match is over and how you can tell the pilot is refusing to engage before the match is over.

You're not going to deny it, are you? You report people before you really know what they are doing?

I will usually screenshot during the match and report at some point inbetween searches there after.

Edited by Ghogiel, 19 February 2015 - 06:31 AM.

[C E Dwyer]

People that reported you OP are the ones most likely to get moderated for wasting supports time.

[mogs01gt]

Cathy, on 19 February 2015 - 06:41 AM, said:

People that reported you OP are the ones most likely to get moderated for wasting supports time.

Support time LMAO!! The mods need to get off their ass and ban more trolls!

[Raggedyman]

Rushin Roulette, on 19 February 2015 - 05:49 AM, said:

Um I seem to remember there being more than one objective for just about every game mode (The only game mode with only one objective is Attacking in CW where you need to destroy the Omega cannon)... Do you mind informing us what the complete objectives for Skirmish are?

All the other team dead
Team with most kills after 15 minutes

However this has been proven to be a typo in a court of Lol, and it should of read "Until your continued playing screws with my schedule as Time Is CBills"

[Mystere]

Fenrisulvyn, on 19 February 2015 - 05:24 AM, said:

Won't happen. We have some selfish entitled brats who think that because the match is over for them, it should be over for everyone else. Perhaps skirmish mode should be - "first team to 7 kills ends match so the brats can get back to their grind"

I think a "first team to get 1 kill wins" mode will be a whole lot more interesting (for a while anyway). It can potentially cover a wide spectrum of behavior from "Rambo" on one extreme to "Turtle" on the other.

Edited by Mystere, 19 February 2015 - 11:49 AM.

[Mystere]

mogs01gt, on 19 February 2015 - 06:20 AM, said:

Im in the minority but if we had an in-game report tool, I'd report you for non-participation. You are trolling your opponents since you are faster then they are and are exploited PGI's poor programming. Also, you are simply forcing the other team to take a tie and receive less Cbills. You lost, go die!

Whoa! Did you just say that going for a tie is a reportable offense? Really?

[Kristov Kerensky]

Kjudoon, on 19 February 2015 - 05:55 AM, said:

According to the non-participation police, I was reportable for this match. I went 4 minutes without engaging or firing a shot. Skip ahead to 10:00 if you want to see my heinous crime in action.

And this is why the problem continues, people purposely sowing confusion about the rules.

Assault, objectives are to capture the enemy base OR kill the enemy team. You want to go hide and be a coward, go right ahead, its NOT against the rules, since the enemy only has to capture your base to win, not kill you.

You know this, so do your supporters who are cheering on your sowing of confusion, and yet you continue to do it and call others names, belittle them and insult them.

I'm about to the point of giving up on you people having any sort of sensible debate and just reporting your posts, especially the ones where you tell people to break the rules after you acknowledge those same rules. Tempting...really is...you and your supporters are constantly breaking the rules for the forums, you do realize that don't you?

[MechWarrior3671771]

Oh lookie, Kristov is going to report us for not agreeing with him, after making up a bunch of fake reasons why we are in violation.

Gee that sure sounds familiar... oh that's right, pretending we "want to go hide and be cowards" despite the fact that we have repeatedly told him we just want to fight to the end.

[Morticia Mellian]

Skarlock, on 16 February 2015 - 12:12 PM, said:

So in Starcraft II, they had a similar problem that would show up every once in a while. Terran players can lift off some of their buildings from the ground and fly them around, and they aren't considered defeated until all of them have been destroyed, even if all of their troops are dead. In some cases, it was possible for a Terran player to force an opponent to make air units and scour every inch of the map with them to find the last terran buildings, which could be very time consuming as they could be spread out all over the place and they can move (slowly). Other races also had similar annoying ways to drag out a game involving building construction. It wasn't game breaking by any means, but it was annoying that an opponent who had no way of fighting back could prolong the game end by a huge amount through lame tactics.

The solution Blizzard came up with is simple. When a player has no worker producing bases on the ground, a timer starts counting. Once the timer is expired, the location of all of their remaining buildings is revealed to all players.

I think a similar solution, where the location of the powered down or otherwise hiding mech is revealed to all after say, 2 or 3 minutes of not giving or receiving combat damage once five minutes has passed into the match, would be the most elegant. It should only work in skirmish mode, since you can simply cap points or your opponents base to quickly end the game in other modes.

Phh, I did that with Terrans in Starcraft 1 back in the day.

