43 replies to this topic

[Tarogato]

What if concealment ... was a thing in MWO?

If you're not familiar with the term, 'cover' absorbs the enemy’s fire, while 'concealment' simply visually obscures your position from the enemy. I'm talking about objects like trees and bushes, which are transparent objects in MWO, which could be used to break line of sight and targeting, but still be shot through. Possibly even larger clouds of smoke, as another example. World of Tanks has a decently sophisticated cover and concealment system, I think a much simpler version of that could be nice for MWO. Imagine, for instance, if parts of Alpine Peaks were coated in evergreens and all of them provided concealment against enemy targeting?
Go forth and discuss!

Edited by Tarogato, 26 February 2015 - 04:41 AM.

[El Bandito]

Sure, and I am all over for destructible trees and foliage that can block shots/missiles. Perhaps Flamers can ignite the said trees and cause forest fires and overheat every mech inside it, MUAHAHAHAHAHA!


One can only dream...

Edited by El Bandito, 26 February 2015 - 01:46 AM.

[Sarlic]

El Bandito, on 26 February 2015 - 01:46 AM, said:

Sure, and I am all over for destructible trees and foliage that can block shots/missiles. Perhaps Flamers can ignite the said trees and cause forest fires and overheat every mech inside it, MUAHAHAHAHAHA!


One can only dream...

It would be beautiful. Smoke, fire and melting metal.

[Lynx7725]

To be honest, all the complaining about hard cover that doesn't block LRMs, I'd have thought those would be the mythical "soft cover"...

[TheArisen]

I know it can be hard to do, but how about we take it even further and add destructible cover?

[HellJumper]

El Bandito, on 26 February 2015 - 01:46 AM, said:

Sure, and I am all over for destructible trees and foliage that can block shots/missiles. Perhaps Flamers can ignite the said trees and cause forest fires and overheat every mech inside it, MUAHAHAHAHAHA!


One can only dream...

yup..only in dreams..

@OP not happening.. devs cant do it unfortunately...

[sneeking]

Destructible terrain must come first, then soft cover hard cover.

Yes please !

How much atmosphere would this add

[Escef]

Tarogato, on 26 February 2015 - 01:24 AM, said:

What if soft cover ... was a thing in MWO?

You probably have no idea what I'm talking about because I just came up with that term up off the top of my head,...

Gee, y'think? I think qarbuffle should be a thing in MWO, but you probably don't know what that means because I just pulled the term out of the nether reaches of my posterior.

Tarogato, on 26 February 2015 - 01:24 AM, said:

...but I mean things like trees and bushes counting as cover for LoS spotting, possibly even larger clouds of smoke. World of Tanks has a decently sophisticated cover system, but I think a much simpler version of that could be nice for MWO. Imagine, for instance, if parts of Alpine Peaks were coated in evergreens and all of them broke LoS?

Go forth and discuss!

Concealment, the word you want is concealment. For example, a concrete wall provides cover from small arms fire, a window curtain provides concealment. We actually have a lot of this in Viridian Bog, there have been a few times I've tried to shoot at glimpses of mechs through the canopies and hit a great big pile of nope.

[Sarlic]

I really liked the destructable things in Battlefield Bad Company. Last one i have played.

[Kiiyor]

Sarlic, on 26 February 2015 - 01:48 AM, said:

It would be beautiful. Smoke, fire and melting metal.

Smells like.... Victory

[Joseph Mallan]

Tarogato, on 26 February 2015 - 01:24 AM, said:

What if soft cover ... was a thing in MWO?

You probably have no idea what I'm talking about because I just came up with that term up off the top of my head, but I mean things like trees and bushes counting as cover for LoS spotting, possibly even larger clouds of smoke. World of Tanks has a decently sophisticated cover system, but I think a much simpler version of that could be nice for MWO. Imagine, for instance, if parts of Alpine Peaks were coated in evergreens and all of them broke LoS?

Go forth and discuss!

The term for this is not cover, its concealment.

[sneeking]

Joseph Mallan, on 26 February 2015 - 02:15 AM, said:

The term for this is not cover, its concealment.

There are three levels of cover...

Concealment, obstruction ( may be partial ) to view no reduction to fire.

Soft cover ( this person didn't invent the phrase iv heard it before ) obstruction ( may also be partial ) to view partial ( or full ) obstruction with only reduced lethality to fire.

