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Anyone Think That Some Is Mech Variants Are Extinct? Quirk-Up Time?

Started by Zephonarch II, Feb 20 2015 01:54 PM

11 replies to this topic

Poll: Anyone Think That Some Is Mech Variants Are Extinct? Quirk-Up Time? (9 member(s) have cast votes)

With balance issues to keep the game fair for free-players, should some IS mechs get a quirk-identity boost?

  1. Yes (7 votes [77.78%])

    Percentage of vote: 77.78%

  2. No (2 votes [22.22%])

    Percentage of vote: 22.22%

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#1 Zephonarch II

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Posted 20 February 2015 - 01:54 PM

Since 2011/12 MWO has grown significantly. Enough that with the implementation of nerfs and balancing, fun builds like Boomjagers, GaussKats, DakkaBanshees, Good ol' Hunchies, FirestarterMetas, Wubverines, OrionMSpammers, AtlasSSrm4junkies, Highlanders and Victors, Lrm-Boat-Apocalypse builds,... etc. etc. Came out of circulation, or popularity. Which means it did not have to end with Quirks put into place not long ago. But recently, with the latest patch, the IS took a big hit, and also a very swift slap to the face. Quirks seem to have went down the "Jack-of-all-trades" route and made no Mech excel at one thing.

There are a few IS mechs I've noticed that have specifically intended builds by the devs. Some that I'll post my first impressions I guess. But are they fun? Hook points to buy them? Or are they just the only mechs that work now?
[And by the way, if I'm forgetting one please comment below. These are just the changes that stood out to me]
-BJ-3 Use PPCs!!!
-CDA-3C You can rapid fire an ERPPC on this now?
-TDR-9SE Ah!!! No more wubbing? WHAT WILL YOU GIVE US DEVS? It just has LLs quirks now... fine. This could work. Could.
-ON1-M My CQC Quirks!!! NO!!! I can still use SRM6s though It measures up I guess.
-ON1-K No UAC5 quirk now, just big boosts to almost everything. This is my mini-atlas now.
-CTF-3D Oh, it has perks now
-Victors Oh, they have perks now. Do they excel at anything? Nope. Hm... The Victor will never be great again, will it??? :(
-Dragons Wow, you guys have it easy. I hope your big arm doesn't get blown off too fast so you can use those big AC quirks.
-WVR-6R Shouldn't this make use of AC2 quirks not AC5s? The quirks better be worth it. I think you'd have to sacrafice speed for more ammo if you use these AC5s to their best ability.
-BJ-1DC/1 Okay the AC2 quirks are good I guess. But the 1DC had AC5 quirks that worked, what now? Jack up the AC2s, I'm barely denting people with these. Cooldown boosts!
-Panthers I hope you don't overheat with those pop-tart wanna-be PPC quirks. You are practically a slim-jim-vindicator Panther. Snipe with finesse.
-Firestarters You can still meta whatever laser gun you want... But you despecified which meta goes to which variant!!!(for the most part) AND COULD YOU GIVE A FIRESTARTER SOME FLAMER QUIRKS!!! AT LEAST 2 OF THEM!!? PLEASE?
SDR-5K -Ballistic Range: +45% .... XD, URBIE BUILD TIME!!!!!
#THEURBIESARECOMING!!!THEURBIESARECOMING!!!!!!

Downsides:
WVR-6K -So now it's a LLmeta now??? Is it worth it now?
AS7-S -Can we still Spam our foes with SRM4s like we used to?
-BNC-3M So now you want us to meta PPCs on this??? I preferred the LPL quirks
-Jagers -We will never see people love these things for Gauss/AC20/RapidDakka AC2 builds again, will we? So Clans can dakka whatever but we can barely get slow Jagers jumped with every AC2/Gauss/AC20 to work without quirks? I really miss piloting the S-variant. :(. (People Don't fear these as much as other mechs now...) :(
Catapults -I never pilot these, but do they measure up to MadDogs or Summoners with Lrms/Srms? Their arms keep falling off...
---> PETITION TO GLOBALLY SIZE THE CATS TO A SMALLER SCALE!! WITH ARM-ARMOUR BOOSTS!! It's not worth it to pilot these without general lrm speed quirks, range. I'm pulling for you Cat pilots. I think your lrms are less effective at the moment.
-QKD-5K -It's not a jump sniper anymore...
HBK-4G and 4H -Shoudln't these quirks be inverted? The 4G is just wasting these 3 ballistic slots. It should have 3 AC2s. And the 4H should have AC20 quirks right? Doesn't that make sense?



