71 replies to this topic

[TheCobra]

The Gargoyle mech is currently unplayable, not fun and a liability to the team. This mech takes a spot that a vastly more useful mech could take, it has 2 omnipods with weapon slots, both of wich are the large, low and fragile arms. Can't shoot if I'm close to friendlies because I just end up shooting their backs, since the cockpit is so far from the weapon slots .

Not enough weight for weapons or ammo, fast but not fast enough, this is a skyscrapper of a mech that gets hit easily, it is hard to find cover, since the head is always sticking out.
The speed doesn't matter when everyone and their mother knows you are an easy kill. Just shoot the arms off and it is harmless.

PGI Please fix this mech. 120 bucks on the wave II and every mech is great with exception of the Gargoyle, wich is a complete liability to the team.

[LordKnightFandragon]

Yeah, its bad, even in Training grounds I feel like a derp driving it. That stock build is so bad.

[FupDup]

By almost all accounts it's sub-par, but I wouldn't say that it's totally "unplayable." Vomiting lasers like the status quo can do alright damage, and the mech's durability is decent enough.

What it needs first and foremost is to NOT BE LISTED AS A "HUGE" MECH FOR CLIMBING HILLS. Then add a bit more agility to distinguish its role as a fast assault better, maybe some durability (at least on sub-par Omnipods), then maybe add some weapon quirks to the Omnipods that hardly anybody uses.

[Ultimax]

It's not un-playable, it's harder to play.

Focus on mid-range and brawl builds, conserve armor until things get to that range.


I finnd having a shield side is hugely beneficial.

[Igorius]

The Gargoyle was always an odd duck, from TT to MW2 to now. It plays best if you think of it as a faster heavy, rather than an assault, which is a strange role for something so tall. It's basically the Timber Wolf's strange big brother, without any of the adaptability of its little sibling.

[TheSilken]

Ehem I took down 2 Dires yesterday in a Private match using a Gargoyle. The first one was against 2 back to back Dires and I killed the first and almost got the second one (1 more salvo and I would have had him). The 2nd Dire kill was me in Gargoyle vs 1 Dire head on and I managed to beat him.

Not unplayable just fragile and must be treated as such. Nasty in 1v1 fights though if it gets to you.

Edited by TheSilken, 14 March 2015 - 09:46 AM.

[Deathlike]

I'm not sure what miracles you'd want to make the Gargoyle better... given how it is large as an Atlas but only really suitable from brawling.

Just stuff it with Clan Medium Pulse Lasers (just 6) and the rest with DHS and a Targeting Computer (TCv1) and go to town with it. Maybe you could go 4-5 Clan ER Mediums with Gauss or some large ballistic.

Really, try not to think too hard about the mech. It's fun for what it is... but it's terrible for what you'd think it should do well in, but can't/won't ever.

[Ultimax]

Deathlike, on 14 March 2015 - 09:46 AM, said:

I'm not sure what miracles you'd want to make the Gargoyle better... given how it is large as an Atlas but only really suitable from brawling.

Just stuff it with Clan Medium Pulse Lasers (just 6) and the rest with DHS and a Targeting Computer (TCv1) and go to town with it. Maybe you could go 4-5 Clan ER Mediums with Gauss or some large ballistic.

Really, try not to think too hard about the mech. It's fun for what it is... but it's terrible for what you'd think it should do well in, but can't/won't ever.

The 4 CERMLAS + Gauss is solid at mid-range, that's what I was playing in the match in my sig.

[kapusta11]

Still better than Victor, Highlander, Awesome, Atlas and Battlemaster.

Edited by kapusta11, 14 March 2015 - 09:56 AM.

[Deathlike]

Ultimatum X, on 14 March 2015 - 09:54 AM, said:

The 4 CERMLAS + Gauss is solid at mid-range, that's what I was playing in the match in my sig.

That is my preferable build, which got me 8-kills and Gargles love.

[xe N on]

kapusta11, on 14 March 2015 - 09:55 AM, said:

Still better than Victor, Highlander, Awesome, Atlas and Battlemaster.

/signed

[Saint Scarlett Johan]

Deathlike, on 14 March 2015 - 09:46 AM, said:

I'm not sure what miracles you'd want to make the Gargoyle better... given how it is large as an Atlas but only really suitable from brawling.

Just stuff it with Clan Medium Pulse Lasers (just 6) and the rest with DHS and a Targeting Computer (TCv1) and go to town with it. Maybe you could go 4-5 Clan ER Mediums with Gauss or some large ballistic.

Really, try not to think too hard about the mech. It's fun for what it is... but it's terrible for what you'd think it should do well in, but can't/won't ever.

8 SPLs + TC7 or 12 ERSLs + TC7 or bust.

[Deathlike]

kapusta11, on 14 March 2015 - 09:55 AM, said:

Still better than Victor, Highlander, Awesome, Atlas and Battlemaster.