Hard cover, obstruction ( more likely to be fully ) to view and zero lethality.

Edited by sneeking, 26 February 2015 - 02:41 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

sneeking, on 26 February 2015 - 02:39 AM, said:

There are three levels of cover...

Concealment, obstruction ( may be partial ) to view no reduction to fire.

Soft cover ( this person didn't invent the phrase iv heard it before ) obstruction ( may also be partial ) to view partial ( or full ) obstruction with only reduced lethality to fire.

Hard cover, obstruction ( more likely to be fully ) to view and zero lethality.

In teh Marines it was Camouflage, Cover & Concealment...

[MeiSooHaityu]

The game does have soft cover, your team mates .

I do honestly hate being used as a team mates shield, so I try to stay out of that situation ad much as possible.

[zagibu]

Bushes and trees could actually be somewhat effective at blocking laser fire. The focused beam would get dispersed by the particles (although the heat would simply burn it away, so it should be destructible I guess).

[HellJumper]

zagibu, on 26 February 2015 - 03:20 AM, said:

Bushes and trees could actually be somewhat effective at blocking laser fire. The focused beam would get dispersed by the particles (although the heat would simply burn it away, so it should be destructible I guess).

like in MW 4 mercs..but just visually better

[Satan n stuff]

Tarogato, on 26 February 2015 - 01:24 AM, said:

I wish we could get cover that's even half as sophisticated as cover in the STALKER games.
You don't truly appreciate that game's projectile physics system until you're being hose down by a guy wielding a 9x39mm assault rifle and are watching the walls get swiss cheesed all over except where you're standing because there's about 12 feet of solid concrete between you and the shooter.
Then you run out while he's reloading and gun him down at point blank range, stupidly expensive body armor be damned.

I once made the mistake of not backing up quite far enough after throwing a frag grenade around a corner in a ( concrete ) tunnel and got treated to the lovely sight of shrapnel punching though the concrete on the corner and flying right by my head. Miraculously I didn't get hurt much, that probably could have killed me if some of the shrapnel had hit me and it was a really bad section to have to do over.

Edited by Satan n stuff, 26 February 2015 - 04:40 AM.

[Tarogato]

Escef, on 26 February 2015 - 01:57 AM, said:

Concealment, the word you want is concealment.
...
We actually have a lot of this in Viridian Bog, there have been a few times I've tried to shoot at glimpses of mechs through the canopies and hit a great big pile of nope.

Joseph Mallan, on 26 February 2015 - 02:15 AM, said:

The term for this is not cover, its concealment.

sneeking, on 26 February 2015 - 02:39 AM, said:

There are three levels of cover...

Concealment, obstruction ( may be partial ) to view no reduction to fire. ...

Ah, you guys are picky. I altered to thread title and OP to reflect the difference between cover and concealment, because it's obviously the latter I'm looking for. I've actually never heard that term before, so thanks for harping on about it.

@Escef: Viridian Bog assets are actually mostly solid objects with hitboxes though. The branches of the trees, for instance, which extend all the way to the top of the canopy, actually block shots. However, the leaves themselves don't break line of sight, so you can still "see" mechs through them if they're there and shoot them. If you get a hollow triangle, you can hit the mech. The lilypads down on the lower level of the map, however, don't have any physical geometry associated, so as far as the game is concerned, they don't even exist, however your eyes can't actually see through them. It would be nice if they provided proper concealment against targeting/locks so that if you can't see it, you can't lock it.

[Escef]

Tarogato, on 26 February 2015 - 04:52 AM, said:

However, the leaves themselves don't break line of sight, so you can still "see" mechs through them if they're there and shoot them. If you get a hollow triangle, you can hit the mech. The lilypads down on the lower level of the map, however, don't have any physical geometry associated, so as far as the game is concerned, they don't even exist, however your eyes can't actually see through them. It would be nice if they provided proper concealment against targeting/locks so that if you can't see it, you can't lock it.

No, they totally block line of sight, you just still have line of effect. A blind man can still shoot you, his inability to see you simply makes it unlikely.

[Sjorpha]

Concealment mechanics and soft cover would be wondeful, but don't we already have visual concealment?

I mean standing in smoke or trees does in fact visually conceal a mech now, it's just that the targeting sensors still "see" the mech.