This list should just show my shallowest opinion on where I think quirks should be going. It's my perogative, but probably not others. I think some old builds need to revived for the sake of making the game fun again and making MICRO-tweaks, because I don't want to lose those gimmicks again. I miss when MWO had builds that provided "OH CRAP!!!!" moments, but from all parts of the game. Clan mechs seem to dominate in Specialist builds. We need moments like as if you somehow beat a Gauss Kat-K2, it's not because hit-reg was bad, it's because you somehow went above everything else and took out their weakened side torsos once and for all, and disarmed it for good. You need skillful moments like that, otherwise the game gets broken. And the IS (imo) is lackluster to newbies who have no clue about what quirks make which variant of which mech good. There should be at least one standout variant for every IS Mech. And there's my rant.

UPDATE: Includes Entire Quirk list(Feb 25/2015):

IS LIGHT MECH QUIRKS -----
Spoiler


IS Medium Mech Quirks:
Spoiler


IS Heavy Mech Quirks:
Spoiler


IS Assault Mech Quirks:
Spoiler


Heavy and Assault Class Clan Mech OMNI-Pod Quirks:
Spoiler


Light and Medium Clan Mech OMNI-Pod Quirks:
Spoiler


I apologize for the format of the Light, Medium, and Assault mechs. I'm new to BBCoding.

Edited by Zephonarch II, 25 February 2015 - 05:37 PM.

#2 Count Zero 74

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Posted 20 February 2015 - 02:03 PM

View PostZephonarch II, on 20 February 2015 - 01:54 PM, said:


-TDR-9SE Ah!!! No more wubbing? WHAT WILL YOU GIVE US DEVS? It just has LLs quirks now... fine. This could work. Could.



Which LLs quirks are u talking about? Is that some Special 9SE? Because mine has Large Pulse Quirks.

#3 Zephonarch II

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Posted 20 February 2015 - 02:46 PM

View PostCount Zero 74, on 20 February 2015 - 02:03 PM, said:


Which LLs quirks are u talking about? Is that some Special 9SE? Because mine has Large Pulse Quirks.

whoops, my mistake. :unsure:

#4 Nightmare1

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Posted 20 February 2015 - 03:25 PM

Yes, definitely. Some Mechs are designed for certain rolls. Case in point, HBKs are always going to be the ballistic slingers, especially with regard to the AC/20.

Now, if PGI would just fix that LRM quirk on the Quickdraws back to an SRM quirk...

Those are brawler Mechs. Not LRM boats. Let's use some common sense with the quirking.

#5 Burktross

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Posted 20 February 2015 - 04:50 PM

Don't you lay a hand on my hunchie quirks, he's perfect.

#6 Astarot

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Posted 20 February 2015 - 05:06 PM

Please define free play players? Because while people that pay money get access to mechs early, all mechs that come out, free play players can get them as well after a set amount of time.

While I agree that quirks should have a pass at, you have to remember something. Because of how you build something does not mean someone is going to build the same. Quirks may encourage people to build something as a LRM boat, because it has LRMs does not mean that people will build it as an LRM boat.

Quirks are a weird thing, that they have to be balanced so that you give something just enough of a specialty, but at the same time, keep it broad enough to allow a multitude of different builds without making that broad target over powered.

Clan mechs are not over powered, as the vocal minority likes people to believe they are. They are very specialized, while Inner sphere mechs are very generalized. Basically this means that Inner sphere mechs are a broader ranges of builds then the Clanner mechs do, that also means unless someone knows you as a person. they may have a harder time knowing exactly how to counter your build. While each clan mech selections of builds are much more narrow.