[Kristov Kerensky]

Fenrisulvyn, on 19 February 2015 - 12:01 PM, said:

Oh lookie, Kristov is going to report us for not agreeing with him, after making up a bunch of fake reasons why we are in violation.

Gee that sure sounds familiar... oh that's right, pretending we "want to go hide and be cowards" despite the fact that we have repeatedly told him we just want to fight to the end.

Fake reasons? Insulting me and others who don't agree with you and calling us names, you DO realize those are violations of the CoC for the forums don't you? Or will you try and claim 'freedom of speech' for an online private venue? Try that, see how far it gets you.

[Morticia Mellian]

I am getting the impression that if Natasha Kerensky aka Black Widow played MWO, would get reported for Non-Participation, considering many of her tactics. >.>

[MechWarrior3671771]

Again, calls for civility from a guy who accuses us of "wanting to go hide and be cowards". That's rich.

[Kristov Kerensky]

Morticia, it's unlikely she would even want to play the game since it's such a poor representation of Mech combat according to the novels and BTech lore. She'd want to know why she can't SEE anything, just that little 70 degree view to the front, when a Mech has a 360 view compressed into 160. She'd want to know where the joysticks(2) are, where the foot pedals are, and where's the neurohelmet? And that's just the presentation, won't even get into the actual mechanics that she would be expecting that we don't get in MWO.

The rules wouldn't give her any trouble, the game play would undoubtedly drive her nuts however. There is mention of Mech Warriors playing games in the BTech novels/lore, but it's a far cry from what we get in MWO, so it's not likely she'd want to play it.

Fenris, if hiding and shutting down to avoid dying as the LSM isn't cowardice, what is it? People keep saying the protecting KDR is a straw man(despite that actually being cited by people doing it on these very forums as the reason they do it), and griefing is also a straw man(again, despite that being the cited reason by the people doing it on these very forums), so that leaves what? All I can think of is cowardice, since your side has removed the real reasons it's done as straw men, there's not much else left. There's no tactical point in doing it in a video game when it can't get you a win or a draw, only a loss, so...what else is left?

As I told Mystere, give me a logical tactical reason for it, I'll back you, but without that....

[Mystere]

Kristov Kerensky, on 19 February 2015 - 03:23 PM, said:

As I told Mystere, give me a logical tactical reason for it, I'll back you, but without that....

You've already been told that: making the enemy earn the last kill instead of just giving it away.

The fact that you and others refuse to accept it as a valid reason does not mean it is not.

I think someone who, for example, has killed all but two of enemy team has every right to self preservation once badly damaged and out of ammo. You can't exactly say that player is guilty of "non-participation".

Edited by Mystere, 19 February 2015 - 04:32 PM.

[James Eckelman]

i know its almost been a year, but i just spend about 2 hours (guess im a slow reader) reading the first 5 pages of this thread, skipping to page 7, andfrankly, im hurt by having to waste my time to not find a clear answer. I still need to check the link at the end of page 4. you know, when you play a game for 15 minutes imho its just not as painful as having to read this thread.now, the idea i am getting here, is that you know, some of the players here normially get 4-5 kills in a game, others may not get more then 1 or 2 every 3 or 4 games. there isnt a set rule for everyone because of another rule that isnt covered here: rushing an enemy with no tactical benefit. I assume this means at the beginning. but also i see that there is no tactical benefit in just giving up. and suiciding in any form is technically against the spirit of hte game. a large part of this thread is treating the enemy like they are your friend. but its still a competition. and truely, the spirit of the game has in itself a last man standing. for some players i can see here, your just supposed to finish your job, get your 5 kills, and win the match. for others, they know themselves well enough to see (and with their stats also) that just for them to get 1 kill in the game with a team aiding them is only about a 33% chance, let alone having to fave multiple mechs alone. is giving up in the spirit of the match? it sure sounds like it. after all we all love so much dieing in MWO. theres no way to say there isnt a pain involved in dieing in ANY form. so where is it at? well dieing foolishly by suicide or by rushing the enemy with no tactical gain is not in the spirit of the game, and is in fact collusion on an implied level with the enemy team. however, a player that can get several kills in a game can have a tactical advantage engaging as a LSM. How it stands after what ive read here: a better player is obligated to not hide, as they have shown in their stats (Gaining 3-5 kills in 1 game on average) that they are capible to clutch . but another player who gets only 1 or 2 kills every 4-5 games (as an example, you know who you are) is indeed obligated to hide, because suicide or engaging the enemy at their KDR will not bring a tactical advanage, and that is not in the spirit of the game> if you read my post. thank you. but i wont hear another word from anyone here about this. I will only accept an official moderator's acceptance or denial of my claim. if there isnt a mod responce after all this time. then what i say is agreed with, but there are other agendas that are interfereing with the address of this issue, which i would assume is a clarification on what is in the spirit of hte game, and a lot of players have agreed into this "unsaid" collusion, when it is in fact against the spirit of the game.yes im referring to skirmish.