Victor in limited situations is better. The Highlander is more sturdy when played right (if you ignore the existence of Hoverjets™). Everyone knows the Awesome is the worst Assault regardless. The Atlas is still better. The Battlemaster.. meh?

[Ultimax]

Deathlike, on 14 March 2015 - 09:59 AM, said:

Victor in limited situations is better. The Highlander is more sturdy when played right (if you ignore the existence of Hoverjets™). Everyone knows the Awesome is the worst Assault regardless. The Atlas is still better. The Battlemaster.. meh?

Honestly I've given up on my Lowlanders.

I really would pick the Gargoyle over it at this point in the game.


You just can't take enough JJs for them to feel valuable, while also trying to get a 325 STD and then actual real firepower on that mech.

If I'm going to play a slow, sluggish, brawler - it's going to be a Banshee or an Atlas, not a mech that's only reason to exist is JJs with JJs that are actually borderline worthless.



We can lament the silly state of movement Archtypes, but both the Garg & HGN (and VTR) are HUGE.

I'd rather go 89kph to traverse terrain then waste 2 to 6 tons on JJs.


Once you load a 325STD, 2x JJs - you only have like 30 to 32 tons to work with on an HGN with no heat sinks yet added.

Compare to Garg with 26 + 6 tons, with tonnage efficient Clan weapons.

[Deathlike]

Ultimatum X, on 14 March 2015 - 10:08 AM, said:

Honestly I've given up on my Lowlanders.

I really would pick the Gargoyle over it at this point in the game.


You just can't take enough JJs for them to feel valuable, while also trying to get a 325 STD and then actual real firepower on that mech.

If I'm going to play a slow, sluggish, brawler - it's going to be a Banshee or an Atlas, not a mech that's only reason to exist is JJs with JJs that are actually borderline worthless.



We can lament the silly state of movement Archtypes, but both the Garg & HGN (and VTR) are HUGE.

I'd rather go 89kph to traverse terrain then waste 2 to 6 tons on JJs.


Once you load a 325STD, 2x JJs - you only have like 30 to 32 tons to work with on an HGN with no heat sinks yet added.

Compare to Garg with 26 + 6 tons, with tonnage efficient Clan weapons.

The trick IMO is to run XL on the Highlander. Surviving in it is another matter.

[Vanguard836]

Stick to energy builds with the gargoyle, won't make it a miracle mech but it's usable. For the love of god do not use the stock loadout, it's plain horrible.

[Deathlike]

Vanguard836, on 14 March 2015 - 10:12 AM, said:

Stick to energy builds with the gargoyle, won't make it a miracle mech but it's usable. For the love of god do not use the stock loadout, it's plain horrible.

Yes, unleash the stock Gargoyle-Prime to the world! See the struggles of the Clan Mechs for all to see!!!

Wait until they release the Mist Lynx-Prime!

Oh wait... they did.

[Ultimax]

Deathlike, on 14 March 2015 - 10:11 AM, said:

The trick IMO is to run XL on the Highlander. Surviving in it is another matter.

It's not for me.

XLs are OK on big mechs when they can play at extended range or move really fast, but the only thing that ever made the HGN a sniper was JJs and PPCs.


If I can't take risks, and make aggressive plays, in an assault mech - then I'm simply not going to play it.


It's one thing on a VTR where you can go huge on the engine and compound that with being 80 tons for very high linear speed gains and mitigate some of the disadvantages of XL through sheer maneuverability and quite another when the highest you can really get to is 325 on a 90T mech for 64kph.

Edited by Ultimatum X, 14 March 2015 - 10:21 AM.

[Hit the Deck]

You need to play the Highlander like a suprise Assault/Atlas because they can't see you coming because you pack an XL. STD build is viable but I only do that on my 733C with the brawling build: ML, SRM6, and AC/20.

[Deathlike]

Ultimatum X, on 14 March 2015 - 10:20 AM, said:

It's not for me.

XLs are OK on big mechs when they can play at extended range or move really fast, but the only thing that ever made the HGN a sniper was JJs and PPCs.


If I can't take risks, and make aggressive plays, in an assault mech - then I'm simply not going to play it.


It's one thing on a VTR where you can go huge on the engine and compound that with being 80 tons for very high linear speed gains and mitigate some of the disadvantages of XL through sheer maneuverability and quite another when the highest you can really get to is 325 on a 90T mech for 64kph.

Back in the meta PPC-Gauss days where the Highlander didn't have the "scarlet quirks", it was pretty durable. Yes, it was used at longer ranges, but it wasn't that bad for brawling (though best with a Standard engine). XL engines on the older meta was actually very usable during that time.

Today... it's just a lost cause. I'll be experimenting, but I'm strictly grinding stuff for the event... so that's likely going to be on the backburner for a bit.