I'm sorry that I can't support this thread as every quirk suggestion you provide seems to be target how you think a mech should be played. You even said yourself that you didn't know how to quirk the cat because you really never played them much. You are attempting to balanced mechs on your own personal preference and taste, which is bad, as I stated, how you play a mech, and how someone plays a mech are two different things.

Edited by Astarot, 20 February 2015 - 05:11 PM.

#7 Alienized

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Posted 20 February 2015 - 05:17 PM

quickdraw-5k never was a good jump-sniper.
now its a awesomeroflstompmachine.
if they would switch the large laser quirks to large pulse laser quirks then... it would be overquirked lol.
its fine where it is atm.

banshee 3m only got ppc velocity quirks... useless.
it just had ppc stock. (and was completely undergunned)
rather stick to whatever you done before.

the victor... its an assault but cant assault alone. dies so fast.
usually doesnt have the teammates to shine.

i still dont get why they removed the ac5 quirks from the blackjack-1DC. it was at a good place.
the -1x as well.... so literally all you can do with those 2 is boat medium lasers.... wow....

#8 Tastian

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Posted 20 February 2015 - 05:22 PM

This poll makes no sense. What does Quirks have to do with Free players? I thought mech hardpoints, geometry, and quirks already give mechs an identity boost (beyond their existing size, speed, armor, and equipment). Most quirks are even split into a specific weapon and class weapon. What additional boost would you like to see?

#9 Wildstreak

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Posted 20 February 2015 - 06:01 PM

View PostZephonarch II, on 20 February 2015 - 01:54 PM, said:

HBK-4G and 4H -Shoudln't these quirks be inverted? The 4G is just wasting these 3 ballistic slots. It should have 3 AC2s. And the 4H should have AC20 quirks right? Doesn't that make sense?

Doesn't it make sense to read the quirks they have?
HBK-4G without AC 20 and HBK-4H without AC10, the 4G has 2.5% better Ballistic range and cooldown quirks and a 12.5% Velocity quirk not on the 4H, a 5% higher generic Energy Heat quirk (though 5% less for ML) and a 15% Energy range quirk that is also not on the 4H.
I have not gone through the rest of this list but really.... :huh:

#10 Zephonarch II

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Posted 22 February 2015 - 02:34 PM

View PostTastian, on 20 February 2015 - 05:22 PM, said:

This poll makes no sense. What does Quirks have to do with Free players? I thought mech hardpoints, geometry, and quirks already give mechs an identity boost (beyond their existing size, speed, armor, and equipment). Most quirks are even split into a specific weapon and class weapon. What additional boost would you like to see?


Alright, I'll enunciate. I've barely put over 40 dollars into the game, and half of that was to get a better palette of paint for my Mechs. But anyways I'm not willing to buy Clan mechs with actual money because I've played the game long enough to know I can purchase them with time and due care of not spending on whatever distracts me. So with that said, I'm left with a manageable range for buying IS mechs. Lights to heavies. Now before the Clans were introduced people knew which builds stood out. Good builds that worked no matter what. But fast forward here and Clan Omni-pods give players with that Superior brand fast brawling 6 StreakSRM6 Stormcrows, 6lrm5 MadDogs, and the meta-anything Dire (which I can predict)(however it's still very slow, it has a crap torso twist yaw, and it's smaller height just makes it rounder than an atlas). It's just some builds are way too effective, making me rethink my stance a while ago where I thought "oh, MWO could become a pay-2-win like any other free game.".

Some IS mech builds have gone extinct and just don't measure up in-game. We do have Thunderbolts, the Awesome, Hunchies, and others that have intended builds. But there are others that have no allure to them any more. My Spider-5D is still a pretty good mech, it makes up in comparison to the Uller by having the flexible engine options available, The 5K may be a great MG light. Some quirks though I think have made me altogether lost interest in piloting some mechs. My HBK-4SP has srm6 quirks with medium lasers but it doesn't even feel effective in-game when I ran the build. It is my opinion, and it's always up for debate, but I'm ready to question anything. Practically, I think some quirks are badly placed in some mechs.