[Kjudoon]

Mystere, on 19 February 2015 - 11:39 AM, said:

Whoa! Did you just say that going for a tie is a reportable offense? Really?

They did because whiners have too many feels.

[Kjudoon]

Kristov Kerensky, on 19 February 2015 - 11:56 AM, said:

And this is why the problem continues, people purposely sowing confusion about the rules.

Assault, objectives are to capture the enemy base OR kill the enemy team. You want to go hide and be a coward, go right ahead, its NOT against the rules, since the enemy only has to capture your base to win, not kill you.

You know this, so do your supporters who are cheering on your sowing of confusion, and yet you continue to do it and call others names, belittle them and insult them.

I'm about to the point of giving up on you people having any sort of sensible debate and just reporting your posts, especially the ones where you tell people to break the rules after you acknowledge those same rules. Tempting...really is...you and your supporters are constantly breaking the rules for the forums, you do realize that don't you?

Go ahead. Others have and failed many many times (If their statements are to be believed) because I said and did nothing wrong. I won't coddle you or enable your selfishness or narccissism that this all revolves around you. You meet me on the battlefield by accident best come find and kill me if you're good enough. And considerig how bad I am, should be easy... Right?

Edited by Kjudoon, 01 January 2016 - 09:19 PM.

[Davegt27]

Quote

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• 30 posts
Posted 12 February 2015 - 11:15 PM
I just had someone saying the reported me which I am guessing referring to Non-Participation Abuse.

We were remaining 2 v 2, and my remaining teammate in a Dire Wolf was afk or dc until the last 10 seconds of the match. It happens, I know my client crashed me sometimes, forcing my mech into afk/dc.

The remaining opponents were Timber Wolf and Warhawk or Dire Wolf, against my already critical Cicada 3M. I tried doing some hit and runs, but I was critical, so I run off hiding, zig zagging, and keeping track of them from a distance when possible for possible opportunities.

Since it was a tie and for some reason they have not found the AFKed teammate's Dire Wolf, so I kept them focus on finding me to run the clock. If I am not able to effectively win, a tie is the next best thing.

I know can be boring and sucks, but the point of the matches is to win, even if it is to force a tie and stay alive. If the only way to do that is to stay alive by taking advantage of my speed and ecm, than i do so.

So I get a bit miffed when someone accuses me of abuse for aiming to win. I mainly play lights/light-medium mechs, not exactly the sort to easilly go one on one versus a heavier mech, let alone versus two or more heavier mechs. If i had my Raven 3L, would have been better able to take distant pop shots at them.

How restrictive is this Non-Participation Abuse rule?

Sorry to see this happen

I would take this seriously but I am not sure what you can do

[James Eckelman]

Ok so i found it the rules for this issue, its very cut and dry and im sorry i had no idea about these terms of use until i read it myself. this will put te issue to rest for good. the quote is from https://mwomercs.com/conduct :

<quote>
There are situations that do not fall within the scope of what the shutdown mechanic or evasion tactics are intended for. The use of the shutdown mechanic or avoiding contact with the enemy under the following situations may be classed as an act of non-participation, subject to evaluation and moderation actions by Support services:

• Ceasing to meaningfully contribute for the remainder of the match if you still have support equipment, useful modules, or weapons (with any necessary ammo) available. Losing your primary weapon is not an acceptable excuse for hiding and/or shutting down if you still have a secondary weapon, a support-based item such as a TAG, or a consumable module available for use.
  
• Running out the clock, or needlessly extending the duration of the match, in cases where doing so will not assist you towards victory.
  
• Running out the clock or needlessly extending the duration of a Faction Play match in an attempt to keep a particular group or Unit in the current engagement for as long as possible, in cases where doing so will not assist you towards victory, is not considered an acceptable tactic.

Disliking a map or game mode or attempting to preserve a player statistic such as Kill/Death Ratio are not acceptable excuses for non-participation. </quote>

There it is. I'll never powerdown again if i am LSM, ill just have to keep shooting at the enemy until i die.