View PostWildstreak, on 20 February 2015 - 06:01 PM, said:

Doesn't it make sense to read the quirks they have?
HBK-4G without AC 20 and HBK-4H without AC10, the 4G has 2.5% better Ballistic range and cooldown quirks and a 12.5% Velocity quirk not on the 4H, a 5% higher generic Energy Heat quirk (though 5% less for ML) and a 15% Energy range quirk that is also not on the 4H.
I have not gone through the rest of this list but really.... :huh:

I just looked at the hardpoints. If the 4G has 3 ballistic hardpoints, you could opt for 3ac2s or 3mgs to make use of the space. So to me: the 4G could have 3ac2s, 2-3mpls the 4H an AC20 with 4-5mls, they'd be slow Mediums I think, but they use the hardpoints. Otherewise we have your suggestion, the quirks in place make other builds unique between each variant. But the intended AC20 and 10 quirks look misplaced. It's been since the Alpha, that I've piloted those little guys. If AC2s were any better now, and the 4G had ac2 quirks enough that it'd be a mini-macro platform I guess no one would rant at me. Sorry Hunchy pilots if I offended you. I just observed the 3 hardpoints and thought the quirks were misplaced. Your builds must work then. But my 1DCs heart got ripped out and lost it's personality. The XL engine in mine I run makes it go 67km with speed tweak! 67k! the AC5s made it a pretty irritating mech with those high-strung arms. Great for peak sniping. But sure, AC2s will do for now.


Roles guys. Does every IS mech have a head-turning build that makes it unique and not a dust collector? I was just frustrated last patch, and "Role Warfare"; that "promise" might not be a priority right now. Maybe next month, or after the CW beta.

#11 Wildstreak

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Posted 24 February 2015 - 01:49 PM

The 4G got its quirks partly because of stock build, number of hardpoints is not the focus of a quirk, in addition a number of people run the AC20 4G. Do we penalize those players because YOU want AC2 quirks on the 4G?
Same logic applies to the 4H.

This sounds more like what you want the quirks to be to suit what you like to do.

#12 Zephonarch II

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Posted 25 February 2015 - 04:55 PM

View PostWildstreak, on 24 February 2015 - 01:49 PM, said:

The 4G got its quirks partly because of stock build, number of hardpoints is not the focus of a quirk, in addition a number of people run the AC20 4G. Do we penalize those players because YOU want AC2 quirks on the 4G?
Same logic applies to the 4H.

This sounds more like what you want the quirks to be to suit what you like to do.


Well the topic is about improving quirks. I can pitch my ideas but I don't know where y'all think there are some misplaced quirks. And I have piloted a HBK-4H before, but sorry if my preferences/complaints aren't what the community wants. We're all different. Maybe most people think the game is balanced now. The point though is If the devs had a very precise list of where people want quirk-directed builds, that might help. With comments to back up a poll. I guess this is a discussion thread in the end, because I didn't set any specifics. My bad. That is what I intended for this thread though. Not for people to fixate on one guy's opinion, and not share theirs. Sorry. I'll include a list of all quirks so people don't have to reference Smurfy? I'd have to add an interactive poll for it then too.

Shoot, this is turning into a rant. That's not the point here. Man, why are people so cynical? Express your observations about what you want. DID I NOT SAY THAT IN THE FIRST POST?

View PostZephonarch II, on 20 February 2015 - 01:54 PM, said:

...
"[And by the way, if I'm forgetting one please comment below. These are just the changes that stood out to me]"

...list

... "It's my perogative, but probably not others. "
...

That includes: "You aren't reading the quirks properly, and because of that that you don't understand that the Hunchy is fine!" FINE! EXCUSE ME FOR LOOKING AT THE QUIRKS DIFFERENTLY. Pardon me, I'm not trying to demand builds I'd like just for myself, I'd just want to see if the whole community wants one they can all agree on. ANYTHING ELSE THOUGH? I'll put a list of quirks up now, so feel free. Point. I apologize for not giving the formal stats accounts for this apparently hostile topic.
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